Latinos Revitalize US Catholic Population

[aspawloski4th]

Did they follow the Order of the Mass?
I mean 1) Introductory Rites, 2) Liturgy of the Word, 3) Liturgy of the Eucharist, 4) Concluding Rite?

If so they did not violate the Mass. You just do not understand our culture.

But then again White / Anglo parishes NEVER violate the Mass. Never happened huh?

Talk about insult! Anglo!!! You know what Anglo means? It means ANglosaxon dude! Anglo saxons are usually Epicsciplalian. My Irish mother would take unbrage with you calling her Anglo. Has has to be said with a decorum, in a solemn holy manner. You seem to have conveniently blown over that some Hispanics were outaraged at this Mass also. One other thing you forgot was the rubrics, they are necesary for that Mass to be valid also. Iv’e been to plenty of ethnic Maases over the years aand even the Hispanic one’s Iv’e been to is not as bad as what is mentioned here. Beccause of my wife’s family Iv’e been to Middle eastern Masses, which seem very holy to me. What it sounds like to me was going on was a Mexican fiesta.

 

[aspawloski4th]

I can speak, for one. Yes Anglos DO violate the mass (e.i. women priest wannabes) . Hey, if we’re talking about Mexicans who never go to mass or contribute little, or who are Catholics only by branding, then we might as well talk about the hundreds of thousands of American Catholics who never go to mass, who go to mass once a year and feel good about it. Its the same all the world over. If we are counting only those Hispanics and Americans who are true, faithful Catholics, then I’m guessing we would still have the same numbers. One third of the Catholic population.

What I think the complaint is about is the powers that be falling all over themselve to makesure the Hispanics hav a Mass in Spanish just to have a very obvious mockery made of it… Theres plenty going on in white parishes(sorry I am not an anglo, I have very little Englsh in my background) During the consecration if the priest doesnt genuflect just after saying in memory of me, I sit down because that invalidated everything.

 

[josephdavid]

Talk about insult! Anglo!!! You know what Anglo means? It means ANglosaxon dude! Anglo saxons are usually Epicsciplalian. My Irish mother would take unbrage with you calling her Anglo. Has has to be said with a decorum, in a solemn holy manner. You seem to have conveniently blown over that some Hispanics were outaraged at this Mass also. One other thing you forgot was the rubrics, they are necesary for that Mass to be valid also. Iv’e been to plenty of ethnic Maases over the years aand even the Hispanic one’s Iv’e been to is not as bad as what is mentioned here. Beccause of my wife’s family Iv’e been to Middle eastern Masses, which seem very holy to me. What it sounds like to me was going on was a Mexican fiesta.

But the question still stands. Did they violate the order of the Mass? Did they not follow the Order of the Mass?

 

[Tigg]

I can speak, for one. Yes Anglos DO violate the mass (e.i. women priest wannabes) . Hey, if we’re talking about Mexicans who never go to mass or contribute little, or who are Catholics only by branding, then we might as well talk about the hundreds of thousands of American Catholics who never go to mass, who go to mass once a year and feel good about it. Its the same all the world over. If we are counting only those Hispanics and Americans who are true, faithful Catholics, then I’m guessing we would still have the same numbers. One third of the Catholic population.

Very good comment! It isn’t about being Latino or German or Irish - the crisis we are seeing in all cultures and on a global scale (look at what is happening in the European churches) is simply an apostasy from the True Faith and our very own bishops are complicit. Only 30% of Catholics now believe in the Real Presence - that is a FAITH crisis, not a cultural one! In this country, we are more than disturbed, however, by the other factors such as the numbers of illegals entering and the adverse affects - many of which we are now just discovering. If black, white, and yellow could all just return to the Truth as contained in the Church for 2,000 years, we would be united in a single worship and the cultural differences would no longer matter.

 

[aspawloski4th]

But the question still stands. Did they violate the order of the Mass? Did they not follow the Order of the Mass?

There is more to the Mass other than just following the order as to whether or not it is valid. Order is only the half of it. Its like what happened there would be the equivelent of my priest bringing in a rockband to do our Mass. This shows we need Latin Mass back, where everything is uniform.

 

[wabrams]

Latinos are America’s last hope. I say this as a non-Latino Catholic Christian, and a staunch political conservative.

The reason why is demographics. Artificial contraception and abortion on demand has ravaged the population of Europe and North America. Since both regions have heavily embraced socialist policies, there must be a larger tax base than those receiving benefits from the government. You can’t force people to have babies, so you’ve got to get your taxpayers from somewhere. Currently, the people most likely to migrate to western nations are African and Asian Muslims, who generally do not believe in artificial birth control or abortion. As a result the average Muslim fertility rate is four to eight times that of native Europeans and North Americans. Just do the math. Islam is taking over Europe, and Canada is already following the exact same trend. There is debate as to what year a total takeover will happen, but the fact that it will happen eventually is nearly undisputed. The German government has already admitted that by 2040 Germany will be an Islamic Republic.

The only thing saving the United States from a similar fate is Latino immigration. So long as we have Latinos, preferably Catholic Latinos, immigrating to the United States we can keep our Christian population high enough to where we don’t need to import Muslim immigrants from Africa and Asia, who are just itching to get in here.

Other than sales tax, the illegal immigrants here aren’t paying taxes.

 

[wabrams]

How sad this post is. This is the classic example of Xenophobia. I pray to the Lord, that for the fear that you posses which causes your hatred and bigotry will be overcome with compassion, knoweledge and understanding.

I am Latino and I always hear how Latin people are taking over America. Now I read this post. What is truly acceptable? If we all were white and walked the same as yourself? Or if you are Latino do you use your own peoples culture to validate yoru hatred. Remember the fear of Native Americans resulted in the slaughter and relocation of millions of people. Or did you forget your history?

Please do not use Latino people as a tool to validate your hatred of a group of people.

You just love to play that race card, don’t you?

 

[MumboJumbo]

Did they follow the Order of the Mass?
I mean 1) Introductory Rites, 2) Liturgy of the Word, 3) Liturgy of the Eucharist, 4) Concluding Rite?

If so they did not violate the Mass. You just do not understand our culture.

But then again White / Anglo parishes NEVER violate the Mass. Never happened huh?

I don’t understand a culture that would turn a sacred Mass into a three ring circus.

 

[MumboJumbo]

You just love to play that race card, don’t you?

It’s the only card they have.

 

[aspawloski4th]

It’s the only card they have.

The funnything is Hispanic is not a race, it’s a culture. My (non Hispanic) wife passes for Hispanic all the time, Ive even seen a few Hispanics lighter complected than I am. I have mmedium brown hair a blue eyes. The bottemline is, is none but you should get together a Mass in you own language if its other than Latin or English,and if you don’t want to learn English theres the door. Leave the USA.

 

[FK04US]

The funnything is Hispanic is not a race, it’s a culture. My (non Hispanic) wife passes for Hispanic all the time, Ive even seen a few Hispanics lighter complected than I am. I have mmedium brown hair a blue eyes. The bottemline is, is none but you should get together a Mass in you own language if its other than Latin or English,and if you don’t want to learn English theres the door. Leave the USA.

Since when you decide who is allowed to worship at Our Holy Catholic Church? The USA is a little piece of the Universal Church, with Latinamerican Catholics being the majority, so you are at a loss here. Maybe you want to start an American Catholic Church and declared yourself a Pope and forbid Hispanics to get in the door, unless they speak English and show you their money.

Maybe we should change our wording from “Peace be with you” to “Show me your money, your green card, and stop speaking your mother tongue” …

 

[MumboJumbo]

Since when you decide who is allowed to worship at Our Holy Catholic Church? The USA is a little piece of the Universal Church, with Latinamerican Catholics being the majority, so you are at a loss here. Maybe you want to start an American Catholic Church and declared yourself a Pope and forbid Hispanics to get in the door, unless they speak English and show you their money.

Maybe we should change our wording from “Peace be with you” to “Show me your money, your green card, and stop speaking your mother tongue” …

If I remember correctly, when the Catholic Church had the Latin Mass before Vatican II turned the Church upside down for the convenience of certain cultures, the Mass was said in a uniform manner. I could be in any country in the world and except for a few minor differences, the Mass was the same.

When was mariachi music approved by the Pope to be used during a Mass?

When was Aztec costumes and pagan worship approved by the Pope to be used in a Mass?

When was a general disrespect for the Church approved by the Pope to be used at Mass?

When were certain cultures allowed to “do their own thing” with the Catholic Mass?

The Catholic Mass is to be respectful to all who attend it and the only variation is a change in language. Some minor cultural differences should not make a difference to the essential Mass being celebrated.

People who have a problem with this should follow one of the thousands of Martin Luther copycat religions where you can design your own church and be your own pope. Believe me, you won’t be missed.

 

[FK04US]

If I remember correctly, when the Catholic Church had the Latin Mass before Vatican II turned the Church upside down for the convenience of certain cultures, the Mass was said in a uniform manner. I could be in any country in the world and except for a few minor differences, the Mass was the same.

When was mariachi music approved by the Pope to be used during a Mass?

When was Aztec costumes and pagan worship approved by the Pope to be used in a Mass?

When was a general disrespect for the Church approved by the Pope to be used at Mass?

When were certain cultures allowed to “do their own thing” with the Catholic Mass?

The Catholic Mass is to be respectful to all who attend it and the only variation is a change in language. Some minor cultural differences should not make a difference to the essential Mass being celebrated.

People who have a problem with this should follow one of the thousands of Martin Luther copycat religions where you can design your own church and be your own pope. Believe me, you won’t be missed.

I am not saying that liturgical abuses have to be allowed, we have to keep educating the faithful. I share your concerns about this. What I am against is at the generalization that this is exclusively a Latino issue, which is not; and also at the idea that they should be expelled of the Church in the USA b/c they do nor speak English. That has an element of bigotry and why not, racism, it is just plain Un-Catholic.

We must remember the historic roots of Catholicism and its syncretism with different cultures. Catholicism in Latin America had to blend with popular culture in order to propagate the faith. In the USA, the faith was imported by Irish, Germans and other Europeans, there was no evangelization of the native population here. Very different from the Spanish and Portuguese experience in Central and South America.

Over there, Indians had a strong cultural heritage and Catholicism had to accommodate and in some cases incorporate elements of folclore and popular culture. And that is very distinctive in Latinamerican Catholicism, but we still share the same faith. They are loyal to the Pope, they are the most fervent followers of Our Lady and they are the ones who put the strongest faith to pro abortion policies. Do not belittle them, they truly are the future of Catholicism here, you just have to see the number of baptisms of Latino and non-Latino Catholics to verify that. And they may also be the future of Catholicism in the whole world, together with the growing African Church.

In Christ,

 

[aspawloski4th]

Since when you decide who is allowed to worship at Our Holy Catholic Church? The USA is a little piece of the Universal Church, with Latinamerican Catholics being the majority, so you are at a loss here. Maybe you want to start an American Catholic Church and declared yourself a Pope and forbid Hispanics to get in the door, unless they speak English and show you their money.

Maybe we should change our wording from “Peace be with you” to “Show me your money, your green card, and stop speaking your mother tongue” …

As a Dominos driver 16 years, when Hispanics out number anyother ehtnic group who expect me to change a 50 or 100 for a 12 dollar pizza, that tells me they are not doing all to bad money wise. Latinos are not the majority of Catholics with in the USA Polish or Irish or even Germans would outnumber them easily. My ancestors learned Eglish from The Austrian version of German, Polish, and Dutch, they can learn English like the rest of us. It not up to me to accomodate them. Get out of you ivory tower and come to the real world.

 

[FK04US]

As a Dominos driver 16 years, when Hispanics out number anyother ehtnic group who expect me to change a 50 or 100 for a 12 dollar pizza, that tells me they are not doing all to bad money wise. Latinos are not the majority of Catholics with in the USA Polish or Irish or even Germans would outnumber them easily. My ancestors learned Eglish from The Austrian version of German, Polish, and Dutch, they can learn English like the rest of us. It not up to me to accomodate them. Get out of you ivory tower and come to the real world.

My dear brother, what you fail to understand is that Hispanics are the only group where Catholicism is growing in the USA. And you also fail to understand that they are learning English. I actually worked with Hispanic youth at my parish and they all speak English, but they pray in Spanish, as they were taught by their parents.

The real world is the one you are denying.There IS a latinization of the Catholic Church in the USA and you may want to stop it, but it is not going to happen. A parish priest in my region mentioned a few months ago, we see many white Catholics at funeral, while most of the Latinos are at baptisms. The future of the Church is here, with Hispanics being at the center, and there is no turning back.

 

[MumboJumbo]

My dear brother, what you fail to understand is that Hispanics are the only group where Catholicism is growing in the USA. And you also fail to understand that they are learning English. I actually worked with Hispanic youth at my parish and they all speak English, but they pray in Spanish, as they were taught by their parents.

The real world is the one you are denying.There IS a latinization of the Catholic Church in the USA and you may want to stop it, but it is not going to happen. A parish priest in my region mentioned a few months ago, we see many white Catholics at funeral, while most of the Latinos are at baptisms. The future of the Church is here, with Hispanics being at the center, and there is no turning back.

Sorry. The truth is that they might sign up to be Catholic but they don’t practice their religion. I’ve heard Mexican Catholics complain about how cheap their own people are. How they will spend $$$ on a baptism party to look like “big shots” but complain about the $50 they must give to the church for the baptism. These same people want to do the minimum it takes to get into heaven. I suggest becoming protestant where everybody gets a freeride to the heaven just by being “saved”. No crucifix to remind one of the cost.

And that parish priest will soon be looking for a new job because white people open the parishes and hispanics get them closed.

 

[josephdavid]

Remember boys and girls the history of this nation. Latinos discovered this side of the world (Spaniards).

Spanish was widely spoken from West of the Mississippi and Florida. Latinos have been part of this nation since the beginning. The culture has been here since the 1700’s.

It was the white anglo-Americans who said we were less than cultured because of our Latino cultures (there are many cultures such as Mexican, Columbian, Peurto Rican, etc.) I grew up in Wisconsin where I was not white enough (father was of German family). I was denied learning Spanish in schools but my German Oma who taught me German , encouraged me to embrace my Mexican history for my ancestors been here longer than other cultures here (including English). She scolded her son because he was a bigot. So I was able to learn both.

When I went to Germany as a kid and lived and worked there from high school and on… they loved to learn about Mexican and Latino history/culture.

But most American’s here? Forget their history and are afraid of it.

It is fear that is the cause of themany posts here. I pray that they will overcome their fears and hug and embrace the Latino culture as American. We are a melting pot.

Oh… rememeber Spain help us fight the Revolutionary war: Federico Fernández Cavada, a Lieutenant Colonel for the Union, fought bravely at Gettysburg, fought for the Union.
General Bernardo de Gálvez sent money, rifles, and other supplies to General George Washington. Captain Jorge Farragut came to the U.S. from the Spanish Island of Minorca to fight against the British. Captain Farragut fought in the Revolution, then in the War of 1812, as part of the U.S. Navy.

Not to mention our Lady of Guadelupe. Which our blessed Mother showed herself to a indegenous Mexican St. San Juan Diego.

So before you criticize Latinos for embracing their heritage in their Parishes. Remember your American History. Thanks to Latinos we have our freedoms. Oh do not forget the French either because they played a big part in our Indepedence.

 

[FK04US]

Sorry. The truth is that they might sign up to be Catholic but they don’t practice their religion. I’ve heard Mexican Catholics complain about how cheap their own people are. How they will spend $$$ on a baptism party to look like “big shots” but complain about the $50 they must give to the church for the baptism. These same people want to do the minimum it takes to get into heaven. I suggest becoming protestant where everybody gets a freeride to the heaven just by being “saved”. No crucifix to remind one of the cost.

So it´s all about the money isn´t it? So Christian!
And I would appreciate if you can lower your judgment at our brothers and sisters. Who are you to tell them to leave their Church? You do not know how much suffering they have to face on an every day basis. They feel discriminated, rejected, and Church is many times the only place where they feel loved in a strange country. You don´t know about their individual and spiritual struggles.

And that parish priest will soon be looking for a new job because white people open the parishes and hispanics get them closed

It´s actually the other way around. Many parishes have not been closed because Latinos joined. You should also check the USCCB instructions for Priestly Formation in Seminaries. They mandate the seminarians to learn Spanish, so all of our future priests can minister to Hispanics.

As I said, some of you guys are denying the obvious, that our Church will not have a white majority in the next decades. So, unless you are an old person, it may not be a bad idea to start embracing diversity and welcoming the strangers into ****our ****and **their ** Catholic Church.

 

[aspawloski4th]

My dear brother, what you fail to understand is that Hispanics are the only group where Catholicism is growing in the USA. And you also fail to understand that they are learning English. I actually worked with Hispanic youth at my parish and they all speak English, but they pray in Spanish, as they were taught by their parents.

The real world is the one you are denying.There IS a latinization of the Catholic Church in the USA and you may want to stop it, but it is not going to happen. A parish priest in my region mentioned a few months ago, we see many white Catholics at funeral, while most of the Latinos are at baptisms. The future of the Church is here, with Hispanics being at the center, and there is no turning back.

What you fail to reconise is Latinos are growing the fastest in nearly all Christian denominations, while still not learning English. Theres a Latino family nextdoor to me that moved in 9 years ago, and they still don’t know a word of English. I offered to teach a few of them so they can assimilate and they refused. Are you saying this experience is a figment of my imagination? I remember back in the mid 1970s when Saigon fell many Vietnamese moved to my community as reugees, there was a parish set up especially for them. But they have assimilated and very few know Vietnamese anymore and that is as it should be. Most of them go to non Viet. namese pariishes now.In the spring of 1975 as Vietnamese family that had just escaped Vietnem were taken in my the nun’s who lived at a nun retirement home across the street from my family. One of the nuns had my dad meet the parents, asking the favor if they could come and borrow our swimming pool during the summer because the weather had been heating up already. When we first met them they knew no English at all. By the end of August they were able to carry on conversations with any of my family just fine.Thats assimilating! The family nextdoor to me now hasn’t.

 

[aspawloski4th]

Remember boys and girls the history of this nation. Latinos discovered this side of the world (Spaniards).

Spanish was widely spoken from West of the Mississippi and Florida. Latinos have been part of this nation since the beginning. The culture has been here since the 1700’s.

It was the white anglo-Americans who said we were less than cultured because of our Latino cultures (there are many cultures such as Mexican, Columbian, Peurto Rican, etc.) I grew up in Wisconsin where I was not white enough (father was of German family). I was denied learning Spanish in schools but my German Oma who taught me German , encouraged me to embrace my Mexican history for my ancestors been here longer than other cultures here (including English). She scolded her son because he was a bigot. So I was able to learn both.

When I went to Germany as a kid and lived and worked there from high school and on… they loved to learn about Mexican and Latino history/culture.

But most American’s here? Forget their history and are afraid of it.

It is fear that is the cause of themany posts here. I pray that they will overcome their fears and hug and embrace the Latino culture as American. We are a melting pot.

Oh… rememeber Spain help us fight the Revolutionary war: Federico Fernández Cavada, a Lieutenant Colonel for the Union, fought bravely at Gettysburg, fought for the Union.
General Bernardo de Gálvez sent money, rifles, and other supplies to General George Washington. Captain Jorge Farragut came to the U.S. from the Spanish Island of Minorca to fight against the British. Captain Farragut fought in the Revolution, then in the War of 1812, as part of the U.S. Navy.

Not to mention our Lady of Guadelupe. Which our blessed Mother showed herself to a indegenous Mexican St. San Juan Diego.

So before you criticize Latinos for embracing their heritage in their Parishes. Remember your American History. Thanks to Latinos we have our freedoms. Oh do not forget the French either because they played a big part in our Indepedence.

First off Christopher Columbus was Italian. If you want to multiculturalize everything you are forgetting General Casmir Pulaski who helped us win the revolutionary war. In geting legitimacy for our new nation it was Croatia that was the first country to reconise the USA as an independant nation. When the English general gave an explaination to King George as to why they lost the war, they blamed the Irish and their gurelle type tactics as to why they lost. In colonial times when The USA was deciding on an official language for the new nation there was a nation wide vote and English beat German by one vote, and Spanish was never considered. as far as releations with Spain> Ive met speople from Spain on several occasions. Unanimously they think Hispanics give them a bad name and want not to be associated with them. So the Latin cuture has a few things as a part of the American culture with in the Catholic church, So does Irish, German, Polish etc etc.