Jinns: Muhammad's Myths and Superstition mixed with Christianity and Judaism

[hlgomez]

The Noble Qur’an - Al-Hijr 15:26-42

1. And indeed, We created man from sounding clay of altered black smooth mud.
2. And the jinn, We created aforetime from the smokeless flame of fire.
3. And (remember) when your Lord said to the angels: "I am going to create a man (Adam) from sounding clay of altered black smooth mud.
4. “So, when I have fashioned him completely and breathed into him (Adam) the soul which I created for him, then fall (you) down prostrating yourselves unto him.”
5. So, the angels prostrated themselves, all of them together. (I thought God ordered not to bow down to anyone?)
6. Except Iblîs (Satan), - he refused to be among the prostrators.
7. (Allâh) said: “O Iblîs (Satan)! What is your reason for not being among the prostrators?”
8. [Iblîs (Satan)] said: “I am not the one to prostrate myself to a human being, whom You created from sounding clay of altered black smooth mud.”
9. (Allâh) said: “Then, get out from here, for verily, you are Rajîm (an outcast or a cursed one).” [Tafsîr At-Tabarî]
10. “And verily, the curse shall be upon you till the Day of Recompense (i.e. the Day of Resurrection).”
11. [Iblîs (Satan)] said: “O my Lord! Give me then respite till the Day they (the dead) will be resurrected.”
12. Allâh said: "Then, verily, you are of those reprieved,
13. “Till the Day of the time appointed.”
14. [Iblîs (Satan)] said: "O my Lord! Because you misled me, (so God misled Satan???) I shall indeed adorn the path of error for them (mankind) on the earth, and I shall mislead them all.

The Noble Qur’an - An-Naml 27:17-19

1. And there were gathered before Sulaimân (Solomon) his hosts of jinns and men, and birds, and they all were set in battle order (marching forwards).
2. Till, when they came to the valley of the ants, one of the ants said: “O ants! Enter your dwellings, lest Sulaimân (Solomon) and his hosts crush you, while they perceive not.” (nice fictions, Muhammad).

The Noble Qur’an - Ar-Rahmaan 55:56
Wherein both will be those (maidens) restraining their glances upon their husbands, whom no man or jinn yatmithhunna (has opened their hymens with sexual intercourse) before them. (so pure spirits can have sexual intercourse with humans??? I wonder what kind of a being it would be born?)

Hadith - Sunan of Abu Dawood, Narrated Abu Sa’id al-Khudri
Muhammad ibn AbuYahya said that his father told that he and his companion went to AbuSa’id al-Khudri to pay a sick visit to him. He said: Then we came out from him and met a companion of ours who wanted to go to him. We went ahead and sat in the mosque. He then came back and told us that he heard AbuSa’id al-Khudri say: The Apostle of Allah said: Some snakes are jinn; so when anyone sees one of them in his house, he should give it a warning three times. If it return (after that), he should kill it, for it is a devil. (nice superstition)

Hadith - Ahmad, an-Nasa’i, Dawud, al-Hakim and al-Baihaqi
Qatadah related from 'Abdullah ibn Sarjas who said, “The Messenger of Allah forbade urination into a hole.” Said Qatadah, “What is disliked about urinating into a hole?” Said he, “It is the residence of the jinn.” [Ibn Khuzaimah and Ibn as-Sakin classified it as sahih] (another superstition)

**Clearly, Muhammad’s recitations are based on myths, superstition and mixed it up with Judaism and Christian doctrines about angels. A very good tactic of the devil to hide his real identity. **

Pio

 

[Ghosty]

(so pure spirits can have sexual intercourse with humans??? I wonder what kind of a being it would be born?)

Nephilim. They are briefly described in Genesis, and heavily detailed in the Book of Enoch. They are a part of Jewish Scriptural tradition.

 

[hlgomez]

Nephilim. They are briefly described in Genesis, and heavily detailed in the Book of Enoch. They are a part of Jewish Scriptural tradition.

Ghosty,

This is an interpretation that is not part of Catholic doctrine. The “sons of God” that is described in Genesis are not spirits, but righteous people–human beings, while the “sons of men” are the bad descendants. How can you say a spirit can have sexual relations with humans? Are you saying the descendants of Adam and Eve have become part human and part angel?

Angels are not the same as human beings. They don’t pro-create, and will never have the ability to do it, much less to “cross breed” with human beings. This is the most strangest thing I’ve ever heard.

Pio

 

[Ghosty]

hlgomez: There is no Catholic doctrine regarding the interpretation of that passage either way. Your idea is most certainly not a part of Catholic teaching either. My point is that the traditional Jewish interpretation is that these spirits did indeed mate with humans and produced Nephilim. That has always been the Jewish understanding, and was apparently the understanding (non-doctrinal) of the Apostles since they quoted Enoch in a number of places.

My point is that this is NOT a pagan superstition of Mohammed, but rather a very pious belief from Judaism and Christianity. The Church has never ruled, to my knowledge, that this belief is contrary to the Truth. It has never spoken officially on the matter.

 

[Eetaq]

Pwn’d. With a P.

 

[hlgomez]

My point is that this is NOT a pagan superstition of Mohammed, but rather a very pious belief from Judaism and Christianity. The Church has never ruled, to my knowledge, that this belief is contrary to the Truth. It has never spoken officially on the matter.

Ghosty,

If you can show me that the church never ruled that this matter is “contrary to the truth” and that this is a pious views of Christians (???), please show me some documents that supports your erroneous views. I suppose you are only basing your views based on your personal opinion, right? Or support it with documents from at least the early Christian writers or fathers of the church.

Further, so are you saying that some of us human beings are fathered by angels?

And can you say that angels whether good or bad can make babies from human beings?

Pio

Eetaq,

You are being childish.

 

[Ghosty]

If you can show me that the church never ruled that this matter is “contrary to the truth” and that this is a pious views of Christians (???), please show me some documents that supports your erroneous views.

Show you that something never happened? Just how would never be documented? While I’m doing that, you show me documentation that shows that the Earth was *never *a part of a federation of planets On the contrary, you have to show that it *was *ruled to be contrary to faith. Good luck with that.

Further, so are you saying that some of us human beings are fathered by angels?

Nope, only Nephilim, who are described as very abnormal giants with a whole host of evil inclinations. The Flood was supposed to take care of them. What’s more, I don’t know that this is what actually occured. I didn’t say I believe it one way or another, only that it comes from Jewish tradition, and the work in question was quoted a number of times by the Apostles.

And can you say that angels whether good or bad can make babies from human beings?

No, I can’t say that either way. I only “know” that according to Jewish and early Christian tradition (not Sacred Tradition), some spiritual beings fathered the Nephilim with human mothers. These spiritual beings were definately of the bad sort, or “became” bad by fathering the Nephilim, as they were punished by being “locked away in darkness” as described in 2 Peter.

Eetaq: Just because I disagree with him on one minor point doesn’t mean Islam is off the hook in any way. The other issues still stand as far as I can see. I wouldn’t celebrate yet.

 

[hlgomez]

Again Ghosty, these are your own interpretations which you may have gotten from a source like what you said to be coming from “early christian writers”. But you should also remember that the early christian writers doesn’t have the teaching authority, such that some of them eventually became heretics, like Origen and Tertullian. That’s why these heretic early Christian writers cannot be distiguished as belonging to orthodox Church Fathers, although some of their writings on theology have greatly contributed to the doctrinal development of certain teachings of the Catholic Church. The Church is tasked to separate the wheat from the chaff, and that’s exactly what it did to those writings of heretics like Tertullian. That’s most probably why the Church doesn’t recognize them as saints like the rest of the early Church Fathers.

Now, there is no doubt that based on some beliefs of early Christians about the above topic we’re discussing, that Muhammad’s dictations were based on their heretical theology. Not to mention the early heretics such as Arius who denied the Trinity. There may be a case where there were remnants of these so called heretics who went to the extreme and developed a notion that Jesus didn’t suffer thru crucifixion.

Pio

 

[BrJimC]

hlgomez:

Again Ghosty, these are your own interpretations which you may have gotten from a source like what you said to be coming from “early christian writers”. But you should also remember that the early christian writers doesn’t have the teaching authority, such that some of them eventually became heretics, like Origen and Tertullian. That’s why these heretic early Christian writers cannot be distiguished as belonging to orthodox Church Fathers, although some of their writings on theology have greatly contributed to the doctrinal development of certain teachings of the Catholic Church. The Church is tasked to separate the wheat from the chaff, and that’s exactly what it did to those writings of heretics like Tertullian. That’s most probably why the Church doesn’t recognize them as saints like the rest of the early Church Fathers.

Now, there is no doubt that based on some beliefs of early Christians about the above topic we’re discussing, that Muhammad’s dictations were based on their heretical theology. Not to mention the early heretics such as Arius who denied the Trinity. There may be a case where there were remnants of these so called heretics who went to the extreme and developed a notion that Jesus didn’t suffer thru crucifixion.

Pio

Well since the Qur’anic verses are the subject of this text… God revealed the Qur’an through the Angel Gabriel, the same Angel that came to the Virgin Mary and the father of John the Baptist (Peace be upon them), these are the verses of God and not Muhammad… so Muhammad did not get the concept of Jinns from anyone… God revealed that the Jinns are real and a creation of Allah. Satan is a Jinn.

BrJimC

 

[Ghosty]

hlgomez: The point is that these things have never been ruled as heretical. Prove that they have been.