don’t know what you are talking about.I’ve heard an Eastern Orthodox apologist say that the synod of Lateran in 649 was mend to be an ecumenical council by pope Martin I, but since we now not see it as a ecumenical council, it is an argument against papal ratification.
Anybody knows more of this?
First Vatican Council:But the great Cardinal of Toledo remarks most appositely on this place that it is not said he shall carry the Church into all truth, but he shall lead; to show that though the Holy Spirit enlightens the Church, he wills at the same that she should use the diligence which is required for keeping the true way, as the Apostles did, who, having to give an answer to an important question, debated, comparing the Holy Scriptures together; and when they had diligently done this they concluded by the: It hath seemed good to the Holy Spirit and to us; that is, the Holy Spirit has enlightened us and we have walked, he has guided us and we have followed him, up to this truth. The ordinary means must be employed to discover the truth, and yet in this must be acknowledged the drawing and presence of the Holy Spirit. Thus is the Christian flock led,-by the Holy Spirit but under the charge and guidance of its Pastor, who however does not walk at hazard, but according to necessity convokes the other pastors, either partially or universally, carefully regards the track of his predecessors, considers the Urim and Thummim of the Word of God, enters before his God by his prayers and invocations, and, having thus diligently sought out the true way, boldly puts himself on his voyage and courageously sets sail.
The Roman pontiffs, too, as the circumstances of the time or the state of affairs suggested, sometimes by summoning ecumenical councils or consulting the opinion of the Churches scattered throughout the world, sometimes by special synods, sometimes by taking advantage of other useful means afforded by divine providence, defined as doctrines to be held those things which, by God’s help, they knew to be in keeping with Sacred Scripture and the apostolic traditions.
That’s funny because the Second Ecumenical Council was conveyed by the Emperor without even telling the Pope which implies that “Papal Ratification” doesn’t make a Council Ecumenical. Plus that very council only was attended by Eastern bishops, yet it is still Ecumenical so that means that a council doesn’t need to have West+East to be Ecumenical.In the case of the Lateran Council of 649, Popes Theodore I and St. Martin I did intend it to be an ecumenical Council. However, other than one Palestinian (who was appointed papal vicar in the East), it was only attended by Western bishops without sufficient representation from the rest of the Cartholic Church due to various crises in the East (and probably because it was opposed by the emperor).
Where are you getting that the Pope didn’t know about this council? By reading the canons from the council, it seems to speak specifically to problems in specific churches in the East, and especially of heresy that was rampant in Eastern churches. So what, exactly, is your point? Show me evidence that it was not approved of by Western bishops, or that they were somehow not aware of its occurrence.That’s funny because the Second Ecumenical Council was conveyed by the Emperor without even telling the Pope which implies that “Papal Ratification” doesn’t make a Council Ecumenical. Plus that very council only was attended by Eastern bishops, yet it is still Ecumenical so that means that a council doesn’t need to have West+East to be Ecumenical.
Pope St. Agathos sent his legates, which represented him and the West. Again, all that is required is at least the Popes’ tacit acceptance–St. Agatho did not oppose this Council. In fact, he would have no reason to since the Council firmly embraced the dogmatic letter he sent them, proclaiming “Peter has spoken through Agatho.”That’s funny because the Second Ecumenical Council was conveyed by the Emperor without even telling the Pope which implies that “Papal Ratification” doesn’t make a Council Ecumenical. Plus that very council only was attended by Eastern bishops, yet it is still Ecumenical so that means that a council doesn’t need to have West+East to be Ecumenical.
Where are you getting that the Pope didn’t know about this council? By reading the canons from the council, it seems to speak specifically to problems in specific churches in the East, and especially of heresy that was rampant in Eastern churches. So what, exactly, is your point? Show me evidence that it was not approved of by Western bishops, or that they were somehow not aware of its occurrence.
%between%
“Pope Damasus I either was not invited or declined to attend, so this council is sometimes called the “unecumenical” council.”
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Council_of_Constantinople
“Originally it was only a council of the Orient”
http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/04308a.htm
You went 300 years to far.Pope St. Agathos sent his legates, which represented him and the West. Again, all that is required is at least the Popes’ tacit acceptance–St. Agatho did not oppose this Council. In fact, he would have no reason to since the Council firmly embraced the dogmatic letter he sent them, proclaiming “Peter has spoken through Agatho.”
So it was exactly what I said: problems and heresies that were still rampant in the East needed to be addressed. What they said was binding on the whole Church and was found to be ecumenical at a later council, and thus is ecumenical. How likely do you think it was that the pope or western bishops were actually unaware of this council? You don’t think that, since the heresies were heaviest in the East, they may simply not have attended?“Pope Damasus I either was not invited or declined to attend, so this council is sometimes called the “unecumenical” council.”
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Council_of_Constantinople
“Originally it was only a council of the Orient”
newadvent.org/cathen/04308a.htm
Oops, my bad. Given the context of the thread, my mind jumped to the second Council to deal with this topic (monothelitism), which became ecumenical.You went 300 years to far.