Just Learned Mom Has a DNR

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This is often protocol in hospitals, especially if you are over 55. Most people are not admitted to the hospital with a mild case of pneumonia unless there are ither underlying medical conditions.
 
MikeInVA said:
A couple of years ago I was admitted for (relatively) mild pneumonia.
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That’s a contradiction in terms. Most people are not admitted to the hospital for mild pneumonia…

I’m guessing that your age may have had something to do with the routine questions being asked.
 
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@JanetF I think you are missing a “not” in your reply.
 
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I’ve got to take issue. A good Living Will often relieves family members from having to make decisions they cannot or will not make, e.g., letting mom or dad go.

If the attorney-in-fact under the advance directive cannot make the decision to let you go when the time comes, a Living Will is much more useful and appropriate. Seen it in real life.

I agree you have to have some real conversations with your spouse, kids, other family members, doctor, neighbors…you name it. Make your wishes clear. But, when it comes to it, some people simply can’t make the decision.
 
In my experience, the complexities of medical treatment plans have far too many variables to be laid out in a nice little document. As science advances the complexities grow. It is no longer as simple as “I do not want to have a feeding tube” because it may be you simply need one for 2 days until you can pass a swallow test or “I do not want to be on a vent” because if you have a serious heart procedure, you must be on a vent and the weaning process can be back and forth.
 
Perhaps, but with the wrong attorney-in-fact you have a worse situation in real life…

I will agree that there is no one answer fits all solution, but I would still choose a living will absent a sure choice of AIF
 
I think it just depends.
If I’m still relatively young, I would definitely be OK with CPR and dfib. Ive I’m 80? Probably not.
 
After experiencing it, my 50 year old husband feared another shock far more than he feared death. The pain of the shocks left him with PTSD.
 
JimR-OCDS said:
Without a DNR, you force the person to go through the process of dying over and over, again until they finally die and can’t be brought back.

It’s actually cruel !
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Or you know, they are brought back…which happens quite often.
 
Hmm
I’ve been through annual first aid training for years now and the instructor that is an active emsa says that people usually get over it very quickly.

Regardless, I would think I’d rather deal with a little pain then miss out on a possible 30 years of life with family. But then again, I’ve never been in that situation
 
If they’re terminal and brought back, they’ll have to go through the death process all over again and it won’t take long for that to happen again.
 
Or you could wind up with anoxic brain injury and be a total care patient, even if you’re young. I’ve seen that happen too (probably more than you’d be comfortable knowing). I’m not anti-CPR- but don’t understate reality. Things can and do go drastically wrong sometimes and the young don’t always come back and get over it quickly.
 
CoffeeFanatic said:
Or you could wind up with anoxic brain injury and be a total care patient, even if you’re young. I’ve seen that happen too (probably more than you’d be comfortable knowing). I’m not anti-CPR- but don’t understate reality. Things can and do go drastically wrong sometimes and the young don’t always come back and get over it quickly.
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Sure.

I just feel like everyone is overstating the effects of CPR/dfib in this thread.
 
Well, when you are talking about people who have DNR orders, they are usually older and/or have chronic medical conditions.

Which is why it is so important to have conversation, often, with family/loved ones.
CPR on a demented, 90 y.o with other chronic issues is not “care”.
 
In my area, we have something called Goals of Care. A Goals of Care conversation is to be initiated for EVERY patient that comes into hospital. Patients can choose from a variety of different options:

Resuscitative (R) 1 - everything
R2 - everything except chest compressions
R3 - in case of arrest, medications only - no chest compressions, no intubation
Medical (M) 1 - no CPR, but admit to hospital, treat active medical conditions and may do surgery
M2 - as with M1 but surgery is only done for symptom alleviation
Comfort (C) 1 - do not admit to hospital, do not treat active medical conditions, treat symptoms only, may do surgery for symptom alleviation
C2 - treat symptoms only but no surgery; suitable for patients expected to live only days to weeks

The GOC sheet and any additional documents outlining the patient’s wishes are put into a special Green Sleeve. When the patient is discharged, we photocopy the document and the patient takes the original home with them. We advise patients to put it on their fridge. This way, if they have to call EMS, the EMS personnel will be able to find it easily because they are now trained to look for a GOC document on the fridge. EMS now has protocols that they will not start CPR if a patient is an M or C GOC.
 
Yep, I agree. Of course, if I’m unconscious, I can’t do anything about it which is why my daughter…who not only knows my wishes but agrees with them…will be my decision maker. I was furious at my step mother and the medical personnel at this facility. I consider it a neglect and dereliction of duty on their part!

When it’s my time to go, for gosh sakes LET ME GO! 😂😂😂
 
CatholicSooner said:
Regardless, I would think I’d rather deal with a little pain then miss out on a possible 30 years of life with family. But then again, I’ve never been in that situation
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An 80 year old with congestive heart failure or chronic lung disease (or both) is not looking at gaining 30 years of life from CPR. They’re looking at dying with broken ribs. DNR orders are not evidence of suicidal thoughts!!
 
I don’t see any problem here and you should respect your mothers wishes. My Mom was rushed to the hospital after years of failing health and she had a DNR order and no artificial life prolonging means request that she made sure my sister and I knew about.

When her kidneys started to fail as her heart was weakening she refused dialysis, thus hastening her death. She had a good life and was ready to go and we all supported her desire to have a natural death, and as I understand it this was quite in line with the Church’s stance on this.
 
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