Keep Mormons in your prayers

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Marie5890 said:
I dont get the comparison. Doctrinelly, polygamy still exists, even if not practised at this time. It, by LDS theolog, does exist in the afterlife. Infact I think there are a few general authorities of the 12 and FP who are sealed to more than one woman. So its not the same.

The LDS church of recent has even acknowledge that Smith had anywhere from 30-40 wives. Some of whom were still married to other men.
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Yes it’s a bit ironic that the churches founding “apostles” were polygamists and yet polygamists (whose behavior according to LDS theology is just fine) are lumped together with those homosexuals who get married and that the equally sinful cohabitating are given a pass.
 
Marie5890 said:
And we are talking infants here. They are not of an age when they will be watching their peers get baptized.

Also, they do not have to wait until the age of majority and then appeal to the Vatican.
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So it is something like this that has you concerned, the hurt that this can bring to children who don’t really get what goes on with their parents, yes?
Child upset because baptism was cancelled
 
LeavesInTheWind said:
On the off chance anyone is curious, this is what one of our church leaders has to say on the policy change.

youtube.com/watch?v=iEEMyc6aZms
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I did watch it.
I see a man who knows that they messed up and they are trying to clean up there mess.

Doesnt even have the courage to be interviewed by a reporter, but rather an employee of the LDS church.

That answers nothing. If anything, I see more questions that need to be asked.
And equating it with polygamy when polygamy is doctrinally accepted, and even practised in a round about way with a few of it’s “apostles”?

They are in damage control, especially for their members. Serious damage control.
 
zaffiroborant said:
So it is something like this that has you concerned, the hurt that this can bring to children who don’t really get what goes on with their parents, yes?
Child upset because baptism was cancelled
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yep.

Children this young are not going to understand. ALl they know is that they cant get baptized, even though their friends are.

It’s marginalizing to a child. It’s a stigma.
These are things that hurt the psyche of developing children.
“Jesus was baptized. My friend Cindy is going to be baptized. Why can’t I be baptized too?”

This is how a child’s mind works
 
Would love to see how someone would explain to a child why their friends can get baptized, like Jesus, but not them.
 
LeavesInTheWind said:
At first hearing this I was a bit taken aback. After considering it for a while and a few of the potential reasons it made more sense.

In any case, prayers are always welcome 👍
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As the LDS church teaches and functions, I see it as not surprising. What reasons are you alluding to?

The one I can think of, is like polygamy, where supporters had to be gleaned out to end it, the same strategy is being used to glean out the supporters of same sex marriage.
 
RebeccaJ said:
As the LDS church teaches and functions, I see it as not surprising. What reasons are you alluding to?

The one I can think of, is like polygamy, where supporters had to be gleaned out to end it, the same strategy is being used to glean out the supporters of same sex marriage.
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I think this may be why LDS leadership is doing this. They do not want people sympathetic to same sex marriage in the LDS church.

While this hasn’t affected me emotionally, I have friends who are faithful LDS who are absolutely heartbroken.
 
Marie5890 said:
yep.

Children this young are not going to understand. ALl they know is that they cant get baptized, even though their friends are.

It’s marginalizing to a child. It’s a stigma.
These are things that hurt the psyche of developing children.
“Jesus was baptized. My friend Cindy is going to be baptized. Why can’t I be baptized too?”

This is how a child’s mind works
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I have now had time to think about the new policy. In general I am in agreement with it. I particularly think it is good that they made such clear statements. The church cannot, will not, condone the behavior and will not yeild ground. But at the same time it is important to love those in this difficult situations. Here is how the new policy helps in loving the children and preventing rifts between his or her parents.

A gay parent knowing that their child will not be allowed baptized, can explain the situation to the child. They can explain that the LDS church believes same sex marriage is wrong but that they do not want to cause a wedge between parents and children on the matter so they have taken the matter off the table until the child is an adult.

Think of the reverse situation. Suppose a child is being cared for by a gay or lesbian couple and the child is baptized. As many on the forum know, this means that even if the child does not attend church they will be contacted from time to time by Primary, home teachers, and invited to various activities. In the LDS church once your baptized you are part of the fold. Even if you think you are out, members still want to reach out to you and welcome you back. But in this situation it will likely cause continued difficulties because the two opposing view points will be brought into contrast again and again in the child’s mind.

Elder Christofferson discussed the policy last night and said,
We don’t want there to be the conflicts that that would engender, we don’t want the child to have to deal with issues that might arise where the parents feel one way and the expectations of the church are very different. And so, with the other ordinances on through baptism and so on, there’s time for that, if, when that child reaches [legal age], he or she feels like that’s what they want. youtube.com/watch?v=iEEMyc6aZms
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Janderich said:
I have now had time to think about the new policy. In general I am in agreement with it. I particularly think it is good that they made such clear statements. The church cannot, will not, condone the behavior and will not yeild ground. But at the same time it is important to love those in this difficult situations. Here is how the new policy helps in loving the children and preventing rifts between his or her parents.

A gay parent knowing that their child will not be allowed baptized, can explain the situation to the child. They can explain that the LDS church believes same sex marriage is wrong but that they do not want to cause a wedge between parents and children on the matter so they have taken the matter off the table until the child is an adult.

Think of the reverse situation. Suppose a child is being cared for by a gay or lesbian couple and the child is baptized. As many on the forum know, this means that even if the child does not attend church they will be contacted from time to time by Primary, home teachers, and invited to various activities. In the LDS church once your baptized you are part of the fold. Even if you think you are out, members still want to reach out to you and welcome you back. But in this situation it will likely cause continued difficulties because the two opposing view points will be brought into contrast again and again in the child’s mind.

Elder Christofferson discussed the policy last night and said,
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This doesn’t make sense to me. There are children in mixed religion marriages, children in households where ther parents are living together but not married, children where neither parent is LDS. Any of these children can have a Mormon baptism. What is different about a child who has one gay parent and one who is not?
 
We can look at this situation in a different way. Most of us know the LDS faith is a church built on falsehood and heresy. Most of us know people are leaving the LDS in record numbers. Maybe this is the beginning of the end. Maybe this is the LDS faith starting to implode from within.

I think we as Christians need to be ready to welcome and help heal the wounds of those affected by this decision.
 
Horton said:
We can look at this situation in a different way. Most of us know the LDS faith is a church built on falsehood and heresy. Most of us know people are leaving the LDS in record numbers. Maybe this is the beginning of the end. Maybe this is the LDS faith starting to implode from within.

I think we as Christians need to be ready to welcome and help heal the wounds of those affected by this decision.
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I don’t see supporters of same sex marriage, would consider the Catholic Church.
 
RebeccaJ said:
This doesn’t make sense to me. There are children in mixed religion marriages, children in households where ther parents are living together but not married, children where neither parent is LDS. Any of these children can have a Mormon baptism. What is different about a child who has one gay parent and one who is not?
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In my opinion, the difference with gay marriage is that the LDS church has defined it as apostasy and baptizing a child when the parent is considered an apostate raises all sorts of issues within the home.
 
Horton said:
We can look at this situation in a different way. Most of us know the LDS faith is a church built on falsehood and heresy. Most of us know people are leaving the LDS in record numbers. Maybe this is the beginning of the end. Maybe this is the LDS faith starting to implode from within.

I think we as Christians need to be ready to welcome and help heal the wounds of those affected by this decision.
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Statements such as yours have been made for almost 200 years and yet the church continues to grow.
 
Janderich said:
In my opinion, the difference with gay marriage is that the LDS church has defined it as apostasy and baptizing a child when the parent is considered an apostate raises all sorts of issues within the home.
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Are all children of Mormon apostates denied baptism? I’m pretty sure not. So still doesn’t make any sense.

Seems very strange to me, that if there is a straight LDS parent who wants their child baptized, it isn’t going to happen because the other parent is gay and married someone of the same sex.

What if a parent is divorced from a same sex marriage?
 
RebeccaJ said:
I don’t see supporters of same sex marriage, would consider the Catholic Church.
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I agree. I guess I could have been a little more clear in my statement. I feel this new policy will cause many in the LDS church to consider the truth of the LDS faith. When those who start to question decide they need to leave, we as Catholic Christians need to be ready to welcome and heal.

Even if a family has a member in a same sex marriage, the family may need a soft place to land as their world turns upside down, and we as a church can be that place.

I’m not condoning same sex marriage in any way. I hope that helps.
 
RebeccaJ said:
Are all children of Mormon apostates denied baptism? I’m pretty sure not. So still doesn’t make any sense.

Seems very strange to me, that if there is a straight LDS parent who wants their child baptized, it isn’t going to happen because the other parent is gay and married someone of the same sex.

What if a parent is divorced from a same sex marriage?
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Children of polygamous marriages are not to be baptized until they are 18 leave the home and recognize polygamy as wrong. This situation is very similar.

I feel fairly confident that the updates to Handbook I don’t address all scenarios. There are a number of situations that will have to be handled on a case by case basis. That is why I said in general I am in agreement with it.
 
While I don’t find the general principle scandalous, these two salient points I believe are troublesome, and further distinguish the LDS practice from the Catholic practice:
Marie5890 said:
Also, they do not have to wait until the age of majority and then appeal to the Vatican.
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iepuras said:
The situation with children of divorced parents with one LDS parent and one homosexual parent is the much more likely situation. Frankly, if the LDS church wants to keep the LDS parent and children in their church, this is not the way to do it.
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Just as many Catholic parishes will refuse baptism for a child brought to the parish priest by a gay or lesbian couple since the “founded hope that the infant will be brought up in the Catholic religion” is all together lacking, an analogous situation with a Mormon same sex couple makes sense. As iepuras points out this isn’t likely to represent the majority of cases though. I don’t see why a child couldn’t be initiated into a religion while (s)he has at least one active, practicing parent in the fold.
RebeccaJ said:
The result with polygamy, are break offs of Mormonism. Could see the same happen again here.
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You think there’ll be a Homosexual Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints?
 
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