John Hagee= Extreme Anti- Catholic

[BrewMax]

You dodged my question.
How does it diminish the Divinity of the Church established by Jesus Christ?

It proves that the Divinity you speak of does not exist in the ways you believe it does.

 

[dosdog]

It proves that the Divinity you speak of does not exist in the ways you believe it does.

Thanks for your uninformed opinion got any documented proof?

 

[Lampo]

It proves that the Divinity you speak of does not exist in the ways you believe it does.

Incorrect. All it proves (assuming the article is true) is that humans in the Church founded by Jesus Christ can make mistakes and are sinners. God knew this when he founded it on the Apostles. It doesn’t take away the fact that the Church has the promise to be protected by the Holy Spirit.

 

[BrewMax]

Thanks for your uninformed opinion got any documented proof?

Prove how the church is divine.

 

[BrewMax]

Jesus spoke in Scripture how individuals can share into God’s divinity, but it never speaks of how the church is divine or an institution for that matter. This is only the Catholic church claiming this for itself.

 

[Lampo]

Jesus spoke in Scripture how individuals can share into God’s divinity, but it never speaks of how the church is divine or an institution for that matter. This is only the Catholic church claiming this for itself.

I’ll get back with you on this.

 

[dosdog]

Jesus spoke in Scripture how individuals can share into God’s divinity, but it never speaks of how the church is divine or an institution for that matter. This is only the Catholic church claiming this for itself.

Thanks for your uninformed opinion got any documented proof?

Matthew 16 18 And I say to thee: That thou art Peter; and upon this rock I will build my church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.
Matthew 18 17 And if he will not hear them: tell the church. And if he will not hear the church, let him be to thee as the heathen and publican.
Ephesians 310 That the manifold wisdom of God may be made known to the principalities and powers in heavenly places through the church,
Ephesians 321 To him be glory in the church, and in Christ Jesus unto all generations, world without end. Amen.
Acts Of Apostles 20 28 Take heed to yourselves, and to the whole flock, wherein the Holy Ghost hath placed you bishops, to rule the church of God, which he hath purchased with his own blood
HEBREWS 13 17 Obey your prelates and be subject to them. For they watch as being to render an account of your souls: that they may do this with joy and not with grief. For this is not expedient for you.

 

[ThomasLB]

For some people, rage is a drug. “Righteous Indignation” gives them a shot of adrenaline and self-esteem, just like a junkie getting his fix.

I like this quote by Swami Vivekananda: “The first sign that you are becoming religious is that you are becoming cheerful. When a man is gloomy, that may be dyspepsia, but it is not religion.”

 

[heisenburg]

Brew… while you have taken the subject completely off topic, I have a simple request…

You seem to think that if people sin within the Catholic Church, that it means the Church itself cannot claim to be divinely guided.

The protection promised is actually very limited… but it is important.

That there will never be a single Public teaching, fully endorsed by the Catholic Church, on the issue of Faith and Morals that contradicts Christ.

Though this is an amazingly over simplified statement, it does encompass the core idea of what we mean when we say we are Protected from Error…

People Sin… anyone that claims they do not sin is a liar. (per the bible) There is actually a nice list of Bad Popes that had bad theologies, but for some reason, were never able to actually publicly teach them. Something always got in the way, even death.

However, that being said. if you TRULY do believe that the Catholic Church has to remain completely sin free at all levels in order to claim it is protected by the Holy Spirit, all I ask for is ONE official church document that claims this. It is a simple request. You make the accusation, all I ask for is proof.

If you cannot provide a single document, perhaps you should reconsider what you believe on the issue of whether or not people in the church can sin…

In Christ

 

[ApostateRLDS]

I saw a video that showed actual footage of the pope and Hitler embracing and conversing. I am not sure which pope it was at the time though

.

It was Pius XII, and so what? They were both heads of state at the time and that’s what heads of state do

The video also showed where Hitler was very obsessed with Catholic doctrine and practice in his younger years.

Hitler was brought up Catholic but became anti-Catholic in his later years He later became obsessed with German paganism and intended to crush the Catholic Church.

I also read where the Catholic church hid Nazi war criminals in South America during the Neuinberg trials.

Don’t know anything about that. Would you mind providing the source to which you are referring?

What has really bothered me over the years though is how the Vatican remained neutral during WW2 but yet knew of the horrible genocide happening at the hands of a crazed power obsessed animal. While Jews were being starved to death in concentration camps and burned to death in horrific ovens, the Catholic church stood by and did nothing. Is this what Jesus preached and taught?

Stand by and did nothing?! Hardly. Whether you want to believe it or not, other than when the Allies invaded Europe, the Church did more than anyone to save and protect the Jews from the Holocaust. Pius XII himself is credited with saving 700,000 Jews. The Chief Rabbi of Rome was so grateful that he converted to Christianity after the war and adopted the name of Pius for his baptismal name.

 

[Marc1152]

Prove how the church is divine.

But it’s ability to produce Saints.

Questions?

 

[Lampo]

Originally Posted by BrewMax View Post
Jesus spoke in Scripture how individuals can share into God’s divinity, but it never speaks of how the church is divine or an institution for that matter. This is only the Catholic church claiming this for itself.

I’ll get back with you on this.

I said that I would get back with you on why the Church is divine. It appears I don’t have anything to add to what was said by other posters regarding your question.

 

[Marc1152]

Originally Posted by BrewMax View Post
Jesus spoke in Scripture how individuals can share into God’s divinity, but it never speaks of how the church is divine or an institution for that matter. This is only the Catholic church claiming this for itself. <<

Then why did the Apostles organize themselves into the Church? They appointed Bishops and Priests, most of whom were part of the seventy closest followers… What did they understand that you dont ?

 

[mark_a]

I just watched Hagee and he made the following statements

No difference between Catholics and Muslims in terms of killing Jews

Crusades were about killing Jews by Catholics

Hitler and The Catholic Church were one

Catholic Church stole money from Jews

Please watch this program today, its on many different channels and should repeat tomorrow, this is classic bad history in regards to the Catholic Church.

So the question, as always, is even if the Catholic Church is exactly what he says it is, how does this make his flavor of Christianity THE right one?

 

[BrewMax]

Originally Posted by BrewMax View Post
Jesus spoke in Scripture how individuals can share into God’s divinity, but it never speaks of how the church is divine or an institution for that matter. This is only the Catholic church claiming this for itself. <<

Then why did the Apostles organize themselves into the Church? They appointed Bishops and Priests, most of whom were part of the seventy closest followers… What did they understand that you dont ?

are you trying to assert that this proves divinity?

 

[BrewMax]

But it’s ability to produce Saints.

Questions?

Does the Catholic church really produce saints?

 

[allofgrace]

Originally Posted by BrewMax View Post
Jesus spoke in Scripture how individuals can share into God’s divinity, but it never speaks of how the church is divine or an institution for that matter. This is only the Catholic church claiming this for itself. <<

Then why did the Apostles organize themselves into the Church? They appointed Bishops and Priests, most of whom were part of the seventy closest followers… What did they understand that you dont ?

Cast not your pearls before swine for they trample them underfoot and turn and rend you. In other words, “trying to teach pigs to sing wastes your time and annoys the pig.”

When you have warned a contentious man then turn away from him and consider him as a publican …

You don’t really want to know the truth, you only want to be contentious; if you wanted to know the truth of the matter it is no secret.

 

[allofgrace]

My point here is that Protestant churches consist of humans that make poor decisions as well, but they don’t get this same courtesy here. Why not?

Nonsense; they get the courtesy of being called “churches” and list themselves as such in the telephone book. As a Protestant I could have chosen any brand of gospel or just hopped from “church” to “church” and never had anyone persecute me for it. When I became Catholic it has never stopped. I had a man call me a few weeks ago and talk terrible to me telling
me that I needed to come out of the Catholic Church. He then proceeded to send me drivel about the Catholic Church that was so far-fetched that it was pathetic. Two weeks later he sent me some more.

He teaches this drivel in his SS class at a local Church of the Nazarene. I sent the info he sent me to his District Superintendent who told me that this man was a “loose canon” and yet this 70 year old man has been allowed to teach a SS class for many years in that denomination. He teaches his people to take Catholics out of the Catholic Church yet when I questioned him, he knows absolutely nothing of the origins of Protestant doctrine.

I compared him to John Hagee, Tim LaHaye and some of his heroes and he wrote in his letter to me, “WOW!” “WOW!” “WHat an honor!” Believe me it was not meant as an honor.

 

[GregoryPalamas]

Just a correction: An earlier poster observed that the Inquisition began in the sixteenth century with Ferdinand and Isabella. This is not correct. This was a correction of a Protestant claim that it was begun by Emperor (Pope) Charles some years later. This of course is not correct either.

The Inquisition was begun by Pope Innocent III and confirmed by the fourth Lateran Council in 1215. Pope Innocent III commissioned St. Dominic Guzman and St. Francis of Assisi to head this great effort.

Now back to that silly man John Hagee.

CDL

 

[allofgrace]

Just a correction: An earlier poster observed that the Inquisition began in the sixteenth century with Ferdinand and Isabella. This is not correct. This was a correction of a Protestant claim that it was begun by Emperor (Pope) Charles some years later. This of course is not correct either.

The Inquisition was begun by Pope Innocent III and confirmed by the fourth Lateran Council in 1215. Pope Innocent III commissioned St. Dominic Guzman and St. Francis of Assisi to head this great effort.

Now back to that silly man John Hagee.

CDL

The Spanish Inquisition was started in the late 1400s by Ferdinand and Isabella, “the most Catholic monarchs” with the permission of the Pope of that day.