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Kts1816
Guest
I think that most people know when to stand up (esspecially for the reading of the Gospel)
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Kts1816
Guest
That was my other suggestion
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DeniseNY
Guest
In my Byzantine parish:
Priest : Wisdom! Let us stand and listen to the reading of the holy Gospel according to St. XXXX
Response: Glory be to you o Lord, glory be to You
Priest: Let us be attentive
Priest : Wisdom! Let us stand and listen to the reading of the holy Gospel according to St. XXXX
Response: Glory be to you o Lord, glory be to You
Priest: Let us be attentive
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exnihilo
Guest
At my parish everyone knows when to sit and stand. They certainly know that for the Gospel.
I think there can be some issues around anything out of the ordinary. In that I would include the blessings of the ashes and distribution, or the sequence of readings at the Easter Vigil. For instance yesterday I assume we should have stood for the blessing of the ashes as that was an ‘oremus’. But we sat as that was the posture during the homily which proceeded it. We weren’t instructed to stand. Our priest has specifically instructed us to sit during the various ‘oremus’ during the Easter Vigil readings.
If instructed I’d prefer a simple ‘please stand’, ‘please rise’, or ‘please sit’. It is a command with a please in front of it. It is polite but to the point.
I think there can be some issues around anything out of the ordinary. In that I would include the blessings of the ashes and distribution, or the sequence of readings at the Easter Vigil. For instance yesterday I assume we should have stood for the blessing of the ashes as that was an ‘oremus’. But we sat as that was the posture during the homily which proceeded it. We weren’t instructed to stand. Our priest has specifically instructed us to sit during the various ‘oremus’ during the Easter Vigil readings.
If instructed I’d prefer a simple ‘please stand’, ‘please rise’, or ‘please sit’. It is a command with a please in front of it. It is polite but to the point.
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neophyte
Guest
Neither of them are correct. There is no way to correctly insert a liturgical novelty into the Mass.
It would be preferable for the Priest to give a brief remedial explanation before the start of the service.
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Fauken
Guest
When I attend an EF Mass, there is no “prompt” to stand for the gospel, but during the homily, the priest re-reads the epistle and gospel in English. Before he reads the gospel, he asks us to stand for it.
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pnewton
Guest
When I first switched to Jubilate Deo a few years back, it took a few weeks for people to get use to kneeling and standing at the right time. Weird. So I had to say, “Please kneel/stand.” I noted this year everyone pretty much caught on the first time Ash Wednesday. I guess I am not past prompting.
In my parish most people just know when to stand or sit. lf for some reason no one does then the priest may make a motion to suggest standing. If that is not enough he or the cantor may say something.
If people don’t stand it’s usually because there are mostly visitors or something out of the ordinary is going on to throw people off.
If people don’t stand it’s usually because there are mostly visitors or something out of the ordinary is going on to throw people off.
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Edmundus1581
Guest
The role of the “commentator” is misnamed, as it gives the impression that it’s not an official liturgical role.
The role is provided for in the GIRM, and can be of use in the liturgy. If there is no commentator then the priest will have to do a little bit more, such as ensuring that the collections are taken up at the right time, or starting a hymn - especially if there’s no choir or cantor.
In our parish the commentator’s primary role is to invite everyone to stand at the beginning of Mass, announce the hymns and to say a few words about parts of the Mass which are optional, such as collections. Unfortunately the habit of saying “Please stand to welcome the gospel” has crept in, and there is confusion about whether it’s required, or customary, or unwanted. I tried to raise the matter at a liturgy committee meeting and they couldn’t have cared less.
This is an excellent article on how the role of commentator is envisaged, in answering a question about a typical abuse (ie. the overuse of the role).
http://www.ewtn.com/library/Liturgy/zlitur227.htm
The role is provided for in the GIRM, and can be of use in the liturgy. If there is no commentator then the priest will have to do a little bit more, such as ensuring that the collections are taken up at the right time, or starting a hymn - especially if there’s no choir or cantor.
In our parish the commentator’s primary role is to invite everyone to stand at the beginning of Mass, announce the hymns and to say a few words about parts of the Mass which are optional, such as collections. Unfortunately the habit of saying “Please stand to welcome the gospel” has crept in, and there is confusion about whether it’s required, or customary, or unwanted. I tried to raise the matter at a liturgy committee meeting and they couldn’t have cared less.
This is an excellent article on how the role of commentator is envisaged, in answering a question about a typical abuse (ie. the overuse of the role).
http://www.ewtn.com/library/Liturgy/zlitur227.htm
Agreed.
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Edmundus1581
Guest
Having thought about this overnight, I’ve reconsidered my response.Thank you Edmundus for your thoughts and time. God bless.
This question is a thorny issue for me because of a long history in my own parish, as I’ve alluded to. We say “Please stand to welcome the gospel”, which is far too much, as it includes an significant theological direction on why the congregation should stand - a theological addition to the Mass which is sloppy and unapproved.
Your parish’s custom of “Kindly stand for the Gospel Acclamation” is actually quite minimal. It just says when to stand, not why. The alternative that some have proposed to you “Kindly stand for the Gospel” goes beyond the minimal, but is still better than “to welcome the Gospel”.
So, please consult your priest or liturgy committee so that it’s clear what is to be said, and then there’s no objection.
After that, I’d be happy with it.
I think I over-reacted.
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pnewton
Guest
I only have the role by default, as the guy leading music. It is so strange how people can stand or kneel automatically to musical cues, but change the music and the cues go away. Our priest takes the role of commentator mostly. I just do the first part, as the priest is outside the door.
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Edmundus1581
Guest
Good observation - thanks!
When I’m commentating I lead the gospel acclamation by singing the Alleluia, and the congregation follows and stands without prompting.
Once I accidentally sang the tune for the Alleliah we’d used in the choir that morning, but was unfamiliar at the evening Mass and needed accompaniment. Not helpful!
When the commentators first appeared at our parish I was annoyed - as is my typical reactionary response to any change. But over time I realised that they were making a contribution by relieving the priest of both saying things, such as introducing hymns when there’s no choir, and also of watching what’s happening, such as ensuring that the offertory gifts are brought up. The commentator will normally do this invisibly to the congregation - but it’s happening. Our priest has mentioned that this role (Ie. the commentator’s) is a “ministry”, and different from the priest’s
Even when there’s a choir, Mass seems to run more smoothly if the commentator introduces the hymns, and the choir focuses on singing.
Not a disagreement with yours, btw, but a comment
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JohnLilburne
Guest
The liturgical books envisage silence after the second reading.
From the General Introduction to the Lectionary for Mass:
“e) SILENCE
28. The liturgy of the word must be celebrated in a way that fosters meditation; clearly, any sort of haste that hinders recollection must be avoided. The dialogue between God and his people taking place through the Holy Spirit demands short intervals of silence, suited to the assembled congregation, as an opportunity to take the word of God to heart and to prepare a response to it in prayer.
Proper times for silence during the liturgy of the word are, for example, before this liturgy begins, after the first and the second reading, after the homily.”
From the General Instruction of the Roman Missal (GIRM):
“45. Sacred silence also, as part of the celebration, is to be observed at the designated times.[Sacrosanctum Concilium 30; Musicam Sacram 17] Its nature, however, depends on the moment when it occurs in the different parts of the celebration. For in the Penitential Act and again after the invitation to pray, individuals recollect themselves; whereas after a reading or after the Homily, all meditate briefly on what they have heard; then after Communion, they praise God in their hearts and pray to him. …”
So if the congregation automatically stand after saying “Thanks be to God” there does not seem to be any time to “meditate briefly on what they have heard”. Perhaps the commentator would need to announce: “Please remain seated as we meditate on the reading.”
So after this period of silence there needs to be cue to stand for the Gospel Acclamation. Perhaps a commentator’s announcement, perhaps an organ, perhaps the cantor standing.
The reader is not the commentator. The reader is at the ambo. The commentator is not at the ambo (GIRM 105b).
The Order of Mass has: “12. …. To indicate the end of the reading the reader acclaims:
The word of the Lord.” So this indicates the end of the reading, rather than the end of a period of silent meditation.
The Ceremonial of Bishops has: “140. … When the Alleluia begins, everyone but the bishop stands.” The bishop remains seated while he puts incense in the thurible, blesses it and blesses the deacon. So waiting for the bishop to stand does not work as a cue.
From the General Introduction to the Lectionary for Mass:
“e) SILENCE
28. The liturgy of the word must be celebrated in a way that fosters meditation; clearly, any sort of haste that hinders recollection must be avoided. The dialogue between God and his people taking place through the Holy Spirit demands short intervals of silence, suited to the assembled congregation, as an opportunity to take the word of God to heart and to prepare a response to it in prayer.
Proper times for silence during the liturgy of the word are, for example, before this liturgy begins, after the first and the second reading, after the homily.”
From the General Instruction of the Roman Missal (GIRM):
“45. Sacred silence also, as part of the celebration, is to be observed at the designated times.[Sacrosanctum Concilium 30; Musicam Sacram 17] Its nature, however, depends on the moment when it occurs in the different parts of the celebration. For in the Penitential Act and again after the invitation to pray, individuals recollect themselves; whereas after a reading or after the Homily, all meditate briefly on what they have heard; then after Communion, they praise God in their hearts and pray to him. …”
So if the congregation automatically stand after saying “Thanks be to God” there does not seem to be any time to “meditate briefly on what they have heard”. Perhaps the commentator would need to announce: “Please remain seated as we meditate on the reading.”
So after this period of silence there needs to be cue to stand for the Gospel Acclamation. Perhaps a commentator’s announcement, perhaps an organ, perhaps the cantor standing.
The reader is not the commentator. The reader is at the ambo. The commentator is not at the ambo (GIRM 105b).
The Order of Mass has: “12. …. To indicate the end of the reading the reader acclaims:
The word of the Lord.” So this indicates the end of the reading, rather than the end of a period of silent meditation.
The Ceremonial of Bishops has: “140. … When the Alleluia begins, everyone but the bishop stands.” The bishop remains seated while he puts incense in the thurible, blesses it and blesses the deacon. So waiting for the bishop to stand does not work as a cue.
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pnewton
Guest
I have never seen that. What I have only seen is that when the priest rises, everyone rises and the Acclamation begins.
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otjm
Guest
It may be that some parishes have continually had a comment about standing for the Gospel; but I sincerely doubt that after all these decades, the congregations are so dense that they would sit during the Gospel Acclimation if someone didn’t give them a prompt. Which is not to say that some parishioners might not be that dense; but the majority knows the patterns, prompts or no prompts.
And I will grant that Holy Saturday Night is an exception. However, a very mild hand signal from the pastor or the deacon should suffice. And if I recall correctly, Good Friday has the prompts built in and don’t need anyone else to prompt.
And I will grant that Holy Saturday Night is an exception. However, a very mild hand signal from the pastor or the deacon should suffice. And if I recall correctly, Good Friday has the prompts built in and don’t need anyone else to prompt.
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njlisa
Guest
Missals placed in the pews should suffice.
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mVitus
Guest
I haven’t yet seen a Church able to afford to have a missal in every part of the pews. I’m not saying it doesn’t exist, but it’s not a common thing, which negates its use as a tool.
Usually in my experience the cantor raises their arm as the signal to stand and doesn’t say any words prior to Alleluia.
Usually in my experience the cantor raises their arm as the signal to stand and doesn’t say any words prior to Alleluia.
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phil19034
Guest
Every Church I’ve been to, everyone knows to either stand when the priest stands or the cantor raises his/her hand for us to stand
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CelticWarlord
Guest
In the parishes I attend nothing is said. We all just stand at the appointed time. As a non-Catholic I was uncertain what to expect my first time, but after one Mass I knew to just stand when the others did.
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rondirect
Guest
Yes! For anyone to say anything before the Gospel Acclamation is sung is, to me, breaking the holy silence after the second reading. After a about 10-15 seconds, allowing the reader to calmly leave the Sanctuary, the music director and choir rise to sing and at the down beat of the GA, the priest and congregation then rise. To repeat please “stand for the Gospel” week after week, or even having a cantor gesture to rise is so redundant and not necessary IMHO.
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