Joseph Smith and the Need for the Restoration

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PaulDupre said:
The three children of Fatima never denied their visions of the Blessed Virgin, even when they were threatened with torture.

Bernadette Subirous of Lourdes never denied her visions of the Blessed Virgin, even when she was dying of bone cancer.

Sister Faustina never denied her visitations from Jesus.

Many other Catholic saints had visions and revelations from Jesus, Mary and the saints and never denied them.

So by your way of thinking, that proves that Catholicism is true, right?
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Good and reasonable question. 🙂
 
thecourt said:
Marie5890 I know that my church is the true church of Christ and I have no reason at all to ever waste my time with Catholicism that I left years ago.
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I’m sure happy I left Mormonism for Catholicism. None of Joseph Smith’s stories hold water. The Book of Mormon in particular does not have any basis in fact. On the other hand the tradition of the Catholic Church is verifiable. As Cardinal Newman said, "“To be deep in history is to cease to be Protestant.” It is impossible to prove the Mormon assertion of an apostasy – the apostasy is just a matter of faith for Mormons without any historical proof. Rather the proof all leans towards the continuity of the Catholic Church from the time of the apostles. Do yourself a little favor and read some church history without your Mormon blinders.
 
thecourt said:
Marie5890 I know that my church is the true church of Christ and I have no reason at all to ever waste my time with Catholicism that I left years ago.
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We will still be here when you need us. 🙂

I know exactly the path you are on. 🙂
 
thecourt said:
One of the man made doctrines is “your selection of the pope”. First of all, no man can take something, i.e. the priesthood, that is not his for the taking. Yet I do not know the number of men who have “chosen” or take the priesthood. Your man made process of the selection of the pope.
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I’m sorry, but this is an ignorant comment. The Cardinals’ vote is accompanied by prayer and is a serious decision based on the guidance of the Holy Spirit. What makes you think the Mormon process of choosing apostles is any more inspired? And the final decision of who becomes prophet seems to be based more on who can live the longest rather than the choice of God.
 
Marie5890 you will be waiting because I will not be back in Catholicism.
 
thecourt, I will say this.

If you really want to “protect your testimony” I would strongly suggest you may want to reconsider your participating here.

We are throwing a ton of truthful seeds in your path. They are bound to germinate and take root.

It was being exposed to truth that showed me the flawed “testimony” that I thought I possessed…

If being LDS really is something you value you are risking it by coming here.

Just something for you to consider.
 
Marie5890 I should stop posting on the forums with the false recycled garbage you folks continue to spread? I have a conviction of the truth of my church. It is not going to be chipped away by these “seeds” that you believe will have a impact on me.
 
thecourt said:
Marie5890 I should stop posting on the forums with the false recycled garbage you folks continue to spread? I have a conviction of the truth of my church. It is not going to be chipped away by these “seeds” that you believe will have a impact on me.
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Then feel free. We dont mind.

Its your “testimony” of Mormonism that is at stake. Not ours. We know its false. Well meaning, perhaps. But still false.
 
This thread seems to have become a dying fish, flopping on the ground, gasping for breath. haha

Does anyone have anymore questions regarding the restoration of the Gospel from Jesus Christ to the prophet Joseph Smith?
 
When folks who are Catholic recognize their church is not the true church, have a lot to consider relative to Joseph Smith and the restoration of the gospel.

I am not here to convert — you will have to have the Holy Ghost confirm it to you for your selves. I would consider that.
 
Come back, thecourt. It’s not too late. Re-join the Tiber team.

Can a faith who routinely violates the dignity of the dead be on the right path? Methinks not.
 
thecourt said:
RebeccaJ wants be to prove that God the Father and Jesus Christ appeared to Joseph Smith.
Well, I was not in the grove of trees nonetheless Joseph never denied the vision and Holy Ghost confirmed to me that this took place leading to me in learning the truth from my church.

Catholicism lacks a number of characteristics resulting me to leave it.
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Muhammad never denied that the Angel Gabriel gave him the Quran. Perhaps you should be Muslim instead? 😉
 
ParkerD said:
I suppose you’re going to be able to walk away saying to yourself, “See–I’m right–he never gave me a list.” I have listed the intercession of saints and of Mary that is non-Biblical, the idea of purgatory for the righteous that is non-Biblical, the idea that humankind cannot become like Christ in their omnipotence; also, the age and mode of baptism, the reality that the Holy Ghost can be lost through unrighteousness and is never a guarantee if a person follows impure teachings, the reality that Christ taught repentance and not “doing penance” for sins, the reality that Peter was never a bishop and certainly not the “first bishop of Rome”, the reality that “popes” are listed as the supposed “head of the earthly church” while John who was an apostle and had the authority of apostleship, when those supposed leaders are listed as being the earthly “head of the church” which disagrees with Biblical doctrine.
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The very truth that you hold regarding that there were to be 27 books in the New Testament is not biblical. No where does it state in Scripture which books or how many were to be included in the canon of Scripture. Nor is there anywhere in Scripture that mentions the Book of Mormon, Pearl of Great Price or the Doctrines and Covenants that you hold as revealed sources. So, we would have to agree that not everything revealed by God is in the Scriptures.

Anyway, your list is mirrored in the many Protestant denominatiions who don’t agree with you or themselves so I’m o.k. with your list. Once someone leaves the true Church of Jesus Christ they would be open for two possibilities. One, they would have to disagree with the teachings of the Church that they oppose and two, they would have to initiate their own teachings to counter their rivals.

It is so very unfortunate that Christ came to give us a message of hope and from the very beginning people had to stray from the true message. This is not an apostasy that I refer to but what would happen even in your own LDS Church. If LDS is indeed the true Church founded by Christ and restored by Joseph Smith and all others who claim to be Christian fell off of the earth, you would still have the splintering and dissention two thousand years from now as you have today. It is easy for newly formed religions (ie. Mormons, Jehovah’s Witnesses and many other Protestant denominations) to step up and say how wrong the Catholic Church is when they have not endured the weathering of the centuries that the Catholic Church has had to do.

Anyway, those are my thoughts on your list. I could counter your list with my list of your “made-up” doctrines that are not found in Scripture but that would be foolish at this point.

God bless…teachccd 🙂
 
ParkerD said:
Continuation to Teach CCD:

Not offended at all. You were kind in your comments. Thank you.

I agree that we should all try and understand each others’ beliefs, if we have time and interest to find them out. In the meantime, we also ought to respect beliefs differing from our own, and I assure you I do respect yours.

🙂

Thanks again, and God bless you also as well as have a splendid day.
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I did read through your entire post. For me to give a point by point rebuttal would seem futile at this point but I do have a better understanding of your points of view. It is always refreshing to dialogue with someone who can exhibit charity and articulate their views in a professional manner as you have done. I do respect your fervency in your belief and could only hope that the whole world could be as fevent in wanting to know Jesus Christ including my fellow Catholics.

We will just have to agree to disagree ( I really don’t like that phrase but for lack of a better one 🙂 ) at this point. Thank you for all of your (name removed by moderator)ut and your time which was well spent. I’m here if there is anything that you would like to add or chat about.May God continue to bless you and you have a great day as well…In Christ…teachccd 🙂
 
teachccd do you have a copy of the Book of Mormon and a conviction of the truth of the book? Of course not, you would be a member of my church speaking by the Holy Ghost of its truth and continue the agenda of Anti Mormons.

I love you folks who quote the Book of Mormon and use it for their purposes to prove or validate their claim that it is man made or Joseph Smith was crazy versus actually never denying the First Vision.

Would you like me to start quoting the Cathecism of the Catholic Church and using it to my advantage, particularly to show Catholicism’s lack of being the true church?
 
thecourt said:
Would you like me to start quoting the Cathecism of the Catholic Church and using it to my advantage, particularly to show Catholicism’s lack of being the true church?
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Yes, please start quoting the Catechism. That means you’d have to read at least a little bit of it. That would be great. 👍
 
PaulDupre said:
Yes, please start quoting the Catechism. That means you’d have to read at least a little bit of it. That would be great. 👍
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I agree with PaulDupre. 🙂

Feel free to research and quote the Catechism.

For me it would help clarify what points you are trying to make in your comments. 🙂
 
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