great, so could we please have some actual citations of what he DOES say? in 3 pages other than a remembered report of a comment on one show, not one poster has cited any actual writings or speeches with content of his message. what are we discussing?
“You may make some mistakes-but that doesn’t make you a sinner. You’ve got the very nature of God on the inside of you.”
i have listened to many of his sermons and read some of his books and he does say those things, just not in the words you use. the way to tell this is how do his congregants hear what he is saying? what are they walking away with? in interview after interview, they say they expect a financial windfall if they follow joel’s teachings. they are getting it from somewhere.
Not to come off as nitpicking because I broadly agree with you, but he did go to college. He didn’t study theology or philosophy; his major was broadcast media if I am not mistaken. He didn’t graduate, though.
wow… I’d say he’s very good at that.
sorry, you are right. i meant to say he had only completed his high school education.
Not yet… but I hope he becomes Catholic soon!Is he Catholic now?
Be careful, you just might get what you wish for!
Because he is teaching the Gospel to people with absolutely no education in theology, philosophy or divinity. He’s simply telling people what they want to hear. I have no problem with motivational speaker types and I’m sure he thinks he’s doing the right thing. But he is seriously misguided and he is leading a lot of other people astray, too.
Do you have education in theology? Do you simply get yours from some other man? Could we not say the same for you? Also, it is really unfair to ASSUME that about his congregation. Again, another reason that arguements continue between Cath.'s and Prot.'s.
I’m not teaching the Bible or preaching the gospel. I am, in fact, in the process of getting my master’s in studio art so I can teach art on the university level. So yes, I am in the process in obtaining an advanced degree so that I can teach others.
Do you REALLY think that the Prosperity Gospel is what Jesus actually taught? Do you? What evidence do you have for that?
I’m not teaching the Bible or preaching the gospel; however I’ve taken classes in philosophy so I’m probably farther along than Osteen on that topic. I am, in fact, in the process of getting my master’s in studio art so I can teach art on the university level. So yes, I am in the process in obtaining an advanced degree so that I can teach others.
Do you REALLY think that the Prosperity Gospel is what Jesus actually taught? If so, what evidence do you have for that?
Prosperity as in get rich quick, no. Osteen preaches about life more abundant, which is what Christ taught about. He does not preach you can whatever you want; he teaches that we should take God at His word and see how that can change our inner lives, which will manifest itself on the outside.
And I think that is not what Jesus taught, nor is it what He meant to teach. Our level of faith and whether we say it out loud does not guarantee a life full of happiness and abundance.
There’s a serious level of crossover, yes. You can’t understand one without the other.
Common knowledge? He doesn’t hide it, although I note he doesn’t put it on his website bio, either.
Nice attempt to put words in my mouth there, but sorry - intelligence and level of education have nothing to do with each other. Joel Osteen is clearly a very bright man. He would have done himself and his followers a lot of favors had he taken a few classes in philosophy, Biblical history, and theology.Thanks for the warning. I’ll keep it in mind. In the meantime, I’ll ask you to keep in mind whether Jesus really meant His words to be interpreted any which way, at any time, depending on how the wind blows. I personally think the approach of Osteen and others is akin to reading Act 1 of “As You Like It”, Act 3 of “Twelfth Night”, and Act 3 of “Troilus and Cressida” and then presenting oneself as a Shakespearian scholar.
“Saying it our loud” is not the point. Reminding ourselves that God is faithful by basing it on His word is what helps us to live a life full of abundance (not filled with material things but with “things” like faith, hope, and love), and that is what Jesus taught. He made it clear that He came to give us life more abundant, i.e, more than just the mundane, avergae life dictated to us by people like the Pharisees. That is not interpretting His word “any which way”. That is actually reading it and living it for what it is, which is what Osteen teaches.And I think that is not what Jesus taught, nor is it what He meant to teach. Our level of faith and whether we say it out loud does not guarantee a life full of happiness and abundance.
There’s a serious level of crossover, yes. You can’t understand one without the other.
Common knowledge? He doesn’t hide it, although I note he doesn’t put it on his website bio, either.
Thanks for the warning. I’ll keep it in mind. In the meantime, I’ll ask you to keep in mind whether Jesus really meant His words to be interpreted any which way, at any time, depending on how the wind blows. I personally think the approach of Osteen and others is akin to reading Act 1 of “As You Like It”, Act 3 of “Twelfth Night”, and Act 3 of “Troilus and Cressida” and then presenting oneself as a Shakespearian scholar.
With respect, this is exactly the sort of idea that Catholics and many other Christians find worrisome. The notion that his success is a blessing (I am not sure that is what you meant to imply, but that is certainly what has come across). Yes, maybe God has blessed him that way, but maybe his success is a snare for those week in faith. If you think that God’s favor is shown through blessings in this life, then you are set up to loose your faith when those blessings don’t come your way… or when they disappear.
Now, before I say more, I don’t think Rev. Osteen is demonic. That being said, if he was, do you think he would look demonic? He could be Satan himself, but he would come offering a package that was very appealing to many people and would probably have a big smile.
The problem is that people are not really looking for spiritual food, they are looking for spiritual validation; the two are not the same thing. No one can feed your spiritual needs except Jesus. Going to church and paying tithes does not make one a Christian; saying one is a Christian doesn’t make one a Christian. Embracing the Gospel Message is what makes you a Christian; the problem is sacrifice and suffering are part of that message and it is one that Rev. Osteen doesn’t teach.
With respect, our first responsibility is to the truth. We were asked our opinion of Rev. Osteen’s theology, and now we are being attacked because we gave it.