Kenosis debate- assistance needed

[Lov3sJesus]

I have a protestant minister who I know and I am trying to point them in the right direction concerning Christ knowing that he was God from His conception. I have various arguments based on what the Church teaches, but I need some scriptural arguments to back this up… I am not a theologian so would appreciate some help in this matter. Its pretty serious that I come up with something to change their mind…

Here is a particular difficult verse to battle with
Matt 2:52

Jesus advanced [in] wisdom and age and favor before God and man- the minister points out this verse that states that this supports his argument because he “advances in wisdom, age, and favor before God,” and uses this to state support his case. I know what the Church teaches, I need some scriptural interpretation here for my protestant brother

 

[Lov3sJesus]

The Church teaches that Jesus always knew He was God even from the moment of His conception, therefore He always knew.

 

[Julia_Mae]

The Church teaches that Jesus always knew He was God even from the moment of His conception, therefore He always knew.

Really? Where does the Church say this?

 

[Lov3sJesus]

1. Now the only-begotten Son of God embraced us in His infinite knowledge and undying love even before the world began. And that He might give a visible and exceedingly beautiful expression to this love, He assumed our nature in hypostatic union: hence - as Maximus of Turin with a certain unaffected simplicity remarks - “in Christ our own flesh loves us.”[156] But the knowledge and love of our Divine Redeemer, of which we were the object from the first moment of His Incarnation, exceed all that the human intellect can hope to grasp. For hardly was He conceived in the womb of the Mother of God, when He began to enjoy the Beatific Vision, and in that vision all the members of His Mystical Body were continually and unceasingly present to Him, and He embraced them with His redeeming love.

Source:

vatican.va/holy_father/pius_xii/encyclicals/documents/hf_p-xii_enc_29061943_mystici-corporis-christi_en.html

Hence, if He had Beatific Vision He knew He was God.

Second, here’s a link to this source as well:

IMPORTANT, Read The document before going to check the number. AFTER reading the introduction, check number 35

papalencyclicals.net/Pius10/p10lamen.htm

 

[Julia_Mae]

Well, whatever mystical Truth is being expressed here, Jesus was fully human and completely shared our human experience. Human babies don’t know anything when they are born.

 

[Heuchler]

“In the beginning there was the Word, and the Word was with God and the Word was God.” So, there is the word which is God and the word was one with the Father. “And the Word became flesh” The Word became flesh, took on a human nature and is known as Jesus Christ. The Word was around since the beginning and was always God. Christ was always God.

“And the angel answering, said to her: The Holy Ghost shall come upon you and the power of the Most High shall overshadow you. And therefore also the Holy which shall be born of you shall be called the Son of God.” Christ was God from birth.

When Christ was lost in the temple and Mary and Joseph found him, " And he said to them: How is it that you sought me? Did you not know that I must be about my father’s business?" Why would Christ refer to God as His Father unless He was always the Son of God who was the Word of God who was God. And besides this was a new concept at the time to refer to God (whose name they were not even to pronouce) as their Father.

To address the verse that your friend has used: that verse seems to display more that time passed and that Christ grew up instead of him physically learning or growing in grace because just a few verses earlier we hear that he was amazing the men in the temple with his wisdom. However, this is my interpretation and it may be best to try and find a scholars view on this through a nice google search

I hope this helps, just be kind in your dealings with him and pray constantly about this. Don’t be too militant in trying to convince him because a lot of the times our beliefs aren’t based on the truth but more on what we want to be true so just be careful and make sure not to come off as mean or pushy with your arguments. So good luck and I hope you bring about their conversion.