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SavedbyHisBlood
Guest
Does anyone know the significance of this? I read that it was an apperation of the Virgin Mary but i really dont know much more about it.
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SpaceNeedle
Guest
This might be helpful reading:
sancta.org/juandiego.html
Our Lady’s appearance and message was the reason for conversions throughout Mexico.
What a wonderful thing.
sancta.org/juandiego.html
Our Lady’s appearance and message was the reason for conversions throughout Mexico.
What a wonderful thing.
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aicirt
Guest
The appariation to a Mexican Indian happened in the 1500s. Our Lady of Guadalupe is the patron of the Americas.
Juan Diego, the Indian to who she appeared, told his story to the bishop who made him return to the site having Juan request of the Lady a sign. Our Lady told him to fill his cloak with the roses growing there. The roses were known to grow in Spain yet here they were in Mexico in the winter. He gathered them up and returned to the bishop dropping his cloak. To the astonishment of both there was a picture of Our Lady along with the roses. The painting is now in a cathedral in Mexico City. It floats on the material. No one knows how it was achieved.
Many Indians were converted after her appearance and the slaughter caused by human sacrifice quickly came to an end. That’s the miracle. Juan Diego was later canonized.
If you google Our Lady of Guadalupe you’ll find all kinds of information.
Juan Diego, the Indian to who she appeared, told his story to the bishop who made him return to the site having Juan request of the Lady a sign. Our Lady told him to fill his cloak with the roses growing there. The roses were known to grow in Spain yet here they were in Mexico in the winter. He gathered them up and returned to the bishop dropping his cloak. To the astonishment of both there was a picture of Our Lady along with the roses. The painting is now in a cathedral in Mexico City. It floats on the material. No one knows how it was achieved.
Many Indians were converted after her appearance and the slaughter caused by human sacrifice quickly came to an end. That’s the miracle. Juan Diego was later canonized.
If you google Our Lady of Guadalupe you’ll find all kinds of information.
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John_Larocque
Guest
The Juan Diego canonization committee ignored presentations (including one from a Mexican Catholic prelate) which cast doubt that there even was a Juan Diego. But alas the deed is done, not much we can do about it now. The Juan Diego story is much like legends surrounding the scapular or the rosary, where, maybe 100 years after the fact, there will be a supernatural origin for it. I personally view the Guadalupe image as a pious painting that eventually developed an extraordinary story surrounding it, and which helped bring a lot of people into the Church and away from paganism, human sacrifice, and what not.
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aicirt
Guest
What is your opinion regarding the painting itself? The material has not deterioated in 500 years. My understanding is the material should only last at the most 50 years. The painting is said to float and really isn’t on the surface of the material. Supposedly, in one eye of the Virgin is Juan Diego and in the other the bishop. I believe that was just recently discovered.
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John_Larocque
Guest
While I recognize its role in the conversion of the American peoples, my view is that there is nothing supernatural about the image.
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allhers
Guest
…Go to the top of the hill and cut the flowers that are growing there. Bring them then to me."
While it was freezing on the hillside, Juan obeyed Mary’s instructions and went to the top
of the hill where he found a full bloom of Castilian roses. Removing his tilma, a poncho-
like cape made of cactus fiber, he cut the roses and carried them back to Mary. She
rearranged the roses and told him:
"My little son, this is the sign I am sending to the Bishop. Tell him that with this sign I
request his greatest efforts to complete the church I desire in this place…
He told the bishop his story and opened the tilma letting the flowers fall out. But it
wasn’t the beautiful roses that caused the bishop and his advisors to fall to their knees;
for there, on the tilma, was a picture of the Blessed Virgin Mary precisely as Juan had
described her…
“Call me and call my image Santa Maria de Guadalupe”.
It’s believed that the word Guadalupe was actually a Spanish mis-translation of the local
Aztec dialect. The word that Mary probably used was Coatlallope which means
“one who treads on snakes”! Within six years of this apparition, six million Aztecs had
converted to Catholicism. The tilma shows Mary as the God-bearer - she is pregnant with her Divine Son. Since the time the tilma was first impressed with a picture of the Mother of God, it has been subject to a variety of environmental hazards including smoke from fires and candles, water from floods and torrential downpours and, in 1921, a bomb which was planted by anti-clerical forces on an altar under it. There was also a cast-iron cross next to the tilma and when the bomb exploded, the cross was twisted out of shape, the marble altar rail was heavily damaged and the tilma was…untouched! Indeed, no one was injured in the Church despite the damage that occurred to a large part of the altar structure.
In 1977, the tilma was examined using infrared photography and digital enhancement techniques.
Unlike any painting, the tilma shows no sketching or any sign of outline drawn to permit an artist to produce a painting. Further, the very method used to create the image is still
unknown. The image is inexplicable in its longevity and method of production. It can be seen today in a large cathedral built to house up to ten thousand worshipers. It is, by far, the most popular religious pilgrimage site in the Western Hemisphere.
catholic.org/about/guadalupe.php
While it was freezing on the hillside, Juan obeyed Mary’s instructions and went to the top
of the hill where he found a full bloom of Castilian roses. Removing his tilma, a poncho-
like cape made of cactus fiber, he cut the roses and carried them back to Mary. She
rearranged the roses and told him:
"My little son, this is the sign I am sending to the Bishop. Tell him that with this sign I
request his greatest efforts to complete the church I desire in this place…
He told the bishop his story and opened the tilma letting the flowers fall out. But it
wasn’t the beautiful roses that caused the bishop and his advisors to fall to their knees;
for there, on the tilma, was a picture of the Blessed Virgin Mary precisely as Juan had
described her…
“Call me and call my image Santa Maria de Guadalupe”.
It’s believed that the word Guadalupe was actually a Spanish mis-translation of the local
Aztec dialect. The word that Mary probably used was Coatlallope which means
“one who treads on snakes”! Within six years of this apparition, six million Aztecs had
converted to Catholicism. The tilma shows Mary as the God-bearer - she is pregnant with her Divine Son. Since the time the tilma was first impressed with a picture of the Mother of God, it has been subject to a variety of environmental hazards including smoke from fires and candles, water from floods and torrential downpours and, in 1921, a bomb which was planted by anti-clerical forces on an altar under it. There was also a cast-iron cross next to the tilma and when the bomb exploded, the cross was twisted out of shape, the marble altar rail was heavily damaged and the tilma was…untouched! Indeed, no one was injured in the Church despite the damage that occurred to a large part of the altar structure.
In 1977, the tilma was examined using infrared photography and digital enhancement techniques.
Unlike any painting, the tilma shows no sketching or any sign of outline drawn to permit an artist to produce a painting. Further, the very method used to create the image is still
unknown. The image is inexplicable in its longevity and method of production. It can be seen today in a large cathedral built to house up to ten thousand worshipers. It is, by far, the most popular religious pilgrimage site in the Western Hemisphere.
catholic.org/about/guadalupe.php
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allhers
Guest
Before concluding his presentation, Dr. Orozco made mention of two miracles associated with the Tilma.
The first occurred in 1785 when a worker accidentally spilled a 50 percent nitric acid solvent on the right side of the cloth. “Besides any natural explanation, the acid has not destroyed the fabric of the cloth, indeed it has not even destroyed the colored parts of the image,” Orozco said.
The second miracle was the explosion of a bomb near the Tilma in 1921. Dr. Orozco recalled that the explosion broke the marble floor and widows 150 meters from the explosion, but “unexpectedly, neither the Tilma nor the normal glass that protected the Tilma was damaged or broken.” The only damage near it was a brass crucifix that was twisted by the blast.
He continued, “There are no explanations why the shockwave that broke windows 150 meters afar did not destroy the normal glass that protected the image. Some people said that the Son by means of the brass crucifix protected the image of His Mother. The real fact is that we don’t have a natural explanation for this event.”
Dr. Orozco thanked the audience for listening to his presentation and closed by reassuring them that “Our Lady visited Mexico 478 years ago, but she remains there to give Her Love, Her Mercy and Her Care to anyone who needs it, and to bring Her Son, Jesus Christ to everyone who receives Him.”
catholicnewsagency.com/new.php?n=16789
The first occurred in 1785 when a worker accidentally spilled a 50 percent nitric acid solvent on the right side of the cloth. “Besides any natural explanation, the acid has not destroyed the fabric of the cloth, indeed it has not even destroyed the colored parts of the image,” Orozco said.
The second miracle was the explosion of a bomb near the Tilma in 1921. Dr. Orozco recalled that the explosion broke the marble floor and widows 150 meters from the explosion, but “unexpectedly, neither the Tilma nor the normal glass that protected the Tilma was damaged or broken.” The only damage near it was a brass crucifix that was twisted by the blast.
He continued, “There are no explanations why the shockwave that broke windows 150 meters afar did not destroy the normal glass that protected the image. Some people said that the Son by means of the brass crucifix protected the image of His Mother. The real fact is that we don’t have a natural explanation for this event.”
Dr. Orozco thanked the audience for listening to his presentation and closed by reassuring them that “Our Lady visited Mexico 478 years ago, but she remains there to give Her Love, Her Mercy and Her Care to anyone who needs it, and to bring Her Son, Jesus Christ to everyone who receives Him.”
catholicnewsagency.com/new.php?n=16789
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John_Larocque
Guest
I’m not surprised at the possible “treads on snakes” origin of the name. She is doing just that in the image. It is likely a reference to St. Jerome’s translation of Genesis 3:15 (which inspired a great deal of Catholic art). Altough corrected in the Nova Vulgata in 1978, St. Jerome’s version of the text was cited as proof-text in “Ineffabilis Deus” in 1854.
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Eddie_Mac
Guest
Mr. Larocque,
There are lots of Catholics that believe and follow unapproved apparitions.
I really don’t know of all that many who cast doubt on approved ones.
Your option, I guess.
I read in True Devotion to the Blessed Virgin #66, St. Louis de Montfort writes “Let no one presume to expect mercy from God, who offends his holy Mother.”
Believe what you want, or better said, what you don’t want.
The perfect and easy way to Jesus is through His Mother, Mary, Our Lady of Guadalupe.
For an interesting read, and something that ties some of the apparitions of Our Lady together, including Our Lady of Guadalupe, follow the link.
ewtn.com/library/mary/olislam.htm
The salvation of many peoples will be achieved through Our Blessed Mother.
When you are ready to accept Our Lady and her help to Her Son, I suggest the Total Consecration to Jesus Through Mary.
Prayerfully,
Eddie Mac
There are lots of Catholics that believe and follow unapproved apparitions.
I really don’t know of all that many who cast doubt on approved ones.
Your option, I guess.
I read in True Devotion to the Blessed Virgin #66, St. Louis de Montfort writes “Let no one presume to expect mercy from God, who offends his holy Mother.”
Believe what you want, or better said, what you don’t want.
The perfect and easy way to Jesus is through His Mother, Mary, Our Lady of Guadalupe.
For an interesting read, and something that ties some of the apparitions of Our Lady together, including Our Lady of Guadalupe, follow the link.
ewtn.com/library/mary/olislam.htm
The salvation of many peoples will be achieved through Our Blessed Mother.
When you are ready to accept Our Lady and her help to Her Son, I suggest the Total Consecration to Jesus Through Mary.
Prayerfully,
Eddie Mac
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brotherhrolf
Guest
Our Lady of Guadalupe is, indeed the patroness of the Americas. New Orleans has had an OLOG parish for over a hundred years and my cathedral parish in Baton Rouge has a full-sized image of the tilma framed and on display. It is not a Mexican cultural affectation because this is French south Louisiana.
For those of us who grew up before Vatican II, we recited the Memorare. Haven’t heard it at all of late because we might upset our Protestant brethren.
The Blessed Mother is a powerful intercessor on our behalf.
For those of us who grew up before Vatican II, we recited the Memorare. Haven’t heard it at all of late because we might upset our Protestant brethren.
The Blessed Mother is a powerful intercessor on our behalf.
J
John_Larocque
Guest
These links cover the ground better than anything I can offer but it tells you where I am coming from. And as you say, people are free to believe what they want, or not.
latinamericanstudies.org/religion/myth.htm
findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m1058/is_15_119/ai_90190872/
defunct link at CSICOP
latinamericanstudies.org/religion/myth.htm
findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m1058/is_15_119/ai_90190872/
defunct link at CSICOP
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Eileen_T
Guest
I read somewhere that at the time of the apparitions, in Europe, millions of Catholics had left the Church to become Protestants, and roughly the same number of Aztecs converted to the Catholic Faith.
Reminds me of the number of Israelites who were slain for worshipping the Golden Calf matched the numbers who were baptised at Pentecost.
The image with all its symbols said more than mere words ever could.
Read this to see how it is still relevant for today.
Reminds me of the number of Israelites who were slain for worshipping the Golden Calf matched the numbers who were baptised at Pentecost.
The image with all its symbols said more than mere words ever could.
Read this to see how it is still relevant for today.
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mardukm
Guest
The Lady of Guadalupe seems to predate the apparition to Juan Diego.
The Lady of Guadalupe is connected to the ancient icon of the Black Madonna in Guadalupe, Spain.
Interestingly, Mexicans sometimes call the Lady of Guadalupe the “Brown Madonna.”
What reasons do people give for doubting that Juan Diego ever existed?
Blessings
The Lady of Guadalupe is connected to the ancient icon of the Black Madonna in Guadalupe, Spain.
Interestingly, Mexicans sometimes call the Lady of Guadalupe the “Brown Madonna.”
What reasons do people give for doubting that Juan Diego ever existed?
Blessings
M
Mike_Dye
Guest
Please check out all of the information provided. It is a wonderful true story. Mike Dye
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Like
Guest
John, I can’t get your 1st. link to open, but the second one is not even a Catholic site.
The Christian Century Foundation:
christiancentury.org/cpage.lasso?cid=2 and here is their mission statement:
" For decades, the Christian Century has informed and shaped progressive, mainline Christianity. Committed to “thinking critically and living faithfully,” the magazine explores through argument and reflection what it means to believe and live out the Christian faith in our time. As a voice of “generous orthodoxy,” the Century is both loyal to the church and open to the world."
Here are some Knights of Columbus sites on “Our Lady of Guadalupe”
secretsoftheimage.org/en/index.html
truthsoftheimage.org/en/index.html
guadalupebook.com/en/index.html
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Eddie_Mac
Guest
You really are going to have to come uo with more reliable sources than the Washington Post.
Eddie Mac
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aicirt
Guest
Last night on THE WORLD OVER, EWTN, it was reported changes have been made in the Mass. I was wondering if that will include the Memorare.
This thing about upsetting our Protestant brethren: how many have converted because we’ve changed the Mass, removed statues etc? How many come to a Mass? I’ve never understood this reasoning.
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John_Larocque
Guest
From the Knights of Columbus site:
I remember the old Douay Rheims bible footnotes which said that the woman was the Church. But it identified the woman as the Vigin Mary in an allegorical way.
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brotherhrolf
Guest
Probably not. The Memorare was never part of Mass. We could talk about the decline of devotion to Our Lady which followed after Vatican II. It was certainly a different world before.
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