Jimmy Carter leaves his church over feminism

[Don_L]

Male priesthood and Jimmy Carter.

I just read where jimmy Carter has decided to pack it in and leave his church, because of its treatment of women. It’s really the “women as priests” issue all over again. This time it’s about Southern Baptists. Jimmy feels they’re not being Christian enough, I suppose.

Poor Jimmy is aroused to admonishment and righteous indignation over that which Christ did - have a male led Church.

Yet, this same man find no immorality worthy of leaving his political party, which openly and aggressively advocates for the slaughter of God’s innocents in the womb (and with it’s present leader, even slaughter outside of the womb, as a good thing.)

Jimmy finds little blame for his terrorist friends in their goal to eradicate the Jews.

Jimmy has no problem belonging to a party that advocates the homosexual contamination of the sacrament of marriage, instituted by Christ. no reason to leave his party over that.

Jimmy has no problem belonging to a party that advocates sin, in the very real sense that its policy is getting people to ENVY the successful with their “Soak the Rich” mantra.

I don’t recall him complaining when his party had it’s Surgeon General, Joyceyln Elders openly advocating to teach children to masturbate -a serious sin.

Jimmy won’t leave his party when it dares to attempt to destroy freedom of conscience by requiring Catholic Hospitals to perform abortions etc.

Jimmy, like so many of our fellow Democrat Catholic politicians and their voting enablers, lacks visible faith in God’s word, as handed down, but prefers to create his own idea of who and what God is, and what He commands us to do.

Sad, that there is a aura of religion about these sanctimonious types, who live comfortably with so much evil.

 

[Dale_M]

I just read where jimmy Carter has decided to pack it in and leave his church, because of its treatment of women. It’s really the “women as priests” issue all over again. This time it’s about Southern Baptists. Jimmy feels they’re not being Christian enough, I suppose.

Don, I think you are referring to an editorial which Carter recently wrote for the UK newspaper, The Guardian
guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2009/jul/12/jimmy-carter-womens-rights-equality

The essay discusses how religions often are just to justify oppression of women, and he mentions that he left the Southern Baptist Convention because of the strict interpretations they were now giving to the Bible regarding women.

But what the essay doesn’t mention is that he left the SBC in 2000, and had been considering it for 20 years before that. The Southern Baptist Convention used to have a fair number of moderate believers and clergy, but a concerted effort in the 1970s by conservatives drove them out in what they call the Conservative Resurgence.

At any rate, Carter didn’t recently leave the Southern Baptist Convention nor did he leave simply because of female ordination or feminism.

 

[redrosetea]

You forget Jimmy’s sister Ruth was a protestant pastor…Not sure what denomination

His mother Miss Lillian was always a woman that was outspoken and breaking new ground

I guess he is doing what he saw the women in his life do

I really don’t care one way or the other frankly…and I am not in favor of female priests…It is not my denomination so I will let them slug it out

I think Jimmy is a good man

 

[Don_L]

Here’s one article that Carter just made the announcement, so it is a new topic now.

msmagazine.com/news/uswirestory.asp?ID=11819

I wont judge his “goodness” (what’s in his heart) but we are required to admonish Christians for their un-Christian actions, (he may be another demonination - but is a proclaimed Christian) In view of his leadership in the party of abortion and its strong anti-Christian philosphy as I pointed out above.

I’d be curious as to why a Catholic thinks “he’s a good man.”

God, may have a different opinion. We need to pray for these people who dismiss traditional Christian values and hold them of less value than their secular political reasons.

 

[Dale_M]

Here’s one article that Carter just made the announcement, so it is a new topic now.

I suppose its a new topic since it is being reported as such, but Ms Magazine is in error. Carter publicly left the Southern Baptist Convention in 2000,:

“I had never been involved in the political struggle for control of the SBC and have no desire to do so,” Carter wrote in the letter, which was mailed to 75,000 Baptists nationwide by the moderate group Texas Baptists Committed. He said he was disappointed that his effort two years ago to promote dialogue between SBC factions failed. "My hope was that, as a traditional Baptist layman, I could find some channel through which I could help fulfill our Christian commitments.

“But since that brief interlude of apparent harmony, I have been disappointed and feel excluded by the adoption of policies and an increasingly rigid SBC creed, including some provisions that violate the basic premises of my Christian faith. I have finally decided that, after 65 years, I can no longer be associated with the Southern Baptist Convention.”

baptiststandard.com/2000/10_23/pages/carter.html

 

[Don_L]

I suppose its a new topic since it is being reported as such, but Ms Magazine is in error. Carter publicly left the Southern Baptist Convention in 2000,:

baptiststandard.com/2000/10_23/pages/carter.html

Dale: That certainly appears true. Apparently he’s just saying it again to get the attention he seeks on his view.

Interesting that he never chastises his friends in Hamas for keeping women submissive.
Reasonable folks might tend to call that hypocrisy.

 

[redrosetea]

Here’s one article that Carter just made the announcement, so it is a new topic now.

msmagazine.com/news/uswirestory.asp?ID=11819

I wont judge his “goodness” (what’s in his heart) but we are required to admonish Christians for their un-Christian actions, (he may be another demonination - but is a proclaimed Christian) In view of his leadership in the party of abortion and its strong anti-Christian philosphy as I pointed out above.

I’d be curious as to why a Catholic thinks “he’s a good man.”

God, may have a different opinion. We need to pray for these people who dismiss traditional Christian values and hold them of less value than their secular political reasons.

For goodness sake is a Catholic not allowed to admire another person of a diffeernt religion for their acts of goodness?

I think that is the most pompass statement I have read

He has worked for world peace and for the poor

He actually helps build homes for poor people …He gets his hand dirty as well as working to fund habitat for humanity

It speaks well for anyone that see Christ in the least among us

 

[Drawmack]

He actually helps build homes for poor people …He gets his hand dirty as well as working to fund habitat for humanity

I worked next to the man on a build about 10 years ago. I’ll tell you something, he was president before I can remember (I was born, but not old enough to remember) and that man outworked me on that house!

BTW: He also insisted that we call him Jimmy because “Mr. Carter and Mr. President are silly when addressing someone in overalls with a tool-belt on”.

 

[Dale_M]

Dale: That certainly appears true. Apparently he’s just saying it again to get the attention he seeks on his view. .

But he didn’t say it again. This is a case of the press misreporting the news.

What Carter wrote in his editorial was:
“So my decision to sever my ties with the Southern Baptist Convention, after six decades, was painful and difficult. It was, however, an unavoidable decision”

Note he used the past tense “was” and not the present tense “is”. He is clearly talking about a past decision, not a current one.

 

[JReducation]

I realize that I’m coming to this discussion late. But I do not see the problem with what Mr. Carter is saying. There may be a subliminal support for abortion, if that’s what some people are thinking. However, it’s not explicit in his statement.

His statement that women have a role to play in society and in faith is consistent with the faith and practice of the Catholic Church for centuries. We have had women in powerful positions since the birth of monasticism. Abbesses were and continue to be as authoritative as bishops over their territory and communities. Women religious onf Pontifical Right may not be tampered with by the bishops or the laity. They respond only to the Holy See.

We have been leaders in the education of women. Some of the first and finest educators in the modern world were our own Catholic women. Some of our finest scholars in many fields of science and arts, have been our nuns and sisters.

Today, the Vatican employs women theologians, canon lawyers, economists, scientists, and other professionals.

Someone mentioned Hamas (sp?). Well the fact is that the Catholic Church does comment on the Muslim customs regarding women, either. It has been the position of the Church and continues to be that missionary activity not interfere with local culture in such matters where the individuals are willing participants, unless the matter is morally wrong.

It is morally wrong to oppress a person. There is no doubt about that. However, when a person of a particular faith surrenders to a system of life and relations between the sexes, that is not the same as oppression. This is not to say that such a religious system cannot lend itself to oppression. Our own Catholic system has often been used to oppress women and other groups.

This begs the question. Is Mr. Carter a good man? By our Catholic standars, yes. Does he hold beliefs that are in conflict with the Catholic faith? Yes. Does that make a person a bad man? Not according to the teachings of the Church. People can be in error and be good. There is a difference between the person and the concept. The concept is bad, the person is good. That’s why we Catholics are taught never to judge individual’s.

We can only judge objectively observable behaviors and our judgment has to remain objective. We can never make subjective judgments. Only confessors and spiritual directors can do that.

I hope this helps.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF

 

[Don_L]

I
We have been leaders in the education of women. Some of the first and finest educators in the modern world were our own Catholic women. Some of our finest scholars in many fields of science and arts, have been our nuns and sisters.

Today, the Vatican employs women theologians, canon lawyers, economists, scientists, and other professionals.

We can only judge objectively observable behaviors and our judgment has to remain objective. We can never make subjective judgments. Only confessors and spiritual directors can do that.

I hope this helps.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF

We have a lot of apples and oranges mixed up here. No one is speaking of the Catholic Church abusing women. This is, after all, the Church that has elevated a humble woman, to become Queen of Heaven, and has sanctified myriads of woman as having met perfection.

I raised the question of Jimmy leaving his church because of secular-feminist issues (even Baptists don’t flog their females that I know of) which is all well and good, but I then asked about his failure to hold his political party -the party that aggressively supports the “Culture of Death” and other non-Christian things:envy, support of sexual depravity, replacing the state with the family, votes for a president that supports infanticide, etc. to the same standards, in as much as those are far more serious “sins.”
(This is not to say other political parties are perfect, just not as openly supportive of so much evil.)

I haven’t condemned him; I don’t have that authority, nor do I know what’s in his heart -just his words and actions. I merely point out after discernment that there is hypocrisy in such a position.

I think the question of objective vs. subjective discernment (a social/science construct) is open to interpretive disagreement. In this day of relative morality, I’m far more comfortable with the word the Church uses - truth - truthful in a well formed conscience - I suspect it’s near impossible to be completely objective. JPII told us to call black, black, and white, white, however. St Paul reminded us to admonish our fellow Christians when they chose black, and Christ reminded us that he didn’t come to bring peace.

As far as Carter doing good, I think that’s marvelous, but like all good Christians, (remember that hand-picked disciple Judas) we fail at perfection (confession anyone?) and our good acts don’t excuse our sins.

 

[Charle_One]

Don L you nailed it!