Kissing the cross at Good Friday service

[porthos11]

Maybe you do. I do not. And all of this is bringing me closer and closer to making a promise before God that I will neither worship nor venerate any person or thing, with the exception of God in His three Persons. If I am wrong, God can correct me; He knows where I live.

I’m not trying to scare you into idolatry. All I’m saying is, read what the saints and the liturgy says. I’m Catholic and I worship God and God alone. But our liturgy is also an expression of our faith, so when we day “Come, let us adore” in response to “Behold the wood of the Cross”, we are invited to examine why. The Cross is so closely united to Christ and has become, as it were, an image of him. That’s why St. Thomas had no problem saying that we adore the Cross with latria because it is actually the latria to Christ himself.

Did you even read that section of the Summa and can you really say that you can argue with his logic? He wasn’t the Magisterium, yes, and he wasn’t a Pope, yes. But the Church uses it in her liturgy: “We worship your Cross O Lord” (Sept. 14 Lauds) and the Liturgy is indeed part of the Magisterium because it is promulgated with her own authority. And the Church, being infallible and indefectible, will not promulgate anything blasphemous or idolatrous. I therefore always start with this principle: “The Church is right, now I need to understand.”

I’m insisting on St. Thomas because it shows how rich the Catholic faith is and how healthy its regard is for created matter. It shows that we can indeed worship God through the things of this world he has united to himself, so we do not worship God in a vaccuum but with the entirety of our senses.

 

[MariaG]

A small but necessary correction

Catholics and everyone else are to “Worship” God alone

Everything else we can honor and reverence; but not “worship”

From New Advent.org. Link to below newadvent.org/cathen/15710a.htm

In accordance with these principles it will readily be understood that a certain worship may be offered even to inanimate objects, such as the relics of a martyr, the Cross of Christ, the Crown of Thorns, or even the statue or picture of a saint. There is here no confusion or danger of idolatry, for this worship is subordinate or dependent. The relic of the saint is venerated because of the link which unites it with the person who is adored or venerated; while the statue or picture is regarded as having a conventional relation to a person who has a right to our homage — as being a symbol which reminds us of that person (see Vacant, Diet de théol. cath., s.v. Adoration, and authors cited in bibliography; also ADORATION; IDOLATRY; IMAGES; DEVOTION TO THE BLESSED VIRGIN MARY).

 

[Mariem2]

The Good Friday ceremony has always been one of my favourite ceremonies, and “Behold the Wood of the Cross on which Hung the Saviour of the World” is one of my favourite hymns. It’s not about adoring a piece of wood from a hardware store, or kissing a lump of metal. It’s about an act of humility and acknowledgement of the sacrifice made for us by Our Lord Jesus Christ. Some people bow or just kiss their finger and then touch the cross. I’m always moved by the devotion and air of solemnity during that part of the ceremony.

 

[Brendan_64]

People kiss the balarney stone and don’t think anything of it.

People kiss their race car.

I have seen people kiss photographs.

Catholics kiss the ring of their bishop to show their respect for the office he holds.

Soldiers comming home kiss the ground.

St. Catherine Laboroure, when she lost her mom at 9, held a statue of Mary in her arms and said to Mary that she would be her mother now. That is just being human.

I feel rather confident that people who do these things are not really doing it to the things themselves but rather what is behind those things. It isn’t all that uncommon.

Just some thoughts.

Absolutely correct. I wear a ring given to me many years ago by my late father. I kiss it regularly. I do it in memory of my Dad and all that he means to me.

The silver cross that I wear around my neck, I kiss it every time I put it on or take it off. I do it in devotion, not to a lump of silver, but to our Lord.

Kissing the cross on Good Friday to me is an act of devotion and humilty to our Lord and to remind myself of the painful sacrifice Christ made for us during his scourging, his walk to Calvary and his crucifixion.

If people find it uncomfortable, then that could be used in a positive light; faith isn’t necessarily meant to be comfortable and doing things that put us out of our comfort zone is often a very good thing indeed.

But I really do not understand why someone would see this as wrong.

The Good Friday ceremony has always been one of my favourite ceremonies

Me too,

 

[PJM]

=MariaG;10571758]From New Advent.org. Link to below newadvent.org/cathen/15710a.htm

In accordance with these principles it will readily be understood that a certain worship may be offered even to inanimate objects, such as the relics of a martyr, the Cross of Christ, the Crown of Thorns, or even the statue or picture of a saint. There is here no confusion or danger of idolatry, for this worship is subordinate or dependent. The relic of the saint is venerated because of the link which unites it with the person who is adored or venerated; while the statue or picture is regarded as having a conventional relation to a person who has a right to our homage — as being a symbol which reminds us of that person (see Vacant, Diet de théol. cath., s.v. Adoration, and authors cited in bibliography; also ADORATION; IDOLATRY; IMAGES; DEVOTION TO THE BLESSED VIRGIN MARY).

I am signed up and receive their monthly paper. Love it!

But I hold to the position as I stated it.

 

[MariaG]

I am signed up and receive their monthly paper. Love it!

But I hold to the position as I stated it.

Okay. And if I were in a discussion with a Protestant, I may say the same. No, I would still try to explain things. Language usage, Latin etc.

In the Catholic Church it is clear that English is not as exact Latin. Because we do worship Mary, the saints, and even the cross. If one understands the definitions being used.

You can hold to the position all you want, but in doing so you may be jettisoning much of the richness of the Catholic Church in favor of incomplete explanations and understandings as well as allowing Protestant definitions define your faith.

Out of curiosity, do you pray to Mary and the saints? Would you say you ask them to pray for you? But would never say you pray to them?

And I realize tone here cannot be heard. No offense meant.

 

[porthos11]

Okay. And if I were in a discussion with a Protestant, I may say the same. No, I would still try to explain things. Language usage, Latin etc.

In the Catholic Church it is clear that English is not as exact Latin. Because we do worship Mary, the saints, and even the cross. If one understands the definitions being used.

You can hold to the position all you want, but in doing so you may be jettisoning much of the richness of the Catholic Church in favor of incomplete explanations and understandings as well as allowing Protestant definitions define your faith.

Out of curiosity, do you pray to Mary and the saints? Would you say you ask them to pray for you? But would never say you pray to them?

And I realize tone here cannot be heard. No offense meant.

The English word “worship” has been used for various degrees of veneration and honour, and to help distinguish it, the Greek terms latria, hyperdulia and dulia are used. Latria, meaning adoration, is reserved to God alone, hyperdulia to the Blessed Virgin and dulia to the other saints.

However, in the context of this thread, some have tried to explain away the worship of the cross by stating that we merely “venerate” (dulia) the Cross, but the Church has actually offered the worship of latria to the Cross (and thereby, to Christ). It’s therefore real worship, adoration, not mere veneration like we offer the Blessed Virgin. Trying to water it down by saying we merely “venerate” the Cross is not being true to the Church’s teaching and we owe it to the Church to understand her first before succumbing to our own fears and even prejudices.

 

[Ridgerunner]

Absolutely correct. I wear a ring given to me many years ago by my late father. I kiss it regularly. I do it in memory of my Dad and all that he means to me.

The silver cross that I wear around my neck, I kiss it every time I put it on or take it off. I do it in devotion, not to a lump of silver, but to our Lord.

Kissing the cross on Good Friday to me is an act of devotion and humilty to our Lord and to remind myself of the painful sacrifice Christ made for us during his scourging, his walk to Calvary and his crucifixion.

If people find it uncomfortable, then that could be used in a positive light; faith isn’t necessarily meant to be comfortable and doing things that put us out of our comfort zone is often a very good thing indeed.

But I really do not understand why someone would see this as wrong.

Me too,

I like it.

To me, going up and kissing the feet of Christ is an act of humility. I can get awfully full of myself at times, and that brings me back to the reality of things pretty dramatically. And, of course, here are all these other people; old ladies, little kids, scruffy guys and I’m put to wonder just which of them is the saint when I’m not. It’s humbling.

And I probably pick up more germs and nastier ones simply using the restroom in a convenience store than I’m likely to pick up by kissing the cross. In any event, I figure I’m going to get exposed to every germ around at some point or other, and I might as well get on with it.

 

[MariaG]

The English word “worship” has been used for various degrees of veneration and honour, and to help distinguish it, the Greek terms latria, hyperdulia and dulia are used. Latria, meaning adoration, is reserved to God alone, hyperdulia to the Blessed Virgin and dulia to the other saints.

However, in the context of this thread, some have tried to explain away the worship of the cross by stating that we merely “venerate” (dulia) the Cross, but the Church has actually offered the worship of latria to the Cross (and thereby, to Christ). It’s therefore real worship, adoration, not mere veneration like we offer the Blessed Virgin. Trying to water it down by saying we merely “venerate” the Cross is not being true to the Church’s teaching and we owe it to the Church to understand her first before succumbing to our own fears and even prejudices.

You are correct.

I think I was using kid gloves to try to get someone to, at the very least, use the term worship since it, at the very least, has 3 meanings.

I also realize, that I just needed to wrap my brain around a concept that my heart had already figured out. Makes me extremely happy!! Glad I read this thread and most especially glad I read the link!

 

[dessay]

I have been challenged on this issue of kissing crosses or kissing the popes ring on a number of occasions. It seems like an issue that won’t go away. It is difficult to discuss in a calm and sedate manner, like the homosexuality issue. It must involve issues that go deep into our psyche or soul or whatever. It deserves some deeper investigation.