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Lay Catholic leaving the Catholic Church, Protestant Ministers joining the Catholic Church, what is going on?
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wardrandolph
Guest
Thank you.Very good info.May our Lord Bless you.
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Delta2
Guest
Some arguments in there are just a evidence that protestant reformation was a anti-christ movement.
Jesus Himself said:
The church is the pillar and ground of the truth not the bible because the writtings CAN KILL if wrong interpreted
But if I tarry long, that thou mayest know how thou oughtest to behave thyself in the house of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and ground of the truth.
1 Timothy, 3-15
God applies their merits to those who needs.
It far more easy to confess a big sin to no one other than God Himself
But is useless because it’s easy and the proud remains, where is the shame ?
But if we confess to another person, and in the house of god in His presence…UAU !!! terrible thing to do
I feel ashamed all the time to confess my weakness, a lot of shame, to God and to that man I confess, sometimes I even try to choose between the confessors at least not to be hardly recriminated
This is the truth, that one of the Protestants are the Snake of Genesis point of View
The bible is only a book without any authority over Catholic Church. It was the catholic church who made the bible and how it must be correctly interpreted
Jesus Himself said:
- And his disciples came and said to him: Why speakest thou to them in parables?
- Who answered and said to them: Because to you it is given to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven: but to them it is not given.
- For he that hath, to him shall be given, and he shall abound: but he that hath not, from him shall be taken away that also which he hath.
Matthew, 13:10-12
The church is the pillar and ground of the truth not the bible because the writtings CAN KILL if wrong interpreted
But if I tarry long, that thou mayest know how thou oughtest to behave thyself in the house of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and ground of the truth.
1 Timothy, 3-15
Jesus sacrifice as our savior, works a an Infinite Merit to forgife our sins. The saints also contribute with merits to others
God applies their merits to those who needs.
Here is one that I like most, it makes me remember Genesis and Original sin : vainglory, self-pride, self-conceit
It far more easy to confess a big sin to no one other than God Himself
But is useless because it’s easy and the proud remains, where is the shame ?
But if we confess to another person, and in the house of god in His presence…UAU !!! terrible thing to do
I feel ashamed all the time to confess my weakness, a lot of shame, to God and to that man I confess, sometimes I even try to choose between the confessors at least not to be hardly recriminated
This is the truth, that one of the Protestants are the Snake of Genesis point of View
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notself
Guest
That was a very interesting article. I wish it had more independent references on why people leave the RCC and why ministers from other denominations are joining. Without independent references some of the conclusions are a bit weak.
Some lay people have left the RCC because of recent scandals and because of how the scandals were handled by the RCC. I would think that those who fall into this category would join a denomination close to that of the RCC such as the Anglican Church.
I do agree that Evangelical Churches have a strong pull on Catholics with children and with young couples. I have in my family, nieces and nephews who have left the RCC for Evangelical Churches because of the family oriented program of activities offered by the Evangelical Churches.
The Pew study on Religion in America shows that American Catholics have been leaving the RCC in alarming numbers. The loss of membership in the RCC is over 25% and it would be even larger if Hispanic immigrants had not made up for some of the loss.
Ministers from other denominations may be joining the Church because they seek the financial security offered by the Church and if they are married, they can continue to be married. In Protestant denominations, the salaries of ministers are paid from the collection plate. If the minister is not well liked, has poor fund raising skills, or has a very small congregation, his income may not be enough to support him and his family. The above is just speculation on my part. The article does not really support the numbers of ministers who are joining the RCC nor does it support the reasons for their change. It offers only anecdotal comments.
It is an interesting article but more research needs to be undertaken to support its conclusions. Without well documented studies, the RCC in America may continue to lose membership.
Some lay people have left the RCC because of recent scandals and because of how the scandals were handled by the RCC. I would think that those who fall into this category would join a denomination close to that of the RCC such as the Anglican Church.
I do agree that Evangelical Churches have a strong pull on Catholics with children and with young couples. I have in my family, nieces and nephews who have left the RCC for Evangelical Churches because of the family oriented program of activities offered by the Evangelical Churches.
The Pew study on Religion in America shows that American Catholics have been leaving the RCC in alarming numbers. The loss of membership in the RCC is over 25% and it would be even larger if Hispanic immigrants had not made up for some of the loss.
Ministers from other denominations may be joining the Church because they seek the financial security offered by the Church and if they are married, they can continue to be married. In Protestant denominations, the salaries of ministers are paid from the collection plate. If the minister is not well liked, has poor fund raising skills, or has a very small congregation, his income may not be enough to support him and his family. The above is just speculation on my part. The article does not really support the numbers of ministers who are joining the RCC nor does it support the reasons for their change. It offers only anecdotal comments.
It is an interesting article but more research needs to be undertaken to support its conclusions. Without well documented studies, the RCC in America may continue to lose membership.
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Le_Cracquere
Guest
Someone could interpret the article’s data thus: the least serious Catholics tend to leave the Catholic Church, and the most serious Protestants tend to gravitate towards it.
That’s probably a tendentious reading, and it begs more than a few questions, but it matches up with tons of real-world examples that I’ve encountered. Wonder if there’s something to it.
That’s probably a tendentious reading, and it begs more than a few questions, but it matches up with tons of real-world examples that I’ve encountered. Wonder if there’s something to it.
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buffalo
Guest
Some are finding the truth, some can’t deal with the truth.
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notself
Guest
I think a serious study needs to be done. Without the facts of the problem there can be no solution. A comment like the one below doesn’t help the situation. It sounds flip and smug. It is not a way to influence Catholics to search deeper into their faith. It sounds like a Hollywood sound bite from a bad movie.
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puzzleannie
Guest
my guess would be the average Protestant minister is in that vocation in part because he has a love of reading and learning more about the Word, about theology, and is trained, however false the premises of his training may be, to investigate sources for development of doctrine. a person who has that innate love will continue to read, study and pray throughout his life, and if blessed or led to investigate Catholic sources such as the Early Fathers, will eventually find the truth. Whether or not he can make the psychological and spiritual leap to changing religious affiliate depends on a lot of factors, but there is no doubt in my mind that someone whose life is based on hearing and heeding the Word will someday hear and heed all of it.
I would further opine that the average member of any religion who leaves his denomination does so because of a human problem, relationship, hurt, injury, resentment or dissatisfaction, rather than for doctrinal reasons. That can be anything from “I don’t care for the music or style of preaching” to “I can’t stand the carpet they have” or “Preacher chose Sally to arrange the flowers for Easter, when I have been doing it for years, so I am leaving the church” to “the priest gave us a hard time about living together for 5 years when we went in to arrange for our big fancy church wedding”.
I would further opine that the average member of any religion who leaves his denomination does so because of a human problem, relationship, hurt, injury, resentment or dissatisfaction, rather than for doctrinal reasons. That can be anything from “I don’t care for the music or style of preaching” to “I can’t stand the carpet they have” or “Preacher chose Sally to arrange the flowers for Easter, when I have been doing it for years, so I am leaving the church” to “the priest gave us a hard time about living together for 5 years when we went in to arrange for our big fancy church wedding”.
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ufamtobie
Guest
Hi notself,
The Lay people that are leaving the Catholic Faith are people who was not truly faithful Catholic from the begining did not believe in the full teachings of the Catholic Church therfore they left.
As for the names of the Protestant Ministers who became Catholic search in google you will find many many names.
Ufamtobie
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inthecloud
Guest
Nietzche said that Reformation was the beginnig of the death of Christianity.
Atheist Christ Hitchens call himself an Atheist Protestant. Saying that his Atheism carries the Reformation to the logical end.
The Reformers during each generation began to question more and more each of the CC teachings. Hitchens says his Atheism carries Protestantism tendency to the logical end. Question God, Jesus and the Bible.
That was exactly Nietzches point.
Atheist Christ Hitchens call himself an Atheist Protestant. Saying that his Atheism carries the Reformation to the logical end.
The Reformers during each generation began to question more and more each of the CC teachings. Hitchens says his Atheism carries Protestantism tendency to the logical end. Question God, Jesus and the Bible.
That was exactly Nietzches point.
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brycelaliberte
Guest
Very true. While some Protestant denominations can still carry some residual Catholic-ness with it, the more it sheds of Catholic Tradition, the more it sheds Christianity. Until you get to the Unitarian Universalist Church, which is just a fancy way of saying “Whatever.”
Hence why the Church is ultimately important for the preservation of all teachings.
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jmcrae
Guest
I believe that the Holy Spirit is doing a bit of New Springtime housecleaning - getting rid of the dross, selling off or throwing away that which is broken and useless, getting rid of the dust, washing the whole house clean, and polishing up the pure silver and gold.
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J_C
Guest
down here at ground level here’s what I see. Catholic parishes in my city are packed, and growing more packed every year. our RCIA programs are full of protestants coming home. all I can say is, if 25% of American Catholics have gone to sects, it probably is a good thing, because we wouldn’t have room for them if thy stayed.
of course I believe they will be back, and will bring some of their compatriots with them. They are like seeds, cast abroad. They will learn and grow, and when they come back home tehy will bring a new fire and spirit with them. we have much to learn from our protestant brethren.
I think this is all a work of God,
of course I believe they will be back, and will bring some of their compatriots with them. They are like seeds, cast abroad. They will learn and grow, and when they come back home tehy will bring a new fire and spirit with them. we have much to learn from our protestant brethren.
I think this is all a work of God,
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Pier
Guest
Excellent thread and posts.
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Lilyflower
Guest
I dearly love the Church and faith but I can understand folk being disholusioned and leaving the Church.
An Arch-bishop who strongly publically disapproves of masonry then grants a special dispensations to senior public figures, it stinks.
An Arch-bishop who strongly publically disapproves of masonry then grants a special dispensations to senior public figures, it stinks.
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notself
Guest
How do you know what is in the minds of other or for that matter what they hold in their hearts?
I am sure that there are ministers who converted to the RCC, but they do not have to take a vow of celibacy. They could still be married. The number of Catholics wanting to be priests has dropped so precipitously that some monasteries are in danger of closing.
The real issue is the Church has lost a significant portion of its membership. The number would be even larger if we had not has so many Hispanic immigrants to this country. I think it would be wise of the RCC to perform a study to find out the reasons people are leaving the Church. The reason may be that these people are unschooled in their faith. What should the RCC do about the situation? Should they just let the attrition continue with the excuse that it is all the fault of the person leaving?
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ufamtobie
Guest
Hi Notself,
I am not worried about the Church losing a significant number of memberships. Why… because Jesus said " the GATES OF HELL WILL NOT PREVAIL AGAINST IT… if i worry then thats means i don’t Trust in Jesus Christ. However I do pray for the Catholics to find thier way back home.
And about immigrants, The Holy family Jesus Mary and Joseph were immigrants when they fled into Egypt to escape from Herod.
So JESUS IS NOT AGAINST IMMIGRANTS.
This Great Nation the United States Of America, is built by immigrants from all walks of life and that is beautiful.
I say let the people that are so called Catholic leave if they want to be like the prodigal son and leave the Catholic Church thats up to them God gave us each free will. I JUST PRAY THAT THEY COME TO THIER SENSES AND COME BACK HOME TO THE CATHOLIC CHURCH.
Ufamtobie
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paarsurrey
Guest
Hi
Sorry , English is not my mother tongue. I don’t understand "Lay Catholic ", even wikipedia has not helped. Kindly explain it for me.
Let us together work for the peace of the world, so vital for all of us.
Thanks
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J_C
Guest
No worries. God is in control. All things work together for good for those who love God.
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