Latin Pronunciation

[thistle]

Can someone please kindly tell me how to pronounce the words I have highlighted. I’m not sure if “qui” is “kwee” or “kee”. Also, I particularly have trouble remembering the letter “C” which seems to have different ways of being pronounced.

PATER NOSTER, qui es in caelis, sanctificetur nomen tuum. Adveniat regnum tuum. Fiat voluntas tua, sicut in caelo et in terra. Panem nostrum quotidianum da nobis hodie, et dimitte nobis debita nostra sicut et nos dimittimus debitoribus nostris. Et ne nos inducas in tentationem, sed libera nos a malo. Amen.

 

[LaRoza]

qui == “key”
caelis == “chay-lees”
caelo == “chay-lo”

Here is a recording (and more instruction): fisheaters.com/paterchant.html

Here is a bit on Ecclasiastical Latin pronounciation: ewtn.com/expert/answers/ecclesiastical_latin.htm

 

[passus]

It’s CHEH-lees and CHEH-lo.

There are no diphthongs in the pronunciation of this kind of Latin.

 

[LaRoza]

It’s CHEH-lees and CHEH-lo.

There are no diphthongs in the pronunciation of this kind of Latin.

I should have used IPA symbols…

No matter how we show translation, it is not accurate unless we have some sort of agreed upon system.

 

[passus]

I should have used IPA symbols…

No matter how we show translation, it is not accurate unless we have some sort of agreed upon system.

Meh, I don’t know how to read IPA symbols anyway, so had you done that it’s unlikely I would have “disagreed” with you in the first place.

 

[latingirl]

c before e, ae, oe, or i is pronounced as “ch”
like* pace, caelis, coelis, or civis.*
this also works with *sc *(but it turns soft here more like “sh”)
and *xc *like in excelsis.
I thought qui was pronounced “qwee” because that’s what it says in my books.
I like the sound of Ecclesiastical Latin better than Classical.

 

[LaRoza]

Meh, I don’t know how to read IPA symbols anyway, so had you done that it’s unlikely I would have “disagreed” with you in the first place.

Yeah, but not many people use them so it is hard to use them for giving advice. Hopefully those links will sort it out though.

 

[passus]

c before e, ae, oe, or i is pronounced as “ch”
like* pace, caelis, coelis, or civis.*
this also works with *sc *(but it turns soft here more like “sh”)
and *xc *like in excelsis.
I thought qui was pronounced “qwee” because that’s what it says in my books.
I like the sound of Ecclesiastical Latin better than Classical.

Me too. It’s just so much more pretty…or something.

 

[mattkubes]

I thought qui was pronounced “qwee” because that’s what it says in my books.

That’s the way I’ve always said it too. Pronouncing ‘qui’ like ‘key’ is how the French do it, but all of the chants I have on CD do say it as ‘qwee.’ Either way, I bet it’s saying the prayer that counts anyways

 

[Deacon_Ed]

Both Wheelock and Collins (Ecclesiastical Latin) indicate that it’s KWEE.

Deacon Ed

 

[Ridgerunner]

The French word “qui” is indeed pronounced “key”, and I suppose they would be very inclined to use the same pronunciation for the latin “qui”, and might be hard put to avoid doing it.

I am very vaguely aware that there are significant differences between classic latin and ecclesiastical latin. One of the best examples I have heard is the expression “Veni vidi vici”. (“I came, I saw, I conquered”)

In ecclesiastical latin, it would be pronounced. Vay-nee, vee-dee, vee-chee. In classical latin it would be Way-nee, wee-dee, wee-key.

I like the first better, myself. Ecclesiastical latin is pronounced in a way similar to the way Italian is pronounced. Classical latin has a “harder” sound.

But Classical latin is a literary language. The French used to have a literary form as well. In poetry and singing, they still do, because it rhymes better and has more distinct syllables to aid the meter. What ordinary Romans sounded like, I don’t think anyone knows. For all we know, they might have used the ecclesiastical pronunciation, and classical latin might have been the preserve of writers and poets. They didn’t leave any CDs behind.

 

[thistle]

Thanks everyone.