Just finished the book, Why Catholics can't Sing

[Eric_Prine]

There was a part of the book where the author talked about ethnic songs being performed in American parishes such as, “When Irish Eyes are Smiling”, which have no theological place in the Liturgy. I’ve never witnessed this before, but yesterday I went to a traditionally German heritage parish and a piano player started playing, Edelweiss.
Anyway that is all. Just wanted to share. Maybe I should have been outraged but I started laughing. It was technically before the mass started or before the priest’s entrance- but still I thought it was still an odd choice for those of us sitting there before mass began.

 

[Bonnie]

Years ago we went to a parish where the pianist played a spirited rendition of the theme from The Sting - Marvin Hamlisch’s version of The Entertainer. Fortunately before Mass, not during - but still!

One of the hymns we sang Saturday evening was a good example of why Catholics can’t sing. In the middle there was an odd leap in notes with an pause I wasn’t expecting. Almost everybody missed singing the words there, but we picked up again in the next line.

 

[pianistclare]

I’d love to know where all these goofy parishes are.
Our pastor is very strict.
I’ve never been permitted (when I was a Music Director ) to just wing it.
But then again, most parishes only use volunteers, and as they say in pre-school:
“You get what you get and you don’t pitch a fit”

Oversight.
It’s a real thing.

 

[tawny]

I’d love to know where all these goofy parishes are.
Our pastor is very strict.
I’ve never been permitted (when I was a Music Director ) to just wing it.
But then again, most parishes only use volunteers, and as they say in pre-school:
“You get what you get and you don’t pitch a fit”

Oversight.
It’s a real thing.

Same with my Parish & Pastor; only liturgically appropriate music allowed.

 

[ctb95]

It seems like our pastor gives the music ministry people a fair amount of freedom, but I could never see him tolerate some of the wacky music choices in other parishes that people talk about on this forum.

 

[Irishmom2]

One time we heard the theme from The Deer Hunter. I can’t remember at what point, but as I gave seen the movie multiple times, I found it very distracting…

 

[Anne1964]

Our former pastor allowed the cantor to select the Communion hymn only because he knew she would never select something inappropriate. We had beautiful hymns, some in Latin, some with additional instruments such as the cello and violin.

Our new pastor is a trained organist and his taste in music tends toward the more funereal hymns. All of which are certainly appropriate, but I do miss having more variety.

 

[Eric_Prine]

Years ago we went to a parish where the pianist played a spirited rendition of the theme from The Sting - Marvin Hamlisch’s version of The Entertainer. Fortunately before Mass, not during - but still!

One of the hymns we sang Saturday evening was a good example of why Catholics can’t sing. In the middle there was an odd leap in notes with an pause I wasn’t expecting. Almost everybody missed singing the words there, but we picked up again in the next line.

Speaking as a convert that hasn’t been around that long- there are some very difficult songs to sing and awkward sounding in many Catholic parishes. I grew up in a traditional quasi-liturgical Protestant church and prefer traditional Protestant hymns more than the folk sounding Catholic songs. Though I am now getting more exposure to both Eastern Liturgy and the Latin solemn mass and the music at both are very beautiful.

 

[sallybutler]

My mother had a wonderful teaching.

If you have a good voice, you should sing loud in praise and thanksgiving.

If you have a bad voice, you should sing loud to get even with God.

I wish every parish would preach this.

P.S. I sing to get even

 

[Bill_Martin]

I think the biggest reason our music is so poor is because Catholic liturgical music in English is still a new thing. There are many great options in Latin, Greek, and Church Slavonic, many of which by famous composers, because those languages have been used in liturgical settings for centuries, compared to only half a century or so for English. There are no Rachmaninoffs out there setting the English Novus Ordo to music.

 

[SMHW]

I think the biggest reason our music is so poor is because Catholic liturgical music in English is still a new thing. There are many great options in Latin, Greek, and Church Slavonic, many of which by famous composers, because those languages have been used in liturgical settings for centuries, compared to only half a century or so for English. There are no Rachmaninoffs out there setting the English Novus Ordo to music.

Probably.

That and the fact that great singing demands a purity of vowel sounds and is easier when the majority of words end in vowels rather than consonants.

 

[tseleehw]

The weirdest thing I believe I’ve heard about music being played before mass was when someone posted on here that the organist/pianist played the main theme from Star Wars immediately before mass.

I’m sure incidents like this are statistically very rare but I have no problems believing that stuff like this happens from time to time at some parishes.

 

[Tarpeian_Rock]

I think another factor is what I call “disappearing choirs.” In two of the three parishes I’ve been involved with during the last 20 years, the choir either disappeared completely or is only a few members. Reasons: ageing, over-committed families that take up time formerly used for rehearsals, lack of interest, and something like a “death spiral” once a choir starts going downhill. I think a strong choir encourages singing by the congregation whose members are reluctant to sing without some “cover.” Absent a choir, and coupled with indifferent hymns, congregation not happy to sing.

 

[Phemie]

There was a part of the book where the author talked about ethnic songs being performed in American parishes such as, “When Irish Eyes are Smiling”, which have no theological place in the Liturgy. I’ve never witnessed this before, but yesterday I went to a traditionally German heritage parish and a piano player started playing, Edelweiss.
Anyway that is all. Just wanted to share. Maybe I should have been outraged but I started laughing. It was technically before the mass started or before the priest’s entrance- but still I thought it was still an odd choice for those of us sitting there before mass began.

Well, Edelweiss is not an ethnic piece. It was written specifically for the Broadway play “The Sound of Music” in 1959.

 

[Phemie]

Years ago we went to a parish where the pianist played a spirited rendition of the theme from The Sting - Marvin Hamlisch’s version of The Entertainer. Fortunately before Mass, not during - but still!

One of the hymns we sang Saturday evening was a good example of why Catholics can’t sing. In the middle there was an odd leap in notes with an pause I wasn’t expecting. Almost everybody missed singing the words there, but we picked up again in the next line.

Lately we’ve been singing a Magnificat (Holy Is Your Name) to the tune of Wild Mountain Thyme. We’re all familiar with the music, we sing Wild Mountain Thyme annually at our St. Paddy’s Day dinner. But the way the hymn is written is simply weird.

The line “Will you go, lassie, go?” at the end of the first verse in “Wild Mountain Thyme” becomes the first line of the chorus in “Holy Is Your Name”.
godsongs.net/2013/05/my-soul-is-filled-with-joy-magnificat.html

 

[Phemie]

One time we heard the theme from The Deer Hunter. I can’t remember at what point, but as I gave seen the movie multiple times, I found it very distracting…

To me the one thing we sang in our parish that I found most distracting/distressing is when the youth choir sang the Lord’s Prayer to the tune of “I Don’t Know How to Love Him” from Jesus Christ Superstar.

1. Because it doesn’t scan properly to that tune, you were never sure what words were going to go with what notes. I don’t think they sang it the same twice in a row.
2. The only words that came to me when I heard the tune were “He’s a man, he’s just a man, and I’ve had so many men before, in very many ways he’s just one more.” Just what you want to have trotting through your head just before Communion.

 

[Irishmom2]

Lately we’ve been singing a Magnificat (Holy Is Your Name) to the tune of Wild Mountain Thyme. We’re all familiar with the music, we sing Wild Mountain Thyme annually at our St. Paddy’s Day dinner. But the way the hymn is written is simply weird.

The line “Will you go, lassie, go?” at the end of the first verse in “Wild Mountain Thyme” becomes the first line of the chorus in “Holy Is Your Name”.
godsongs.net/2013/05/my-soul-is-filled-with-joy-magnificat.html

I first heard Wild Mountain Thyme sung by Makeum and Clancy…I don’t think I could sing it as Holy Is Your Name without thinking of that.

 

[mcmitton]

Well, that writer has never heard our St. Patrick communicants sing! And sing, we do! Well and with great heart, a joyful sound.

I can remember only one request that would not be appropriate during the Mass, that of “Sweet Genevieve”. T’was for a funeral for one of our oldest members, as it was one of her given names. To “make that work”, we arranged to have it played/sung just as her casket entered the building/gathering space, before any of the Mass opening rites, prayers, and sprinkling, etc.

After those were completed, the casket was positioned in the worship space, as normal.

 

[Maol_Mhuire]

I think the biggest reason our music is so poor is because Catholic liturgical music in English is still a new thing.

I think that’s only partially correct. I believe that it also fundamentally has to do with the reduction of liturgical act merely to the sacerdotal priesthood. The diminution of the laity’s participation in the liturgy over the past few centuries and the devotionalisation of the Mass by the Jesuit influence in the Roman Church all contributed towards the “inability” of Catholics to sing. It is why the work of the Liturgical Movement was so important and necessary, and a work that I believe is still ongoing due to the massive failures of the 20th century.

If we look at the Gaelic psalmody of the Isle of Lewis in Scotland (here) or the public worship in many Anglican churches, we see that it’s not impossible for the laity to sing. Englishmen and Gaels aren’t naturally better singers than their American, French or Chinese counterparts.

I don’t have all the answers but I believe that the two most basic necessities to accomplish the re-introduction of singing as an intricate necessity in Catholic worship is re-establishing the place of the Divine Office in the life of the laity and greatly expanding the use of the most basic chants used in the Mass and the Office. To heed the call of Pope Pius XII in De Musica Sacra. And do it in Latin. There’s no point wasting time in trying to figure out adopting everything from Latin in to the vernacular when we already have it all laid out for us.

 

[HelenRose]

I think the biggest reason our music is so poor is because Catholic liturgical music in English is still a new thing. There are many great options in Latin, Greek, and Church Slavonic, many of which by famous composers, because those languages have been used in liturgical settings for centuries, compared to only half a century or so for English. There are no Rachmaninoffs out there setting the English Novus Ordo to music.

I want to make distinction here. There is bad music and good music. There is simple music and difficult music. There is simple good music and simple bad music. There is difficult good music and difficult bad music. The combinations are unlimited.

In small communities as mine, simple music is what we use. There is great beauty in simple music done well and horrific ugliness is difficult music done poorly.

Chants are beautiful if well done but few people really realize how difficult they are. Chants can become dirges if done poorly. It is possible the reason chant is not used more often people experienced the latter.