JW's why they don't celebrate Christmas

[b_justb]

Jaded:
It goes along with not celebrating birthdays. The bible is our example and the birthdays presented in it were horrible affairs where our lesson is we should not celebrate them.

Deuteronomy 31:1-8 So Moses continued to speak these words to all Israel. And he said to them, “I am a hundred and twenty years old this day; I am no longer able to go out and come in. The LORD has said to me, `You shall not go over this Jordan.’ The LORD your God himself will go over before you; he will destroy these nations before you, so that you shall dispossess them; and Joshua will go over at your head, as the LORD has spoken. And the LORD will do to them as he did to Sihon and Og, the kings of the Amorites, and to their land, when he destroyed them. And the LORD will give them over to you, and you shall do to them according to all the commandment which I have commanded you. Be strong and of good courage, do not fear or be in dread of them: for it is the LORD your God who goes with you; he will not fail you or forsake you.” Then Moses summoned Joshua, and said to him in the sight of all Israel, “Be strong and of good courage; for you shall go with this people into the land which the LORD has sworn to their fathers to give them; and you shall put them in possession of it. It is the LORD who goes before you; he will be with you, he will not fail you or forsake you; do not fear or be dismayed.”

Yes this is a great and horrible example of a biblical birthday gone awry.

 

[b_justb]

You can say we shift the truth all you want. I’m not going to argue with anyone. I’ll discuss things based on bible teachings, but I won’t argue. And some people just want to argue. You obviously left the JWs for a reason so there’s no point in talking to you about it anyway.

So you have no answer? Or there is an answer you wish not to give for what ever reason?

 

[Jaded27]

b_justb:

So you have no answer? Or there is an answer you wish not to give for what ever reason?

Humans make mistakes about bible interpretations. Only God is perfect. Surely you believe that as well, whatever religion you are now.

If you want to discuss this further PM me because I really don’t think you’re all that interested in a serious answer. You are a former JW and therefore don’t like current JWs and wish to argue with them.

 

[At_His_Feet]

Jaded - First of all I want to say “welcome” to you!

But, Ha! Something funny happened - I put that post up, and apparantly you cut and paste from it, but in the meantime I decided to take it down and edit it and work on it some more! I don’t see it up there anymore!

You said Okay, but what does a tree with lights on it have to do with Jesus? It’s fine if they no longer mean pagan things, but can you explain to me why it has anything to do with god’s son being born? (I’m not being antagonistic. I honestly have no idea.)

I hear ya. I think most people would say something like - the evergreen tree reminds us of the Eternal Life that is available through Christ; or that in the “winter” of our own sin we are able to gain life through Christ… The lights; people might say that Christ is a “light” to us all; the figure of “light” is frequently used in John’s gospel and elsewhere of the salvation that is available through Christ; etc. If someone were to be asked - “What does that tree mean to you?”, and they say “New life (or, everlasting life) in Christ” - is that so bad?

Hope that helps. Another thing that you will find is that devout Catholics take Christmas very seriously and spend a lot of time thinking about the significance that Christ’s birth has for all mankind.

Stick around - good to have you here!

 

[b_justb]

Humans make mistakes about bible interpretations. Only God is perfect. Surely you believe that as well, whatever religion you are now.

If you want to discuss this further PM me because I really don’t think you’re all that interested in a serious answer. You are a former JW and therefore don’t like current JWs and wish to argue with them.

So the teaching on the whole 1914 scenario has changed. OK. I was just wondering if it had. I don’t really want to get into why or what is the new idea on it according to the JW’s. Just thanks for answering the question.

I am a former or Ex-JW this is true. If my defense for the reason for my faith is considered arguing to you then so be it. But read the sign above the forum, it’s a Catholic forum. Do you really expect us Catholics to just sit by and allow peope to come here and call our ways “Pagan” and just smile and say, “That’s OK, say what ever you want. We shall not say anything to challenge your voice,”? Not happening, Bubba.

 

[Jaded27]

At His Feet:

Jaded - First of all I want to say “welcome” to you!

But, Ha! Something funny happened - I put that post up, and apparantly you cut and paste from it, but in the meantime I decided to take it down and edit it and work on it some more! I don’t see it up there anymore!

Yea, I wondered what happend to it! lol.
At His Feet:

I think most people would say something like "the evergreen tree reminds us of the Eternal Life that is available through Christ; or that in the “winter” of our own sin we are able to gain life through Christ… The lights; people might say that Christ is a “light” to us all; the figure of “light” is frequently used in John’s gospel and elsewhere of the salvation that is available through Christ; etc. If someone were to be asked - “What does that tree mean to you?”, and they say “New life (or, everlasting life) in Christ” - is that so bad?

Thank you for the answer and for the welcome. I dont’ know why but I seem to attract angry people where ever I go. It’s a curse. Nice to read a friendly post though.

 

[Jaded27]

b_justb:

So the teaching on the whole 1914 scenario has changed. OK. I was just wondering if it had. I don’t really want to get into why or what is the new idea on it according to the JW’s. Just thanks for answering the question.

No problem

b_justb:

Do you really expect us Catholics to just sit by and allow peope to come here and call our ways “Pagan” and just smile and say, “That’s OK, say what ever you want. We shall not say anything to challenge your voice,”? Not happening, Bubba.

I don’t think there’s any need for name calling posts.

And had you read more carefully I did not call “your ways” pagan. I said the practices originated in pagan beliefs. Others here, who are catholic, have confirmed that and explained it. There is no need for you to be so upset over something like this.

As a JW I am used to having my faith questioned all the time and defending it. Since you are now in a more “popular” religion are you no longer used to this and therefore react badly to it?

Relax, take a step back, and just let it go. No one’s insulting your faith here. I was simply trying to introduce myself.

 

[b_justb]

I don’t think there’s any need for name calling posts.

Bubba is “name calling”?

And had you read more carefully I did not call “your ways” pagan. I said the practices originated in pagan beliefs. Others here, who are catholic, have confirmed that and explained it. There is no need for you to be so upset over something like this.

Inciting none the less, no? And I am definitely not upset.

As a JW I am used to having my faith questioned all the time and defending it. Since you are now in a more “popular” religion are you no longer used to this and therefore react badly to it?

Not “popular” but “true” and “original.” The faith handed down by Jesus through the Apostles.

Relax, take a step back, and just let it go. No one’s insulting your faith here. I was simply trying to introduce myself.

Your introduction is made. Big splash! The waters fine for all.

 

[Jaded27]

Quote:
I don’t think there’s any need for name calling posts.

b_justb:

Bubba is “name calling”?

It is when I don’t know you or consider you a friend enough to be goofy like that. If you meant it in a silly way then I apologize, but since the rest of your post was heated no reason for me to think that wasn’t either. I can read what’s at the top and you know what I see? “Catholic ANSWERS forum”. Hence, my asking questions. Next.
Quote:
And had you read more carefully I did not call “your ways” pagan. I said the practices originated in pagan beliefs. Others here, who are catholic, have confirmed that and explained it. There is no need for you to be so upset over something like this.

b_justb:

Inciting none the less, no? And I am definitely not upset.

Inciting what exactly? A riot? Everyone else reacted positively, your reaction was negative and did nothing to answer my question.

Quote:
As a JW I am used to having my faith questioned all the time and defending it. Since you are now in a more “popular” religion are you no longer used to this and therefore react badly to it?

b_justb:

Not “popular” but “true” and “original.” The faith handed down by Jesus through the Apostles.

And I believe mine is true. What’s your point? This is why I said there’s no point in me talking to you about it. others can answer my questions without bringing in the true religion to it.
Quote:
Relax, take a step back, and just let it go. No one’s insulting your faith here. I was simply trying to introduce myself.

b_justb:

Your introduction is made. Big splash! The waters fine for all.

Good to know.

 

[b_justb]

And I believe mine is true. What’s your point?

That IS the point! As a JW I was taught that the teachings were true, and labeled The Truth. Truth is absolute, it does not change. Now it certainly it is to be considered that even though Absolute Truth does not change but the way in which each person, or group of persons sees, or views this truth may change. That makes each individual or group relational to Absolute Truth, but does not suggest that Absolute Truth is relative.

Long after I left the JW’s I began seeking this Absolute Truth. I began the long arduous process of seeking this Truth. From my upbringing one of the fundamental aspects drilled into me was that the Doctrine of the Trinity was completely false. That was my first doctrine to completely study out. I was fearful when I did. Why? I feared that what I had been taught as a child was true and if I found it to be true then maybe I had rejected truth and I didn’t want to do that any more. But I found out something completely different. The doctrine of the Trinity is the only explanation of the relational aspect of God that is fully Scripturally encompassing. I found that the Absolute Truth I was told was far from, and that the claims by those touting to be the standard bears for Absolute Truth were either liars and thus sinister, or completely misguided and ignorant.

It doesn’t matter what we believe. What matters is Truth.

-B.

 

[Jaded27]

b_justb:

It doesn’t matter what we believe. What matters is Truth.

-B.

Okay, so I’m all set then.
Why do you insist on trying to get into an argument with me?

 

[Catholic_Dude]

Im interested in this winter time thing.

Just because it was winter does that mean shepherds werent out?
Winter is not the same on all parts of the globe, there didnt have to be a foot of snow or chilling temperatures. I live in an area where the temp is mild most of the time.

What do people think about the argument that it couldnt have been winter time?

 

[b_justb]

Jaded27
Okay, so I’m all set then.
Why do you insist on trying to get into an argument with me

You deny the Trinity on the basis that it is unfounded in Scripture and was not taught by the Early Church Fathers. Both suppositions are false. How can you be set in truth if your basis for that truth is founded in lies?

 

[b_justb]

Catholic Dude:

Im interested in this winter time thing.

Just because it was winter does that mean shepherds werent out?
Winter is not the same on all parts of the globe, there didnt have to be a foot of snow or chilling temperatures. I live in an area where the temp is mild most of the time.

What do people think about the argument that it couldnt have been winter time?

The timing of Christmas has more to do with the fulfillment and the showing of perfection in the earthly ministry of Christ. But if a person or group can rally behind a literal acceptance of Dec 25th as the birth date of Jesus on earth and then show reasonable doubt as to that date being literally true. Then that person or group has built an argument to say or show that Christmas is “wrong” and therefore “bad.”

 

[Jaded27]

b_justb:

You deny the Trinity on the basis that it is unfounded in Scripture and was not taught by the Early Church Fathers. Both suppositions are false. How can you be set in truth if your basis for that truth is founded in lies?

Dude, you obviously have some inner child need to celebrate christmas or something. You are, I don’t, so lets just leave it at that shall we?

someone who “used to be a JW” is not a good source of info on anything like this because sometimes people will try to spread lies about our religion since they are mad at it.

I shared the correct answer to a question that was asked. That’s what its’ here for right? How can you have a JW section and not welcome the opinion of JWs?

 

[b_justb]

Jaded27:

Dude, you obviously have some inner child need to celebrate christmas or something. You are, I don’t, so lets just leave it at that shall we?

Childhood need to celebrate Christmas? Child like need to worship God, sure. I love Christmas! As I said, it’s not about getting stuff and lights. It’s about taking the time to recognize that God became flesh and dwelt among us. How awesome is that? The JW’s denial of who Jesus is denies them the joy of Christmas. Leave it at that? OK by me.

Jaded27:

someone who “used to be a JW” is not a good source of info on anything like this because sometimes people will try to spread lies about our religion since they are mad at it.

If you see me spreading any lies about what the JW’s taught, as it is clear I am not up to speed as to all the current teachings, then you should call me on it. Just as I will you for even suggesting that there is paganism involved in Catholicism.

Jaded27:

I shared the correct answer to a question that was asked. That’s what its’ here for right? How can you have a JW section and not welcome the opinion of JWs?

Opines are fine and dandy, we all have them and offer them. As far as to the correctness of your answers to any questions, that remains to be seen. If the JW’s can dish it out, then they should be able to take it. If you can’t take it, then don’t dish it out. You views are welcome, but that doesn’t mean you get a free ride to go unchallenged. If you hold to Truth as you think you do, this should not be a problem at all, but instead you should welcome it.

 

[jediliz]

I don’t need to be a child to appreciate why we celebrate Jesus’ birth at Christmas time. I’ve outgrown Santa Claus. I celebrate Jesus’ birthday because humbled himself to come to earth as a human child. He was born in a stable/cave. There were no warm comfortable maternity wards/newborn baby nurseries back then. He was probably lucky to have a select few garments as a newborn.

My nieces and nephews (nearly 6, nearly 4, almost 4 1/2, 17 months and 14 months) are learning that Christmas isn’t about receiving gifts, but about the BEST Gift of ALL: JESUS.

 

[Jaded27]

b_justb:

If you hold to Truth as you think you do, this should not be a problem at all, but instead you should welcome it.

I don’t welcome arguing.

 

[Jaded27]

jediliz:

I don’t need to be a child to appreciate why we celebrate Jesus’ birth at Christmas time. I’ve outgrown Santa Claus. I celebrate Jesus’ birthday because humbled himself to come to earth as a human child. He was born in a stable/cave. There were no warm comfortable maternity wards/newborn baby nurseries back then. He was probably lucky to have a select few garments as a newborn.

My nieces and nephews (nearly 6, nearly 4, almost 4 1/2, 17 months and 14 months) are learning that Christmas isn’t about receiving gifts, but about the BEST Gift of ALL: JESUS.

That’s good for you then. Most kids are all about “what’s santa bringing me” without caring anything for religion. I sure don’t want my children behaving that way if my husband chooses to have them celebrate it. So good.

 

[b_justb]

Jaded27:

I don’t welcome arguing.

So then don’t. But we can discuss, reason, pontificate, even blather.