dj dave; More…
And finally regarding the word soul…if you would be consistent in your rendering of the word in your Bible you would easily see that it no way implies immortality or something that exists outside the physical body There is absolutely no scriptural justification for that! Consider:
JL: Christ seems to be under the CLEAR impression the SOUL does EXISTS outside the body. [Mt10:28 And fear not them which KILL THE BODY, but are NOT ABLE TO KILL THE SOUL: but rather fear him which is able to destroy BOTH soul AND body in hell.]
God alone has disposition of the SOUL and HE alone can destroy BOTH in the lake of fire. Where does that living SOUL go between bodily death and the resurrection of the body, so BOTH can be thrown into Gehenna or the lake of fire?
The Bible uses the word soul in DIFFERENT ways seat of human emotion, Ps42:2, whole person or living being, Gn2:7, and as an immortal spirit which animates a body, Mt10:28, Rv6:9-10. The WT limits the meaning NOT scripture.
Jer51:14 The LORD of hosts hath sworn by HIMSELF (NEPHESH, Hebrew),… [Amos 6:8 The Lord GOD hath sworn by HIMSELF (NEPHESH)…, Job23:13 But he is in one mind and who can turn him? And what his SOUL (NEPHESH) desireth, even that he doeth]. Ps11:5 The LORD trieth the righteous: but the wicked and him that loveth violence his SOUL (NEPHESH) hateth].
NEPHESH, is speaking of God himself, In this context, nothing could be more IMMATERIAL, INTANGIBLE, INVISIBLE, IMMORTAL,
or CONSCIOUS than nephesh in this CONTEXT.
[1Kgs 17:21 Then he stretched himself upon the child three times, and cried to the Lord, O Lord my God, let this child’s SOUL (NEPHESH) come into him again. 23 And the Lord listened to the voice of Elijah; and the SOUL (NEPHESH) of the child came into him again, and he revived.
[Gn35:18 And AS HER SOUL (NEPHESH) WAS DEPARTING (for she died), she called his name Ben-o’ni; but his father called his name Benjamin.]
Zech12:1 The burden of the word of the LORD for Israel, saith the LORD, WHICH stretcheth forth the heavens, and layeth the foundation of the earth, and FORMETH THE spirit (ruwach, Aramaic) OF MAN
WITHIN HIM.
Notice YOUR post # 172, Protestants who identify Michael as Jesus Christ, 3 Sep 09; forums.catholic-questions.org/showpost.php?p=5655657&postcount=172
Post 172: [Peter also describes the hope such ones possess as “precious and very grand promises, that through these you may become sharers in divine nature.” (2Pe 1:4) [COLOR=“Blue”]They must undergo a change of nature, giving up human nature to obtain “divine” nature, thus sharing with Christ in his glory. They must die a death like Christ’s—maintaining integrity and giving up human life forever—and then they receive immortal, incorruptible bodies like Christ’s by a resurrection. (Ro 6:3-5; 1Co 15:50-57; 2Co 5:1-3)]
The WT unwittingly has confirmed Christ IS God saying He has a DIVINE NATURE. Christ does have a DIVINE NATURE because He is God. God alone has A
DIVINE NATURE. The WT says the 144 thousand will not have the
NATURE of a HUMAN BEING, but they undergo a **CHANGE OF NATURE giving up HUMAN NATURE
to OBTAIN DIVINE NATURE.] If the 144 thousand’s NATURE BECOME DIVINE that would make those 144 thousand equal to God in dignity if not power. God and ONLY God has a DIVINE NATURE and there is NONE beside HIM. There is only ONE GOD the Father, Son and Holy Spirit, God ALONE is DIVINE.
Those who belong to Christ share God’s divine nature when our God indwells the soul, but man’s nature does not become DIVINE. We do actually become his adopted children SHARING his very NATURE, when baptized by water and the Spirit and receiving his divine nature by the indwelling Holy Sprit. All God’s people even here on earth share his divine nature as long as we are in grace. In fact his divine nature MUST be indwelling us while we are still alive on earth. We cannot receive it after death, it is received before death or not at all. That indwelling, sharing of divine nature, IS the gift of eternal life.
Notice again YOUR post 172: [The apostle Paul explains that it is
not the body that is resurrected****, but rather, he likens their experience to the planting and sprouting of a seed, in that “God gives
IT a body just as it has pleased him.” (1Co 15:35-40)
‘‘IT’’ is the soul, the person, that is
resurrected, with a body to suit the environment into which God resurrects him. “]
Tell me would this ‘‘IT’’, which the WT says IS the SOUL, NOT the resurrected BODY, would the “IT” be immaterial, intangible, invisible, and immortal? If not then what is this ‘‘IT=SOUL’’ that gets ANOTHER body? Have you ever seen this material IT, which is NOT the BODY? Well now if the body is not resurrected then we can DISCOUNT the WT insistence NEPHESH is ALWAYS the body or WHOLE PERSON, isn’t that a total contradiction? Good grief what a convoluted twist to follow.
Again If
“IT” is NOT the BODY then IT must be the SOUL, as you state above. Then the WT has also unwittingly admitted the soul is a spirit. What else could it be if IT’S NOT the body or whole person. IT is just as Christ tells us in Mt10:28 man is BOTH body AND soul=IT and Christ tells us that the soul does NOT die with the body. The WT twist is more like pagan Greek philosophy. What a convoluted contradiction.**
), but my wife and I have been inactive in the JW faith for years and have lived in the same town, never leaving, and we are basically avoided when we see other JW’s we know in public places. You’d think we were lepers or carry some other disease. We don’t feel bad for ourselves, but for them.
When I press issues that might have the potential for disfellowshipping (is that a word?) or offending the “elders”, it gets kind of ugly. We just have to agree to disagree and leave it at that. It’s nice that my friend and I can talk about religious stuff though. But it’s understood we are not trying to convert each other, and in light of the push given by the WTS, I commend her for not trying that stuff with me. I appreciate it even.
And the reality of it is: we’re all free to choose.
