Joseph Smith and the Need for the Restoration

[why_me]

I just went over quite a few of “theCourts” and “whyme’s” posts…I would have to say you’re right. I saw this was mentioned yesterday as well.
I find it Creepy. Either way though I find pretty useless to engage either in a discussion, neither have a firm grasp as to what they…he/she…uh…whoever claims to believe. They are here just to arouse contention.
Like the saying goes, “you can fool some people sometimes, but you can’t fool all the people all the time.” Ironic you could say that about Mormonism as well.

I am not court. But he or she is okay. I have no problem with him or her. Obviously you have been fooled if you believe that court and I are the same people.

Mormonism is powerful because of its early beginnings. There are at least 11 people who testified that they saw the book of mormon. And they never denied what they saw. That is quite powerful. And lets be honest Kdesiel, anyone who challenges your claims, would be accused of sowing contention with you. For example, your last sentence which is a dig at the lds church. Since you believe that court and I are the same people, it was pretty easy to fool you into such a blelief.

 

[why_me]

Haha I think there should be a thread dedicated to helping theCourt/why me get through his identity crisis.

theCourt/why me, we love you, just um, not sure what you stand for, and see more contention aroused by your posts than understanding and edification. Read through the Bible, The Book of Mormon and Doctrine and Covenants, and the catechism and whatever else suits your fancy, but please, study hard. Education and learning is a noble thing to seek after.

I am not thecourt. You see, mrparker, this world is made up of many different kinds of people who are working their way through life. That is just the way it is. If someone does not fit into your framework, it doesn’t mean that you have any right to deny them their rights to expression. My posts arouse contention because earlier I claimed to be both catholic and mormon. This aroused scorn and mocking among the socalled catholics on this forum. The mormons did not care at all. Likewise on the Mormon apologetic forum. No one cared. But here, the Inquisitors went into full swing mocking and bashing me.

They just can not accept such an idea. However, let me say this: your attitude is definitely not mormon in your above post. And let me be simple: Christ would be the first one to condemn the educated religious as he did in the new testament. He exhorts us all to be like children and be simple. I like that. And it is also the little way of saint therese. I like that too.

 

[why_me]

as i was saying…identical. we do show love to our Mormon posters, as they do To us also. you could show a little truth… that would be a start.

Lets hope so. If I see some unlove, I will let you know! It is true, that some of the more antimormon posers have been banned.

 

[why_me]

doubtful. and im not the only one to notice the identical writing styles. lol! nice try tho.

Really? My writing style is the same as thecourt. My gosh…I don’t think so. Can you show me a good comparison please? I would appreciate it. People are judging thecourt in a harsh way that is for sure. But some are showing him or her understanding and that is a good thing. But identitical writing styles…now way… Also, catholic answers can check from where we are posting from. Trust me he or she is no where near me.

 

[why_me]

Now to get back on topic. Was there a need for a restoration? Maybe so. It would depend just how corrupt the christian churches were at that time. And for that we would need to look at the history of the christian churches. Now of course not all was well with christianity at the time of JS. There were problems and divisions and also corruption. But would this be enough for a restoration? Martin Luther saw a need for a reformation. Why? Were his concerns real or false? Certainly he developed quite a following and that would convey that all were not happy with the catholic church at that time. And many people felt that change was justified.

Now then of course, after the reformation was their a need for a restoration. Well, after looking at all the protestant splinter groups that were claiming the mantle of Jesus Christ and the divisions that the christian churches had for one another, maybe so.

America was settled by many people who wanted to freely practice their faith because in Europe it was difficult to do so. There was a lot of corruption and intrigue in Europe among the religious faiths. But was there a need for a restoration?

 

[why_me]

Christians were persecuted, and killed by the Roman Empire for years. Nero, Diocletian, and so on. I don’t think that the disagreements we are discussing here rise to that level.

But here is the difference! Mormons were persecuted by other christians. Many in the mobs were believers in Christ. They certainly were not known to be atheists. Now let me ask you: how can a good christians persecute other christians or even non-believers?

 

[why_me]

Hello why me. You are saying that atheism is the clear path and St. Therese was confused by Catholicism. You understand, this is complete backwards to what it is she is telling you?

Her Faith was in God, and for God. She trusted in God to get her through her struggles. Not nice feelings, but really, truly, the knowledge that God was calling to her and did not give up on her. She struggled through it and did not give into the darkness of atheism.

Actually she went through quite a struggle with atheism. And yes, she did feel tempted by it and she did struggle with it, especially during her trials with TB. She had what saint john of the cross called the dark night of the soul. And yes, she was also confused by her temptations with atheism. But she would not have had this confusion if she were not religious. But she kept her faith and her prayers were answered when she saw god on her deathbed right before she died.

France when she was growing up was very atheistic and secular. And the atheists had a lot of sway and many were led away from the church. It did affect her too to see faithful people seccumb to atheism.

 

[why_me]

whyme had a claim for a while that he was both, Catholic and Mormon. He is more of an agnostic, who sadly becomes more atheistic with every post.

I had to change my claim to happy go lucky because of pressure from the Purists. Happy Go Lucky was the title of an interesting british film a couple of years ago about a woman who was happy go lucky. But too happy go lucky in my opinion.

I would say that I am more of a questioner which is why I never take too seriously the negatives that can be presented about catholicism or mormonism. It doesn’t affect my understanding of god.

For me, being a christian is not necessarily about what doctrine is correct and what doctrine is wrong. It is more about faith and doing little things to make the world or people more loving toward one another. Thus, I like the Little Way of Saint Therese.

 

[Ceil-1]

Martin Luther was not authorized to start another church. Joseph Smith was not authorized to start another church.

Eleven people can be fooled. The devil comes as an angel of light, as you keep reminding us. The devil will seek to separate us from the Church God created for us. This is the very thing used to discern spirits and visions. JS should have known, but probably was not well-formed in the Christian faith.

His church hijacked some ideas from the original, not unlike Islam. Your argument makes sense only from the standpoint that it is yet another false church, prophesied about, and with all the hallmarks thereof.

Good Lord, only the devil could put himself on par as a brother of Jesus. If that isn’t quintessential satan, I don’t know what is. And, the fact that the likes of you guys becoming gods of your own planets? Hello!? No offense, I am sure you are great human beings. But, only satan could come up with a cockamamy, arrogant, in-your-face-God, idea like that.

I think JS may have been well meaning. But, he was duped.

 

[why_me]

Good Lord, only the devil could put himself on par as a brother of Jesus. If that isn’t quintessential satan, I don’t know what is. And, the fact that the likes of you guys becoming gods of your own planets? Hello!? No offense, I am sure you are great human beings. But, only satan could come up with a cockamamy, arrogant, in-your-face-God, idea like that.

I think JS may have been well meaning. But, he was duped.

There is a problem with your conclusion. The lds church does not lead people away from Christ. But just the opposite. It encourages people to do good works, keep the body holy and obey the commandments of god. It certainly does not lead people away from god.

I am not sure just where the devil would come into that picture. It seems that the lds church does the opposite of what the devil would like us do: use our bodies as an amusement park, disobey the commandments and lead us away from god.

 

[Ceil-1]

Yes, well, he used half-truths with Eve, too. I’m pretty sure she would have rejected his
arguments had he not been so sly about it. He went after her appetite, and one weakness… the possibility of "having it all ", if only one just posseses the right knowledge.

Even a cursory familiarity with the LDS faith shows a parallel there.

Jesus is the Second Person of the Trinity. He desires, and deserves to be worshippped as such. Any religious system that leads one astray from that truth is to be rejected.

Abstinence from coffee, alcohol, and a life of chastity and love of family are all good things. But if one does not believe on the Lord, Jesus, and have Sanctifying Grace through Him, and Him alone, it is all in vain. He even said as much. Everything must flow from a knowledge and acceptance of Jesus Christ as He said He was, and in obedience to His commands, docility to His Will.

It is so easy to be led astray. Check out the OT, and God’s insistence on total obedience, even when one doesn’t understand why.

 

[Bill_Pick]

Are you saying Court is a Cathloic and a Mormon ,you can not be both

His profile said Mormon,and he knows very little of the CC

 

[Bill_Pick]

I am afraid that court and I have different writing styles. It can be checked quite easily by catholic answers if we are the same people. I am certain that he lives in a different place from me.

I,m a littler confused did court change your name to what

 

[LAMBOFGODGIRLY]

Marie5890 I should stop posting on the forums with the false recycled garbage you folks continue to spread? I have a conviction of the truth of my church. It is not going to be chipped away by these “seeds” that you believe will have a impact on me.

Did you know that “Your True Church” believes in abortion? Just curious because most LDS do not realize that.

 

[crazzeto]

So at what point did this so-called “Apostacy” which “closed heaven” for ~1,800 years occur. I’ll need a specific date and reason.

 

[benidict]

Did you know that “Your True Church” believes in abortion? Just curious because most LDS do not realize that.

good morning lambofgodgirly. could you plz give us a source for this claim. not saying you are wrong. i just have never heard this before. but ive been wrong before with the sda. i thought they were prolife too. and apparently they are not. thank you. God bless you and yours.

 

[Marie5890]

good morning lambofgodgirly. could you plz give us a source for this claim. not saying you are wrong. i just have never heard this before. but ive been wrong before with the sda. i thought they were prolife too. and apparently they are not. thank you. God bless you and yours.

I think what they are referring too is that the LDS church is not oppose to some abortions in very limited circumstances.

I will guess it has to do with things like life of mother in danger or incest. That sort of thing.

Only a guess on my part.

 

[LAMBOFGODGIRLY]

More for Teach CCD:

God allows imperfect people to do whatever they choose to do. That does not make God imperfect. It means He allows imperfections and is still able to do His perfect work among humankind.

.

Hey ParkerD!! How have you been? Hope all is well with you and your family!
I thought LDS believed Jesus was perfect? God allowed His perfect Son to build a church that the gates of hell could not prevail against. If Jesus is PERFECT, than he can do nothing wrong, including building a church.
Thanks, Alisha

 

[twopekinguys]

I think what they are referring too is that the LDS church is not oppose to some abortions in very limited circumstances.

I will guess it has to do with things like life of mother in danger or incest. That sort of thing.

Only a guess on my part.

That is what I have heard also.

I have also heard that extensive birth defects is another reason.

 

[thecourt]

Most of you have tried to show how the restoration was not needed – I know that it happened and Joseph Smith was the instrument in making it so. Trying to say my church is false based on the same old garbage I guess will never end so if you wish to learn the truth, leave Catholicism and find it outside the so called great Catholic church.