Jurisdiction of a Priest During Confession

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Thankyou again, Father, for your response, and for taking the time to explain it so thoroughly.

I had previously thought that the priest’s authority comes from “jurisdiction” (because the words “jurisdiction” and “judge” are related), but you have made clear that it comes from “faculties”.

I appreciate the following summary:
To make it more concrete, if a priest-confessor says “what you have confessed is sufficient” then his judgement in that particular confession is what prevails. At that moment, this isn’t about jurisdiction, it’s about having faculties to hear confessions. It doesn’t matter what canonical office that priest (sacerdos) holds. He has faculties to absolve, he is hearing a confession, therefore he is the judge at that moment.
All that is just explanation of what “jurisdiction” and “faculties to absolve” mean. The relevant point, the bottom line, is that the priest who hears a particular confession is indeed the judge (in persona Christi) of that particular penitent at that moment.
The first sentence, particularly, seems to be relevant to some concerns we have about our own confessions.

Thankyou, also, to you and all our priests for your wonderful service in this sacrament!
 
Father David,
You’ve said a couple times now on this thread that all faculties to absolve are essentially delegated by the Pope of Rome. It has always been my understanding that fundamentally a bishop - any validly consecrated bishop in apostolic succession - has the power to absolve sin, though a presbyter receives this power only if granted faculties by his bishop. Christ gave the keys to Peter and Peter alone in Matthew 16, but later in Matthew 18 He directly grants all 12 apostles (the first bishops) the power to bind and to loose…likewise in John 20 He grants all the apostles the power to forgive and retain sin. The Second Vatican Council and the Catechism also make it clear that the bishops are not mere vicars of the Pope but receive their office and authority directly from Christ (CCC 894 and 895). I understand that the Pope or an ecumenical council, when exercising the Supreme Authority of the Church, can limit the way in which the bishops exercise this power…but fundamentally and theologically is it true to say that only the Pope receives the authority of this sacrament directly from Christ? Why then do Orthodox bishops validly absolve and validly grant faculties in turn to their priests?
 
Father David,
You’ve said a couple times now on this thread that all faculties to absolve are essentially delegated by the Pope of Rome. It has always been my understanding that fundamentally a bishop - any validly consecrated bishop in apostolic succession - has the power to absolve sin, though a presbyter receives this power only if granted faculties by his bishop. Christ gave the keys to Peter and Peter alone in Matthew 16, but later in Matthew 18 He directly grants all 12 apostles (the first bishops) the power to bind and to loose…likewise in John 20 He grants all the apostles the power to forgive and retain sin. The Second Vatican Council and the Catechism also make it clear that the bishops are not mere vicars of the Pope but receive their office and authority directly from Christ (CCC 894 and 895). I understand that the Pope or an ecumenical council, when exercising the Supreme Authority of the Church, can limit the way in which the bishops exercise this power…but fundamentally and theologically is it true to say that only the Pope receives the authority of this sacrament directly from Christ? Why then do Orthodox bishops validly absolve and validly grant faculties in turn to their priests?
OK. I’ll try to explain.

When I say that all faculties to absolve are essentially delegated by the pope, I’m speaking in very broad terms. Extremely broad. I’m talking about the scriptural basis for absolution (not forgiveness, but absolution as such) when Christ gave the Keys to Peter.

You’re right to say that the Church does not see bishops as mere vicars of the popes.

Now, when I wrote that all faculties to absolve come ultimately from the pope, that was one of those times when I can only type so much in a single post. And when that happens, it’s easy for a misunderstanding to arise. I did not mean that the pope grants faculties to a bishop in the same way that a local bishop grants faculties to a parish priest—and I apologize if it came across that way. I mean “in the grant scheme of things” or “in terms of the entire economy of salvation.”

While accepting entirely the teaching of the Catechism and Vatican II (and all else) that the bishops are not merely vicars of the pope, we also have to keep in mind that the validity of the ministry of the bishop also depends upon his communion with the Pope.

Can. 336 The college of bishops, whose head is the Supreme Pontiff and whose members are bishops by virtue of sacramental consecration and hierarchical communion with the head and members of the college and in which the apostolic body continues, together with its head and never without this head, is also the subject of supreme and full power offer the universal Church.

To paraphrase that, a bishop must have both episcopal ordination and communion with the “head and members” in order to legitimately exercise the ministry of bishop.

What we see in the canon is likewise what we read in Vatican II, the Catechism, and all the other teachings of the Church. I just quoted the canon because it was easy for me to locate the text. They all agree with each other.

Here’s what you wrote:
It has always been my understanding that fundamentally a bishop - any validly consecrated bishop in apostolic succession - has the power to absolve sin.

That’s not the case. He needs both apostolic succession and communion (i.e. unity).

For example, a schismatic bishop cannot absolve, no matter how solid and true his claim to apostolic succession might be, because he lacks communion with the college of bishops, and especially the head of the college (pope).

With regard to the Orthodox, I’ll give you the answer, because you asked, but only with the qualification that the Orthodox don’t like this explanation.

When the Orthodox were still in communion with Rome, they had the faculties to absolve. After they separated from Rome, the popes never withdrew the faculties to absolve, ergo they still retain them.

Does that explain it?
 
Father,
Thank you for the response. I understand what you’re saying and it makes sense within a Latin canonical framework, but I wonder if we can really impose this understanding upon the Orthodox? Yes, the necessity of Roman primacy is a dogma of the Church and not up for grabs, but is the idea that Orthodox bishops cannot absolve without explicit faculties from Rome? Cardinal Ratzinger among others have said we can’t impose anything on the Orthodox that wasn’t lived and believed prior to the schism. The Orthodox emphasize the autonomy of the bishop - in recent centuries we have emphasized the primacy of Rome. The authentic Tradition of the Church is somewhere in the middle? That being said, I don’t think you’re saying the Pope needs to explicity confer faculties on other bishops - because he certainly didn’t before the schism. The point is more that for a bishop to exercise a legitimate ministry he must be in communion with Peter even if his own ministry is also directly from Christ.
 
=Edmundus1581;11636850]Thankyou again, Father, for your response, and for taking the time to explain it so thoroughly.
I had previously thought that the priest’s authority comes from “jurisdiction” (because the words “jurisdiction” and “judge” are related), but you have made clear that it comes from “faculties”.
I appreciate the following summary:
The first sentence, particularly, seems to be relevant to some concerns we have about our own confessions.
Thankyou, also, to you and all our priests for your wonderful service in this sacrament!
As we ought to suspect, Father is “right on” on the “faculties” issue.

The priest is neither “judge nor jury”, and is taking Christ place here on earth, and doing what he is commanded to do and empowered to do by Christ.

John 20: 19-23
Now when it was late that same day, the first of the week, and the doors were shut, where the disciples were gathered together, for fear of the Jews, Jesus came and stood in the midst, and said to them: Peace be to you. And when he had said this, he shewed them his hands and his side. The disciples therefore were glad, when they saw the Lord. He said therefore to them again: **Peace be to you. As the Father hath sent me, I also send you. **When he had said this, he breathed on them; and he said to them: Receive ye the Holy Ghost. Whose sins you shall forgive, they are forgiven them; and whose sins you shall retain, they are retained…"

God bless you,
Patrick
 
Father,
Thank you for the response. I understand what you’re saying and it makes sense within a Latin canonical framework, but I wonder if we can really impose this understanding upon the Orthodox? Yes, the necessity of Roman primacy is a dogma of the Church and not up for grabs, but is the idea that Orthodox bishops cannot absolve without explicit faculties from Rome? Cardinal Ratzinger among others have said we can’t impose anything on the Orthodox that wasn’t lived and believed prior to the schism. The Orthodox emphasize the autonomy of the bishop - in recent centuries we have emphasized the primacy of Rome. The authentic Tradition of the Church is somewhere in the middle? That being said, I don’t think you’re saying the Pope needs to explicity confer faculties on other bishops - because he certainly didn’t before the schism. The point is more that for a bishop to exercise a legitimate ministry he must be in communion with Peter even if his own ministry is also directly from Christ.
Keep in mind that I provided the answer with the qualification that I was only giving it because you asked…it’s a sensitive issue. Once again, a short answer to a very long and complicated issue. It was not my intention to delve into the subject of the ministry of the Orthodox bishops and priests—not beyond a short answer, anyway. Keep in mind, though, what I said about all bishops. When I say that the Power of the Keys comes ultimately from the Pope, I’m not speaking about a linear delegation (the old medieval pyramid model), nor about “faculties” in the same sense that a local bishop grants faculties to a particular priest. I’m speaking about the entire Christian Salvation History. I’m talking about Christ speaking to Peter and handing the Keys to him. It’s critical to keep that in mind.
 
As we ought to suspect, Father is “right on” on the “faculties” issue.

The priest is neither “judge nor jury”, and is taking Christ place here on earth, and doing what he is commanded to do and empowered to do by Christ.

John 20: 19-23


God bless you,
Patrick
Confused.

The priest is judge and jury.

When someone confesses “I did that” the priest must discern “is that even a sin?” and “how serious a sin is it?” along with others.

Here’s the Catechism
1465 When he celebrates the sacrament of Penance, the priest is fulfilling the ministry of the Good Shepherd who seeks the lost sheep, of the Good Samaritan who binds up wounds, of the Father who awaits the prodigal son and welcomes him on his return, and of the just and impartial judge whose judgment is both just and merciful. the priest is the sign and the instrument of God’s merciful love for the sinner.

Perhaps when you say “judge and jury” you mean that with a different connotation than the Catechism?

After all, in English (for other readers) when we say “judge and jury” we often mean that to have a sort of vigilantism connotation–which is, of course, not what the Church intends.
 
Keep in mind that I provided the answer with the qualification that I was only giving it because you asked…it’s a sensitive issue. Once again, a short answer to a very long and complicated issue. It was not my intention to delve into the subject of the ministry of the Orthodox bishops and priests—not beyond a short answer, anyway. Keep in mind, though, what I said about all bishops. When I say that the Power of the Keys comes ultimately from the Pope, I’m not speaking about a linear delegation (the old medieval pyramid model), nor about “faculties” in the same sense that a local bishop grants faculties to a particular priest. I’m speaking about the entire Christian Salvation History. I’m talking about Christ speaking to Peter and handing the Keys to him. It’s critical to keep that in mind.
Thanks Father. That makes more sense.
The Orthodox aside, another great example would be the Assyrian Church. The Assyrians haven’t been in communion with Rome since at least the 5th century yet we still recognize their sacraments, including penance, 1500 years later. This would be a tricky case, I would think, as one could argue that Rome condemned the Assyrians as Nestorian heretics, which I would imagine would include a “revoking” of faculties…even though, through 20th century dialogue, we have come to accept each other’s Christologies as equally orthodox expressions.
 
=FrDavid96;11644524]Confused.
The priest is judge and jury.
When someone confesses “I did that” the priest must discern “is that even a sin?” and “how serious a sin is it?” along with others.
Here’s the Catechism
1465 When he celebrates the sacrament of Penance, the priest is fulfilling the ministry of the Good Shepherd who seeks the lost sheep, of the Good Samaritan who binds up wounds, of the Father who awaits the prodigal son and welcomes him on his return, and of the just and impartial judge whose judgment is both just and merciful. the priest is the sign and the instrument of God’s merciful love for the sinner.
Perhaps when you say “judge and jury” you mean that with a different connotation than the Catechism?
After all, in English (for other readers) when we say “judge and jury” we often mean that to have a sort of vigilantism connotation–which is, of course, not what the Church intends.
Yes, I didn’t express myself well.😊

Your certainly right. I was thinking on a personal level; not a priestly level of obligation. SORRY!

God Bless you,
Patrick
 
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