Latin Mass banned in US Anglican Use Ordinariate

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The Ordinariate is still in the middle of working on their own liturgies, the current BDW is provisional.
Plus, the Ordinariate is still a baby, with her clergy coming from diverse liturgical tradition within Anglicanism.
The first thing the Ordinariate must do is consolidate her own priests and faithful, make them firm in whatever forth-coming Anglican Use liturgy approved by Rome. Make it theirs.
Whatever personal motive behind the Ordinary decision, I think it is very wise decision.
 
triumphguy said:
Knowing quite a few Anglicans turned Catholic I would guess that the last thing they would want to see in their AU parish is a Latin Mass.
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Somehow from your comments, I’m getting this picture in my mind of a religious community that somehow would prefer Shakespeare to be read as one of the readings in the Mass. Oh well, maybe it’s just me. 🙂
 
Ruthie_again said:
All I want to know is - If an AU parish opens in my area of the USA, and I attend Mass there, will I get to sing “Jerusalem”?
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You probably have a better chance with that one than “I Vow to Thee, My Country.” 🙂
 
SKWill said:
Or attempt to use Anglican Use/Ordinariate parishes merely as Mass venues while refusing to integrate into parish life: atonementparish.blogspot.com/2007/07/summorum-pontificum.html
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The article is a perfect example of what I have been saying, namely…
The problems arose because of people’s attitudes and expectations.
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It does not suprise me in the slightest that Monsignor Steenson want’s a uniform celebration of the liturgy. He is a wise man.

-Tim-
 
ProVobis said:
Somehow from your comments, I’m getting this picture in my mind of a religious community that somehow would prefer Shakespeare to be read as one of the readings in the Mass. Oh well, maybe it’s just me. 🙂
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Or for their liturgy to be said per the Book of Common Prayer - which is part of their raison d’etre right?
 
ProVobis said:
You probably have a better chance with that one than “I Vow to Thee, My Country.” 🙂
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We sang a Catholic version of that for the recessional during the Ordination Mass of two former Anglican priests.
 
Firstly, the title of the thread is misleading and unnecessarily inflammatory. The EF is no more ‘banned’ in Anglican Use parishes than the OF, or any Eastern Divine Liturgies, or Oriental Holy Qurbanas. Msgr Steenson has merely affirmed the centrality of the Book of Divine Worship to the unique character of the AU.

Secondly, the EF was not in any way discouraged. Msgr Steenson has explicitly stated that those clergy who wish to learn the EF are permitted - in fact, encouraged - to do so, and of course there is no impediment to any AU Catholic who wishes to participate in an EF Mass.

However, there is no reason to expect Msgr Steenson to encourage the use of the EF when AU parishes use the BDW, not the Roman Missal. The EF (and OF) are of the Roman Missal, and it is not in our place to insist that his Ordinariate uses liturgies that are not part of their heritage.

It is most unwise for us to create conflict over such a (non-)issue. The Personal Ordinariates are in a stage of infancy and still trying to carve out their religious niche within the larger Church. At their current state, any disturbance in pastoral dynamics can adversely impact their development. We already know that they are facing problems with regular financing and sustainable congregations. The Ordinaries require the obedience and patience of their faithful as they guide their charges through this tumultuous period, and we should be lending them our fullest support, not torpedoing their every proclamation.

There are many other larger, more stable groups within the Roman Rite that are more suited towards such rehabilitation of the EF. AU parishes are still trying to find their feet with the BDW, and throwing more liturgies into the picture will not help their development at all. I believe that the AU can only help the cause of tradition in the long run, but we need to give them their space to flourish and grow. 🙂
 
Firstly, the title of the thread is misleading and potentially provocative. The EF is no more ‘banned’ in Anglican Use parishes than the OF, or any Eastern Divine Liturgies, or Oriental Holy Qurbanas. Msgr Steenson has merely affirmed the centrality of the Book of Divine Worship to the unique character of the Anglican Use.

Secondly, the EF was not in any way discouraged. Msgr Steenson has explicitly stated that those clergy who wish to learn the EF are permitted - in fact, encouraged - to do so, and of course there is no impediment to any Anglican Use Catholic who wishes to participate in an EF Mass.

However, there is no reason to expect Msgr Steenson to encourage the use of the EF when Anglican Use parishes use the Book of Divine Worship, not the Roman Missal. The EF (and OF) are of the Roman Missal, and it is not in our place to insist that his Ordinariate uses liturgies that are not part of their heritage.

It is most unwise for us to create conflict over such a (non-)issue. The Personal Ordinariates are in a stage of infancy and still trying to carve out their religious niche within the larger Church. At their current state, any disturbance in pastoral dynamics can adversely impact their development. We already know that they are facing problems with regular financing and sustainable congregations. The Ordinaries require the obedience and patience of their faithful as they guide their charges through this tumultuous period, and we should be lending them our fullest support, not torpedoing their every proclamation.

There are many other larger, more stable groups within the Roman Rite that are more suited towards such rehabilitation of the EF. Anglican Use parishes are still trying to find their feet with the Book of Divine Worship, and throwing more liturgies into the picture will not help their development at all. I believe that the Anglican Use can only help the cause of tradition in the long run, but we need to give them their space to flourish and grow. 🙂
 
Filii_Dei said:
Firstly, the title of the thread is misleading and potentially provocative. The EF is no more ‘banned’ in Anglican Use parishes than the OF, or any Eastern Divine Liturgies, or Oriental Holy Qurbanas. Msgr Steenson has merely affirmed the centrality of the Book of Divine Worship to the unique character of the Anglican Use.
…
However, there is no reason to expect Msgr Steenson to encourage the use of the EF when Anglican Use parishes use the Book of Divine Worship, not the Roman Missal. The EF (and OF) are of the Roman Missal…
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Yes, but one thing that it very confusing (and could be potentially troubling) is this:
For those congregations that prefer a contemporary idiom, the Roman Missal 3rd edition could be used.
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Filii_Dei said:
Firstly, the title of the thread is misleading and potentially provocative. The EF is no more ‘banned’ in Anglican Use parishes than the OF, or any Eastern Divine Liturgies, or Oriental Holy Qurbanas. Msgr Steenson has merely affirmed the centrality of the Book of Divine Worship to the unique character of the Anglican Use.

Secondly, the EF was not in any way discouraged. Msgr Steenson has explicitly stated that those clergy who wish to learn the EF are permitted - in fact, encouraged - to do so, and of course there is no impediment to any Anglican Use Catholic who wishes to participate in an EF Mass.

However, there is no reason to expect Msgr Steenson to encourage the use of the EF when Anglican Use parishes use the Book of Divine Worship, not the Roman Missal. The EF (and OF) are of the Roman Missal, and it is not in our place to insist that his Ordinariate uses liturgies that are not part of their heritage.

It is most unwise for us to create conflict over such a (non-)issue. The Personal Ordinariates are in a stage of infancy and still trying to carve out their religious niche within the larger Church. At their current state, any disturbance in pastoral dynamics can adversely impact their development. We already know that they are facing problems with regular financing and sustainable congregations. The Ordinaries require the obedience and patience of their faithful as they guide their charges through this tumultuous period, and we should be lending them our fullest support, not torpedoing their every proclamation.

There are many other larger, more stable groups within the Roman Rite that are more suited towards such rehabilitation of the EF. Anglican Use parishes are still trying to find their feet with the Book of Divine Worship, and throwing more liturgies into the picture will not help their development at all. I believe that the Anglican Use can only help the cause of tradition in the long run, but we need to give them their space to flourish and grow. 🙂
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Agreed. Well put.
 
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triumphguy said:
What’s the point of being an Anglican Use parish, if you are not going to use English?😛

Knowing quite a few Anglicans turned Catholic I would guess that the last thing they would want to see in their AU parish is a Latin Mass.
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Actually, a number of very Anglo-Catholic parishes (the sort most likely to join the Ordinariate) do use some Latin.

Edwin
 
Filii_Dei said:
Firstly, the title of the thread is misleading and potentially provocative. The EF is no more ‘banned’ in Anglican Use parishes than the OF, or any Eastern Divine Liturgies, or Oriental Holy Qurbanas. Msgr Steenson has merely affirmed the centrality of the Book of Divine Worship to the unique character of the Anglican Use.
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This. Although I wonder if they would let an EF group rent their church. I know one of our parishes are rented out ot a Korean group who has a priest that does the OF in Korean for them. It is funny too because they use the tetrapod as the altar for their Mass. They can’t use our Holy Table because our tabernacles are in the middle of the Holy Table and if the priest does Mass facing the people, he’d be hidden behind the tabernacle.
 
There was so much back and forth on this subject that “the powers that be” have “asked” that the lively blog, the Anglo-Catholic suspend its activities.

As an outsider to these matters (an Episcopalian) I have the impression that Bishop Steenson is out of his depth (he may have been out of his depth in the Episcopal diocese of Rio Grande as well). It has been less than a year since the US ordinariate was established. In the same time in 2011 we heard continuous reports of the activities and vitality of the UK ordinariate. We ain’t hearing much except dissension.

There are charges that since the majority of priests ordained come from the Episcopal Church’s seminary and ordination process, there is a bias toward former Episcopalians (even those who may have left that church for another Anglican body prior to becoming Catholic.
Whether or not the charge is valid, I get the impression that the leadership of the US ordinariate is week and ineffectual.
 
I still haven’t figured out where it says the EF is banned…
 
ByzCathCantor said:
That has been the consistent message and theme throughout.

The idea of having Mass according to either the EF or the OF, for that matter, should be equally surprising and unexpected.
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For better or worse, I understand that ordinariat churches in our region are under a lot of pressure to give the OF a prominent place in their schedule of Masses.

Even though that pressure doesn’t come from public policy like this one (statement from the ordinary banning the EF), the double-standard sends the wrong message. I hope things are more even-handed elsewhere.
 
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