Large Families on Purpose

[jmjZelie]

Rob’s Wife said:

eta2 ugh. I hadn’t read other comments before replying. Probably shouldn’t have bothered replying.

My reply:
I am so sorry to see that you feel you shouldn’t have replied. I think a lot of people are less than pleased about the fact that I have been asking these questions. For what it is worth, I truly appreciated your original post and responded at length. God bless you.

 

[Rob_s_Wife]

Rob’s Wife said:

eta2 ugh. I hadn’t read other comments before replying. Probably shouldn’t have bothered replying.

My reply:
I am so sorry to see that you feel you shouldn’t have replied. I think a lot of people are less than pleased about the fact that I have been asking these questions. For what it is worth, I truly appreciated your original post and responded at length. God bless you.

**I don’t feel guilty about having any of my children. I think the only one I had without fear was the first bc up until I was in labor with him I actually thought all that blarney about pain free deliveries and just breathing through contractions was actual stuff that worked. Life is terrifying. And yet still worth having. Lol

As Wesley said, life is pain. Anyone who says otherwise is selling something. **

 

[Convert_in_99]

:hug1:

I’m so sorry. It can be lonely, very lonely, to be a large family. I get that. Life is geared for smaller families (family packs? Ha! They never are enough ) We have to have some tough skin, spines of steal and lots of prayers to get through it on many days. I think the hardest part is the facade we have to create, because if we are seen to have a bad day or month or year, many will blame it on our family size. So we are left wondering if they are right, did we have too many kids? Or are we just having a rough time in life. Do we hide our difficulties to avoid the criticism?
I try to joyfully accept my hardships. I cry with a smile. Everyone goes through tough times, but it’s not always because of the kids.

I’m sorry you are going through this. I’ll try to be more helpful.

I’m childless and have been through far more in my young life than most of the families with lots of kids. The Church has not been there for me through the darkest times. I’ve actually had better luck with the world and Protestants befriending me during the roughest moments. Maybe I’m just weird like that.

ETA: I never strayed from the Church, wanted to make that clear, but my support for the hard times was found elsewhere for the most part. I felt like a stranger in a strange land being the childless Catholic, with a Protestant husband, who’s always sick, and now is completely sterile at 33, with no kids. I just don’t fit in CatholicLand.

 

[Convert_in_99]

Rob’s Wife said:

eta2 ugh. I hadn’t read other comments before replying. Probably shouldn’t have bothered replying.

My reply:
I am so sorry to see that you feel you shouldn’t have replied. I think a lot of people are less than pleased about the fact that I have been asking these questions. For what it is worth, I truly appreciated your original post and responded at length. God bless you.

It’s not you, it’s just a very senstive personal topic that varies greatly between each couple. It honestly should be a banned topic it gets so crazy. Parenting used to be a really popular hangout, but almost every issue has been banned due to huge fights and hurt feelings galore, and so it gets precious little traffic now. It’s just one of those things and totally not your fault!

 

[jmjZelie]

It’s not you, it’s just a very senstive personal topic that varies greatly between each couple. It honestly should be a banned topic it gets so crazy. Parenting used to be a really popular hangout, but almost every issue has been banned due to huge fights and hurt feelings galore, and so it gets precious little traffic now. It’s just one of those things and totally not your fault!

Is that why I see so little activity in the Parenting sub forum??

I had wondered why it seemed that it is so little frequented and is dwindling even now.

I have observed or participated in this forum since 2009, but only off and on. I come and am active for a while and then disappear for a year at a time. So there is probably a lot that I have missed of why this is a problem on this forum. When I was on Facebook, there were some good groups I was in, but over time, I noticed certain topics were firestarters, unbeknownst to the original poster. That is one of the reasons I quit Facebook entirely and restarted an account over here at CAF. I want to be able to correspond in a forum about interesting or important topics, because most of the stuff that I have a desire to learn about or discuss, I would never dream of talking to an acquaintance about (and my friends are all 5000 miles away, and they all appear to have forgotten about me).

 

[UbiCaritas]

I feel like well-founded fear does not get enough respect in these discussions.

We think of fear as being irrational, but is that necessarily the case? If one has had a series of sufficiently bad events, fear may actually be entirely rational and reasonable.

I know, for instance, that my husband is (totally rationally) terrified of me going through another pregnancy because of how the last two went (late miscarriage followed by depression and then very scary and complicated successful pregnancy with my husband taking over 95% of home responsibilities). I’m not as scared as he is of another pregnancy, but I understand his concern. In our particular case, I feel like it would even be uncharitable to put him through that again on purpose.

I think part of the issue is identifying what the fear is and if it’s a rational fear for that particular couple.

A spouse in a reasonably healthy, functional marriage presumably doesn’t say “I don’t want another baby, and that’s all there is to it.” There’s going to be a reason for it, and that reason might be good or bad. If it’s based in fear, it’s probably at least reasonable, though it could have two sides to it as well.

For example, one spouse might say, “We had a miscarriage recently, and I just don’t think I can handle that emotionally (or, if it’s the wife, physically) again right now.” I’d say that’s a good reason to avoid for a time. On the other hand, some couples would rather TTC ASAP after having a miscarriage, and that’s also okay. (We fell into the latter category, which kind of surprised me; I thought I’d want to wait at least 6 months, but once we got the all-clear again, I realized that the most healing thing for me would be to get pregnant again, DH felt the same, and here I am five months along.) Neither answer is a universal answer.

A spouse who does say “I don’t want a baby, end of discussion”–well, that’s neither productive nor fair to the other spouse. I could see that as being a good reason to avoid from the perspective of spouse who wants to get pregnant sooner, though, even if the attitude itself isn’t: “I don’t care what you think, I want another baby” isn’t healthy, and might suggest it’s a good thing to wait a while and work on the marriage first. That could be responsible parenthood, too.

 

[LongingSoul]

Thank you for your thoughts.

Can you elaborate about your struggles with abstinence around the 40 year mark, if that is not too personal? I am approaching 40…that might be relevant to my personal situation.

Thanks again. I have been able to think through a lot today due to your posting.

I’m well behind the flow of conversation now so hope my reply still fits.

It wasn’t so much struggling with abstinence at that time but a sort of hormone induced craziness that I’ve since learned is a common transitional time for most women. It’s a time for working through unresolved baggage that you think you’ve successfully put behind you but comes back to haunt you. I thank the Lord that I was drawn to counselling at that time and subsequently came on board at that Catholic counselling organisation to be of some help to others.

For me it was a time of panic and despair about not having a purpose that was meaningful and desperation to find one. One of my issues around that time was when my SIL who had only just married for the first time in her 40’s… had a baby. I had a ferocious maternal desire for another baby. The whole time was surrounded by a feeling of panic and desperately needing to find purpose and wanting love so much. (Many women fall into unexpected affairs drawn by that desperation).

I’m sad to say that it was around that time that I emotionally distanced myself from my children especially my boys. They were about 13 and 12 and my daughter was 10, preparing to go off to highschool. So I was feeling all this intensity for a little baby but had completely gone into auto drive with the other 3. Of course I look back now and realise that I was a very good mother prior to all those years. Having two with autistic spectrum and the other a very difficult middle child wanting constant confrontation… I wonder how I managed for so long without cracking.

Long story short… I came out the other side. We got my daughter a puppy for her birthday that year and I ended up falling in love with that little sweet thing. My SIL turned out to have married a money grubbing cad who took off leaving her a single mother at 44 so I have been a kind of surrogate mother to her little one in the last 10 years. She is like having the midlife child really. Things gradually worked out and the stormy waters have calmed.

Some here may be tempted to say that that urge was God telling me to have my own midlife baby but I know that I made the right decision and was really glad to have been available in that intervening time for my work with the Catholic org… with being there for my neice when needed and now being there for my mother who is caring for my alzheimers father at home still and in need of support.

When I did the spiritual exercises about 5 years ago, I learned that we shouldn’t make big life changing decisions in times of high emotional stress. Those decisions are best made when we are at peace with ourselves and confident of what is and isn’t Gods voice.

I’ve got a terrible fear that my admission about loving the puppy will be brought back against me on CAF in the future but I’m used to it by now.

 

[Rob_s_Wife]

**You can’t even determine rational fears for other people. According to everyone I’ve ever met, other people’s rational fears are why we should have never had any of ours.

Rational fear. We are too young. Well that would have knocked at least 2 - 3 of mine out.

Rational fear. Hypermesis sickness was traumatizing and debilitating. There went 9 out of 10. Or all 10 if one presumed the 10th would be like the previous 9.

Rational fear. Money. lol. What’s that?

Rational fear. Traumatic deliveries. Par for my delivery courses.

Yet here I am with 10 kids. I’m not any more brave or holy than anyone else. Probably less so. I just accepted the life I was given and do my best.

I am NOT saying everyone should do what I did. But no, IMO, one cannot use whether fear is rational or not to make the decision. I need know one thing. What does God want of me. And then do that regardless. For some reason people think doing what we are called to do isn’t supposed to be scary or hard. Well that’s just not true. It isn’t always. But something being hard or terrifying doesn’t mean we aren’t still called to do it.
**

 

[UbiCaritas]

**You can’t even determine rational fears for other people. According to everyone I’ve ever met, other people’s rational fears are why we should have never had any of ours.

Rational fear. We are too young. Well that would have knocked at least 2 - 3 of mine out.

Rational fear. Hypermesis sickness was traumatizing and debilitating. There went 9 out of 10. Or all 10 if one presumed the 10th would be like the previous 9.

Rational fear. Money. lol. What’s that?

Rational fear. Traumatic deliveries. Par for my delivery courses.

Yet here I am with 10 kids. I’m not any more brave or holy than anyone else. Probably less so. I just accepted the life I was given and do my best.

I am NOT saying everyone should do what I did. But no, IMO, one cannot use whether fear is rational or not to make the decision. I need know one thing. What does God want of me. And then do that regardless. For some reason people think doing what we are called to do isn’t supposed to be scary or hard. Well that’s just not true. It isn’t always. But something being hard or terrifying doesn’t mean we aren’t still called to do it.
**

I agree heartily with your first bit, but not with the last paragraph. It seems to me that fears can be rational or irrational. If the former, they should be respected; if the latter, discussed appropriately in the light of reason. (Yes, DH and I are very nerdy in this respect.) As you say, you can’t decide for other people if something is a good reason or not, but they can, and should.

I had severe PPD after DD’s birth–like, I can’t remember most of her first year except as a vague blur of nonstop suicidal thoughts, illnesses, and screaming/crying on both of our parts. It was bad. Once we finished out the year of avoidance that my OB wanted us to follow (DD was born via CS, and I needed to heal), DH and I started discussing another baby. I was terrified of having PPD like that again, and of what sort of damage I might do to myself or either kid, especially DD now that she’s more aware. That’s a valid, rational fear: a mom with severe PPD can mean a lot of really bad things. However, I felt like God wanted us to try for another kid, which seemed contradictory. Plus, feelings aren’t facts, and we’re rational beings and expected to behave like rational beings, deciding on actions based on the reason and judgment God gave us, not just on how we feel.

(For example, there were plenty of times in that first year when I felt like I would only be able to stay sane if I went on birth control because I could never, ever go through all that again, but given that I could reason my way to that being wrong, I never went on it.)

As we talked it out, though, we were able to make plans. I didn’t have to try to breastfeed again, which was very triggering for me and contributed to the bad physical health situation which, in its turn, also contributed to the PPD. I would talk to my OB early in pregnancy about getting on antidepressants and talking to a counselor, and having a plan in place if PPD still broke through all that. DH would help a lot more, and would ensure I’d get more breaks. As a result, we said, “okay, another kid does sound like a good idea, let’s try,” and there ya go. Reason. It’s awesome.

 

[jmjZelie]

I agree heartily with your first bit, but not with the last paragraph. It seems to me that fears can be rational or irrational. If the former, they should be respected; if the latter, discussed appropriately in the light of reason. (Yes, DH and I are very nerdy in this respect.) As you say, you can’t decide for other people if something is a good reason or not, but they can, and should.

I had severe PPD after DD’s birth–like, I can’t remember most of her first year except as a vague blur of nonstop suicidal thoughts, illnesses, and screaming/crying on both of our parts. It was bad. Once we finished out the year of avoidance that my OB wanted us to follow (DD was born via CS, and I needed to heal), DH and I started discussing another baby. I was terrified of having PPD like that again, and of what sort of damage I might do to myself or either kid, especially DD now that she’s more aware. That’s a valid, rational fear: a mom with severe PPD can mean a lot of really bad things. However, I felt like God wanted us to try for another kid, which seemed contradictory. Plus, feelings aren’t facts, and we’re rational beings and expected to behave like rational beings, deciding on actions based on the reason and judgment God gave us, not just on how we feel.

(For example, there were plenty of times in that first year when I felt like I would only be able to stay sane if I went on birth control because I could never, ever go through all that again, but given that I could reason my way to that being wrong, I never went on it.)

As we talked it out, though, we were able to make plans. I didn’t have to try to breastfeed again, which was very triggering for me and contributed to the bad physical health situation which, in its turn, also contributed to the PPD. I would talk to my OB early in pregnancy about getting on antidepressants and talking to a counselor, and having a plan in place if PPD still broke through all that. DH would help a lot more, and would ensure I’d get more breaks. As a result, we said, “okay, another kid does sound like a good idea, let’s try,” and there ya go. Reason. It’s awesome.

I know you think that you were disagreeing with Rob’s Wife, but I actually think your example beautifully illustrated what she was saying for herself and generally.

 

[LongingSoul]

Also, one of the things that my husband and I have learned the last few years is that it is possible to be right about something purely intuitively, even if one isn’t able to immediately muster an argument. The answer often comes pretty reflexively, while the supporting arguments may take much longer to materialize, even if it’s the right answer.

That is a truth of true significance. I believe that it points to a deeper truth behind why the Church doesn’t go beyond a general attitude when considering the type of family couples have. Our instincts have a very primal importance for our species and God put them there for a very good reason. Males and females have different types of intuition that’s is related to different areas to be considered. For example, a man might consider the question ‘how are we going to feed and educate our children’… with more intuition than a woman who might not have had to worry too much about where the money comes from. It’s easy to have an attitude of ‘God will provide’ when you feel basic security. A woman who’s husband has some chronic problem likely to end his work life prematurely is likely not going to have the same attitude to ‘divine providence’.

 

[Rob_s_Wife]

**. You completed missed my point while actually supporting it.

There is no rational reason why you could not have just as rationally decided for all those same reasons that, nope, you were not going to have more children bc of fear of PPD. In fact, had you done so, I doubt anyone would have argued it wasn’t wise of you. So what made your decision to risk having a baby anyways any more rational than someone else in that situation deciding not to? It’s the exact same fear and how rational or not that fear was made no difference. The only question was how to handle doing what God was requiring of you inspite of the fear.**

 

[UbiCaritas]

**. You completed missed my point while actually supporting it.

There is no rational reason why you could not have just as rationally decided for all those same reasons that, nope, you were not going to have more children bc of fear of PPD. In fact, had you done so, I doubt anyone would have argued it wasn’t wise of you. So what made your decision to risk having a baby anyways any more rational than someone else in that situation deciding not to? It’s the exact same fear and how rational or not that fear was made no difference. The only question was how to handle doing what God was requiring of you inspite of the fear.**

I wonder if we’re talking past one another, or perhaps misunderstanding one another at this point.

I have no idea if God was requiring that we have another child. I tend to have an extremely practical and not especially emotional* take on religion. I don’t trust my feelings about what God does or doesn’t want me to do because of my background, which makes me feel that what I must do is what’s hardest and most likely to make me unhappy. I can understand on an intellectual level that God loves me, and therefore I can do the right thing based on His precepts (well, were I being honest, let’s say that I can try to do the right thing! ), but in matters of discernment, I have to rely on reason, not emotion or feelings. For example, I thought for quite a while that God was calling me to be a nun because I had a visceral dislike of a lot of what’s required of a nun: I would be unhappy in that life, so God must be calling me to it. I felt that if I stopped breastfeeding I would be a bad mother in His eyes, even though it was decidedly the right choice. (You read too many Catholic parenting books, especially when you’re searching for answers and coming from a bad family background, and you get those ideas.) I felt that if I left my abusive home and moved across the country that I might go to Hell for being a bad daughter. And so on.

What made my decision to have another baby more rational was that it came from a place of intellectual discussion. When I think about that first year, I still react purely on instinct: extreme revulsion and horror and fear. What calms me down is to say “it doesn’t have to be like that again, and here’s why, here’s a solid plan you’ve discussed with your husband and OB that WILL be implemented as soon as baby is here, there are these advantages of having another baby soonish, so let’s do that.”

*This sounds disparaging of those who have a closer relationship with God than I, and I don’t mean it to at all; I honestly don’t know how else to phrase that, though, so I’ll let it stand.

 

[Convert_in_99]

I wonder if we’re talking past one another, or perhaps misunderstanding one another at this point.

I have no idea if God was requiring that we have another child. I tend to have an extremely practical and not especially emotional* take on religion. I don’t trust my feelings about what God does or doesn’t want me to do because of my background, which makes me feel that what I must do is what’s hardest and most likely to make me unhappy. I can understand on an intellectual level that God loves me, and therefore I can do the right thing based on His precepts (well, were I being honest, let’s say that I can try to do the right thing! ), but in matters of discernment, I have to rely on reason, not emotion or feelings. For example, I thought for quite a while that God was calling me to be a nun because I had a visceral dislike of a lot of what’s required of a nun: I would be unhappy in that life, so God must be calling me to it. I felt that if I stopped breastfeeding I would be a bad mother in His eyes, even though it was decidedly the right choice. (You read too many Catholic parenting books, especially when you’re searching for answers and coming from a bad family background, and you get those ideas.) I felt that if I left my abusive home and moved across the country that I might go to Hell for being a bad daughter. And so on.

What made my decision to have another baby more rational was that it came from a place of intellectual discussion. When I think about that first year, I still react purely on instinct: extreme revulsion and horror and fear. What calms me down is to say “it doesn’t have to be like that again, and here’s why, here’s a solid plan you’ve discussed with your husband and OB that WILL be implemented as soon as baby is here, there are these advantages of having another baby soonish, so let’s do that.”

*This sounds disparaging of those who have a closer relationship with God than I, and I don’t mean it to at all; I honestly don’t know how else to phrase that, though, so I’ll let it stand.

I can relate totally with how you view your relationship with God. I think like that too often myself. It can stink sometimes. I just go through the motions most days, try to avoid what I know to be sinful and hope for the best on everything else God related. It’s rough never having any real relationship or intamacy with God. :console:

 

[Xantippe]

I’m well behind the flow of conversation now so hope my reply still fits.

It wasn’t so much struggling with abstinence at that time but a sort of hormone induced craziness that I’ve since learned is a common transitional time for most women. It’s a time for working through unresolved baggage that you think you’ve successfully put behind you but comes back to haunt you. I thank the Lord that I was drawn to counselling at that time and subsequently came on board at that Catholic counselling organisation to be of some help to others.

For me it was a time of panic and despair about not having a purpose that was meaningful and desperation to find one. One of my issues around that time was when my SIL who had only just married for the first time in her 40’s… had a baby. I had a ferocious maternal desire for another baby. The whole time was surrounded by a feeling of panic and desperately needing to find purpose and wanting love so much. (Many women fall into unexpected affairs drawn by that desperation).

I’m sad to say that it was around that time that I emotionally distanced myself from my children especially my boys. They were about 13 and 12 and my daughter was 10, preparing to go off to highschool. So I was feeling all this intensity for a little baby but had completely gone into auto drive with the other 3. Of course I look back now and realise that I was a very good mother prior to all those years. Having two with autistic spectrum and the other a very difficult middle child wanting constant confrontation… I wonder how I managed for so long without cracking.

Long story short… I came out the other side. We got my daughter a puppy for her birthday that year and I ended up falling in love with that little sweet thing. My SIL turned out to have married a money grubbing cad who took off leaving her a single mother at 44 so I have been a kind of surrogate mother to her little one in the last 10 years. She is like having the midlife child really. Things gradually worked out and the stormy waters have calmed.

Some here may be tempted to say that that urge was God telling me to have my own midlife baby but I know that I made the right decision and was really glad to have been available in that intervening time for my work with the Catholic org… with being there for my neice when needed and now being there for my mother who is caring for my alzheimers father at home still and in need of support.

When I did the spiritual exercises about 5 years ago, I learned that we shouldn’t make big life changing decisions in times of high emotional stress. Those decisions are best made when we are at peace with ourselves and confident of what is and isn’t Gods voice.

I’ve got a terrible fear that my admission about loving the puppy will be brought back against me on CAF in the future but I’m used to it by now.

A puppy is SO much better than an affair!

 

[Convert_in_99]

Is that why I see so little activity in the Parenting sub forum??

I had wondered why it seemed that it is so little frequented and is dwindling even now.

I have observed or participated in this forum since 2009, but only off and on. I come and am active for a while and then disappear for a year at a time. So there is probably a lot that I have missed of why this is a problem on this forum. When I was on Facebook, there were some good groups I was in, but over time, I noticed certain topics were firestarters, unbeknownst to the original poster. That is one of the reasons I quit Facebook entirely and restarted an account over here at CAF. I want to be able to correspond in a forum about interesting or important topics, because most of the stuff that I have a desire to learn about or discuss, I would never dream of talking to an acquaintance about (and my friends are all 5000 miles away, and they all appear to have forgotten about me).

Yeah that’s the reason. Pretty much most typical parental discisions are banned. It used to be every bit as busy as family life, sometimes more so.

That must be so hard on you! I’m sorry everyone is so far away. My family lives 8 hours away and we never seem to have money to travel home but once a year maybe. It’s really rough without that support system, especially since I’ve lost most of my family in these past ten years we’ve been away!

 

[Xantippe]

I wonder if we’re talking past one another, or perhaps misunderstanding one another at this point.

I have no idea if God was requiring that we have another child. I tend to have an extremely practical and not especially emotional* take on religion. I don’t trust my feelings about what God does or doesn’t want me to do because of my background, which makes me feel that what I must do is what’s hardest and most likely to make me unhappy. I can understand on an intellectual level that God loves me, and therefore I can do the right thing based on His precepts (well, were I being honest, let’s say that I can try to do the right thing! ), but in matters of discernment, I have to rely on reason, not emotion or feelings. For example, I thought for quite a while that God was calling me to be a nun because I had a visceral dislike of a lot of what’s required of a nun: I would be unhappy in that life, so God must be calling me to it. I felt that if I stopped breastfeeding I would be a bad mother in His eyes, even though it was decidedly the right choice. (You read too many Catholic parenting books, especially when you’re searching for answers and coming from a bad family background, and you get those ideas.) I felt that if I left my abusive home and moved across the country that I might go to Hell for being a bad daughter. And so on.

What made my decision to have another baby more rational was that it came from a place of intellectual discussion. When I think about that first year, I still react purely on instinct: extreme revulsion and horror and fear. What calms me down is to say “it doesn’t have to be like that again, and here’s why, here’s a solid plan you’ve discussed with your husband and OB that WILL be implemented as soon as baby is here, there are these advantages of having another baby soonish, so let’s do that.”

*This sounds disparaging of those who have a closer relationship with God than I, and I don’t mean it to at all; I honestly don’t know how else to phrase that, though, so I’ll let it stand.

That sounds very good.

 

[LongingSoul]

I wonder if we’re talking past one another, or perhaps misunderstanding one another at this point.

I have no idea if God was requiring that we have another child. I tend to have an extremely practical and not especially emotional* take on religion. I don’t trust my feelings about what God does or doesn’t want me to do because of my background, which makes me feel that what I must do is what’s hardest and most likely to make me unhappy. I can understand on an intellectual level that God loves me, and therefore I can do the right thing based on His precepts (well, were I being honest, let’s say that I can try to do the right thing! ), but in matters of discernment, I have to rely on reason, not emotion or feelings. For example, I thought for quite a while that God was calling me to be a nun because I had a visceral dislike of a lot of what’s required of a nun: I would be unhappy in that life, so God must be calling me to it. I felt that if I stopped breastfeeding I would be a bad mother in His eyes, even though it was decidedly the right choice. (You read too many Catholic parenting books, especially when you’re searching for answers and coming from a bad family background, and you get those ideas.) I felt that if I left my abusive home and moved across the country that I might go to Hell for being a bad daughter. And so on.

What made my decision to have another baby more rational was that it came from a place of intellectual discussion. When I think about that first year, I still react purely on instinct: extreme revulsion and horror and fear. What calms me down is to say “it doesn’t have to be like that again, and here’s why, here’s a solid plan you’ve discussed with your husband and OB that WILL be implemented as soon as baby is here, there are these advantages of having another baby soonish, so let’s do that.”

*This sounds disparaging of those who have a closer relationship with God than I, and I don’t mean it to at all; I honestly don’t know how else to phrase that, though, so I’ll let it stand.

Peter Kreeft has a wonderful explanation of Catholic discernment. There’s so many good quotes that I can’t just post one but it really is a good essay.

peterkreeft.com/topics/discernment.htm

 

[Mary_Gail_36]

It’s not you, it’s just a very senstive personal topic that varies greatly between each couple. It honestly should be a banned topic it gets so crazy. Parenting used to be a really popular hangout, but almost every issue has been banned due to huge fights and hurt feelings galore, and so it gets precious little traffic now. It’s just one of those things and totally not your fault!

I don’t think it’s true. The only topic to be banned in parenting is vaccine discussions, but that is due to it being medical advice.

The Parenting Subforum might just be slow organically. Sometimes parenting questions are put directly in “Family Life”

 

[Mary_Gail_36]

Hey don’t blush! You’re just a few months older than me…but you’re still older!

I had 4 babies in my 20’s, 4 babies + one miscarriage in my 30’s, 2 babies, 1 miscarriage & 1 stillborn in my 40’s. My dr only mentioned the chromosomal issue incompatible with life with my last loss (the still born.). We are still waiting to hear the results on that, though. I’m 1 month postpartum and wondering if I’ll ever be able to conceive again (part of the reason for all my questions of you!). As I read your posts, it sounds like your fertility declined faster than mine. Do you still practice NFP? Or do you think your fertile days are done?

We do practice NFP.

I’m still cycling, I do have a peak followed by a post peak. I’m not sure if I’m ovulating successfully.

I’m not meticulously charting though, just making mental notes and notes on a calendar. But I’m making the observations daily.

My grandmother had my dad at 46. Her sisters also had babies that year, 44 and 42.

I think if we were to conceive, it would have to be “on purpose” meaning charting, progesterone post peak (the progesterone dose I was using wasn’t really working anymore) and probably “high risk” monitoring.

I do remember about 2 years ago, we were both on the Pregnant or Not thread. I didn;t conceive that month. But the irony is the month that would have been my due date, my oldest son suffered his brain hemorrhage. I often wonder how it worked out that way.