JW's came to my door today....

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Rbt_Southwell said:
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Where is the Vatican I quote for me?**

Quit the legerdemain on the manuscripts. Go read the Oxford Companion to the Bible entry (a good Protestant wrote it) and see what he says about your hallowed “Textus Receptus.”

It’s the post-Temple destruction, post-Resurrection Jewish assemblage of OT scrolls and codices into the TaNakh.

And the irony: Protestants think it is the ‘Jewish Scriptures’ Jesus quoted from.

Robert
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I have given you the Vatican quote twice, I am going to do it a third time, heck I will include the link as well because you really seem to have difficulty tonight, and I am not sure why…
here is the quote from the first vatican council
it is a direct quote from the first vatican council
I have quoted it twice before and it is going to look suspiciously the same the third time
but because,
being written under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit,
they have God as their Author,
and were as such committed to the Church.
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Here is the link to the quote
dailycatholic.org/history/20ecume1.htm

If you do not like the Masoretic text you must not like the Vulgate…the uh.how very…not Catholic of you…
 
Rightlydivide said:
I agree with the first statement but the second is the most effective I have found.
As far as the second excuse, accepting the gospel of Christ and baptism in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Ghost leads no one to hell. Unless you are denying the truth of the Bible…
Just admit you guys are too scared and lazy to actually spread the gospel
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Calling us (Catholics) “lazy” is pretty judgemental. Don’t ya think???

When you get in people’s faces, most people turn away. It is better to approach people in a calm an loving way to win them over.

And no, we Catholics are not denying the Bible. I am so sick of hearing that from the Non-denoms. The reason why we have so many different beliefs is because good ole King James decided to take it upon himself and pick and choose what your Bible should contain. God help him for doing that. Look at the New American Bible if you really want the whole truth.

Non- Denoms…please stop bashing Catholics. If you really looked at our faith you might like what you see…And yes we really are Christians too.
 
rightlydivide:

Here is the pertinent excerpt on the NT from the Oxford Companion:

"The first published Greek New Testament, edited by Erasmus of Rotterdam and issued by Johannes Froben of Basel in 1516 relied on only a few very late manuscripts. For the Book of Revelation there was only one Greek manuscript available and it lacked the last six verses; for them, Erasmus translated the Latin Vulgate into what he supposed the Greek text should read.

This type of New Testament text, based on late and sometimes imperfect manuscripts, became the so-called Textus Receptus. Only toward the end of the nineteenth century, once much earlier and superior NT manuscripts became available, could scholars produce more accurate editions."

Bruce M. Metzger (Princeton Theological Seminary, NJ) and co-editor of the Companion to the Bible.

**And WHAT were those “much earlier and superior NT manuscripts”?

Codex Vaticanus and Codex Sinaiticus (page 488 in the Oxford Companion to the Bible).
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Hope this clears up your confusion, rightlydivide.

Robert
 
Rbt_Southwell said:
rightlydivide:

Here is the pertinent excerpt on the NT from the Oxford Companion:

"The first published Greek New Testament, edited by Erasmus of Rotterdam and issued by Johannes Froben of Basel in 1516 relied on only a few very late manuscripts. For the Book of Revelation there was only one Greek manuscript available and it lacked the last six verses; for them, Erasmus translated the Latin Vulgate into what he supposed the Greek text should read.

This type of New Testament text, based on late and sometimes imperfect manuscripts, became the so-called Textus Receptus. Only toward the end of the nineteenth century, once much earlier and superior NT manuscripts became available, could scholars produce more accurate editions."

Bruce M. Metzger (Princeton Theological Seminary, NJ) and co-editor of the Companion to the Bible.

**And WHAT were those “much earlier and superior NT manuscripts”?

Codex Vaticanus and Codex Sinaiticus (page 488 in the Oxford Companion to the Bible).
**
Hope this clears up your confusion, rightlydivide.

Robert
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Vaticanus and Sinaiticus contain different books not even in the present canon.
They contain different books in even the Deuterocanonicals.
They disagree with each other how many times??
It matters nothing that they are discovered on careful scrutiny to differ essentially, not only from ninety-nine out of a hundred of the whole body of extant MSS. besides, but even from one another. In the gospels alone B (Vaticanus) is found to omit at least 2877 words: to add 536, to substitute, 935; to transpose, 2098: to modify 1132 (in all 7578): - the corresponding figures for Aleph being 3455 omitted, 839 added, 1114 substitued, 2299 transposed, 1265 modified (in all 8972). And be it remembered that the omissions, additions, substitutions, transpositions, and modifications, are by no means the same in both. It is in fact easier to find two consecutive verses in which these two mss. differ the one from the other, than two consecutive verses in which they entirely agree."
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Are THESE your better manuscripts, manuscripts so fundamentally flawed that the DDS Tobit is causing it to be fundamentally rewritten from the garbage these two corrupt manuscripts subjected the world to?
 
Rightlydivide said:
Vaticanus and Sinaiticus contain different books not even in the present canon.
They contain different books in even the Deuterocanonicals.
They disagree with each other how many times??
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What is the “DDS Tobit”?

And here goes your infallible preaching: “causing it to be fundamentally rewritten from the garbage these two corrupt manuscripts subjected the world to?”

That’s a whopper, my friend:rolleyes:

Of course, YOUR interpretation leads people to Christ. So does YOUR version of the Bible.

Gee, why didn’t you say that at the beginning and save us all a lot of grief!🤷

Robert
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Rbt_Southwell said:
What is the “DDS Tobit”?

And here goes your infallible preaching: “causing it to be fundamentally rewritten from the garbage these two corrupt manuscripts subjected the world to?”

That’s a whopper, my friend:rolleyes:

Of course, YOUR interpretation leads people to Christ. So does YOUR version of the Bible.

Gee, why didn’t you say that at the beginning and save us all a lot of grief!🤷

Robert
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Should have said DSS of course
 
How did this thread get so far off track?

RightlyDivide, in case there’s any confusion, perhaps you might clarify for people you are not one of Jehovah’s Witnesses?
 
dolphinlove said:
Unlike America, we hardly ever have any religious denoms come to our houses, but i did today…
Two men came to the front door, wearing white shirts and holding books, didnt see the books at first, then they said they were part of an ‘organization’, then i saw the watchtower mags… then the light went off in my head as to what ‘organization’ they represent!
They said they wanted to talk about God, i said oh good, im Catholic, lets talk about it, they then said thank you for your time and couldnt get away fast enough… I dont know if they have come across Catholics before that know their stuff, or if they didnt want to spend the time talking about the differences, but anyway, it was a good way to get rid of them! lol
I thought they would have liked a bit of a challenge, but it wasnt to be, oh well, next time!
Was a good start to the morning!
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Since this thread’s topic is about Jehovah’s Witnesses and their preaching work… perhaps some would be curious about that “organization” and the worldwide preaching efforts.

Here’s a video about it on YouTube:

Part 1
Part 2
Part 3
Part 4
Part 5
Part 6
 
No thanks bible steve. I know all about your “preaching efforts” It’s all hogwash.
 
Please get this thread back on topic or it will be closed.

Thanks for your cooperation.

Rachel
 
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