LDS and Catholic Differences

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I was an LDS Priesthood Quorum Instructor (Aaronic and Melchizedek) , Sunday School Teacher and Stake Sunday School Superintendent and I assure you that in any Mormon setting, any significant study of the Apostolic Fathers or Early Church Fathers would be met with immediate displeasure and eventual censure. A foundational dogma of the Mormon Church is that the true Gospel was lost with the death of the last of Christ’s Twelve Apostles, and that everything (teaching or doctrine) between that point and the “Restoration” of the “Gospel” to Joseph Smith was an “abomination”.
 
ParkerD said:
Marie5890,

I’m trying to remember at what age I understood Jesus was Jewish. Perhaps at about age eight. Perhaps earlier. Perhaps this fact is not emphasized in some way that you were expecting, but it is included in hymns (“rejected by His own”), and certainly included when anyone studies the life of Jesus the Christ. Whenever children dress up to depict the “first Christmas”, they are usually told that they are to dress up in a way that represents the Jewish culture of the time of Christ. How could Christ be a direct descendant of David, and not be Jewish? He was the rightful king of the kingdom of Judah, and this is taught to children at a young age.

What you have demonstrated is that your situation within Mormonism was not a deep involvement, nor a deep study, to have such a view. I have found through reading on these threads that as people emphasize Catholics “owning” the Bible and disregarding that the Jews were the primary source of the Bible, that quite the opposite from what you have expressed seems to be prevalent.

Have a good day. You might read Jesus the Christ, by James E Talmage, at some point, if you want to understand the LDS perspective about Jesus being a Jew.
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  1. I have read Talmage’s JtC.
  2. You missed entirely my point. A person going to either the LDS temple, or a Sacrament meeting or any other church meeting will get no sense of Hebrew roots.
There is nothing in LDS worship that has the echos of Jesus being a Jew.

We have a gentleman in RCIA right now who is Jewish and will be fully initiated into the Catholic church at the Easter Vigil.
He often talks about what it was like for him coming to Mass with his Catholic wife. Says it reminds of his childhood going to Temple. He felt the familiarity of his being Hebrew echoed in Catholic worship.

I dont expect a Jewish person attending Mormon worship services will sense the echos of their heritage there.
 
Michael_Vernon said:
I was an LDS Priesthood Quorum Instructor (Aaronic and Melchizedek) , Sunday School Teacher and Stake Sunday School Superintendent and I assure you that in any Mormon setting, any significant study of the Apostolic Fathers or Early Church Fathers would be met with immediate displeasure and eventual censure. A foundational dogma of the Mormon Church is that the true Gospel was lost with the death of the last of Christ’s Twelve Apostles, and that everything (teaching or doctrine) between that point and the “Restoration” of the “Gospel” to Joseph Smith was an “abomination”.
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Michael Vernon,
A reader of Hugh Nibley’s writings is going to be familiar with the Dead Sea Scrolls and other writings and with there having been a hidden cultural aspect of the early church that ties with temple worship. It would seem that only shallow students would make the kind of remark that you have noted in your post.

An “abomination” is a description from the Old Testament, and has to do with any doctrine of the gospel which is taught and practiced that is not pure–meaning that it does not lead to exaltation. Certainly, exaltation implies covenant marriages and the keeping of temple covenants, so one can see why God would inspire prophets to write that teaching for doctrines “the commandments of men” would be an “abomination” in the sight of God, because that does not lead to exaltation and in fact leads to a belief that there is no such thing as gaining the exaltation taught by John in the book of Revelation.
 
Marie5890 said:
  1. I have read Talmage’s JtC.
  2. You missed entirely my point. A person going to either the LDS temple, or a Sacrament meeting or any other church meeting will get no sense of Hebrew roots.
There is nothing in LDS worship that has the echos of Jesus being a Jew.

We have a gentleman in RCIA right now who is Jewish and will be fully initiated into the Catholic church at the Easter Vigil.
He often talks about what it was like for him coming to Mass with his Catholic wife. Says it reminds of his childhood going to Temple. He felt the familiarity of his being Hebrew echoed in Catholic worship.

I dont expect a Jewish person attending Mormon worship services will sense the echos of their heritage there.
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Marie5890,
I guess I did miss your point. There are many Jewish converts to the LDS faith–at least one a prominent scholar at BYU. They add to the LDS combined heritage, and are regarded with great respect and admiration as a covenant people with a promised future.
 
Marie5890 said:
Believe in the ECF’s? As a whole Mormons reject the ECF’s, we all know that. They dont study the ECF.

They see the ECF’s as being Catholic (surprise, surprise) so they are ignored.
You dont hear any talk or even general conference address by a GA where an ECF is used.
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Except when misquoting them out of context, twisting words, and ideas, to an end that was never intended.
 
ParkerD said:
Michael Vernon,
A reader of Hugh Nibley’s writings is going to be familiar with the Dead Sea Scrolls and other writings and with there having been a hidden cultural aspect of the early church that ties with temple worship. It would seem that only shallow students would make the kind of remark that you have noted in your post.

An “abomination” is a description from the Old Testament, and has to do with any doctrine of the gospel which is taught and practiced that is not pure–meaning that it does not lead to exaltation. Certainly, exaltation implies covenant marriages and the keeping of temple covenants, so one can see why God would inspire prophets to write that teaching for doctrines “the commandments of men” would be an “abomination” in the sight of God, because that does not lead to exaltation and in fact leads to a belief that there is no such thing as gaining the exaltation taught by John in the book of Revelation.
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All made up BS, no backing whatsoever, other than your imagination…I don’t know how you can walk and breath at the same time. Honestly.
 
Michael_Vernon said:
A foundational dogma of the Mormon Church is that the true Gospel was lost with the death of the last of Christ’s Twelve Apostles
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Don’t forget that the last Apostle never died. Oops I guess that little thing means that the true Gospel couldn’t have possibly been lost and that there was no need for Mormonism to begin with!

BTW, Clement was the third successor to St. Peter as bishop of Rome. (For Mormons, that means that he was the fourth bishop of Rome or Pope–I remember a Mormon in the past not being able to figure that out.) He was Catholic–through and through–our family. (And since the Apostle John was still alive…wait you’ll think that he’s still alive…
 
AMDGtoo said:
Don’t forget that the last Apostle never died. Oops I guess that little thing means that the true Gospel couldn’t have possibly been lost and that there was no need for Mormonism to begin with!

BTW, Clement was the third successor to St. Peter as bishop of Rome. (For Mormons, that means that he was the fourth bishop of Rome or Pope–I remember a Mormon in the past not being able to figure that out.) He was Catholic–through and through–our family. (And since the Apostle John was still alive…wait you’ll think that he’s still alive…
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AMDGtoo,
Ironic to talk about the apostle John, when he held keys that Clement did not hold.

John was taken “into the wilderness” along with the church, as he saw happening in vision. He had a different role as a translated being than as a mortal person. But yes, he was still on the earth so the gospel was never “totally” gone since he had it with him wherever he went. His keys, given to him by Christ, were part of the restoration through Joseph Smith of the authority of the priesthood by Peter, James and John.
 
ParkerD said:
AMDGtoo,
Ironic to talk about the apostle John, when he held keys that Clement did not hold.
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The “Keys of the Kingdom of heaven” were given to Peter alone (Matthew 16:19) All the Apostles were given the power to remit sins (John 20:23)

Clement was ordained by St. Peter, and was the third successor to St. Peter as the bishop of Rome (fourth Bishop of Rome). It was he, not John the Apostle who was much closer to the problem, who was called to settle a problem in the Church at Corinth. Oh, one realizes that Clement acted as Pope when one realizes that Corinth was an Eastern Church which was not within the ordinary jurisdiction of Rome (that’s just in case there is a claim that Clement was just acting as head of his local community.)
 
Marie5890 said:
There is no sense in Mormonism that Jesus was Jewish. One cant really sense any Hebrew roots in its culture.

In Catholicism, it is evident that He was as Hebrew roots are very present in our faith.

I find that a significant difference
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You have GOT to be kidding.
 
dianaiad said:
You have GOT to be kidding.
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Take a practicing Jew into Mormon worship services, the temple or sacrament meeting.
Then take them to Catholic Mass.

You will see I am hard-core NOT kidding. Not by a long shot.
 
Marie5890 said:
Take a practicing Jew into Mormon worship services, the temple or sacrament meeting.
Then take them to Catholic Mass.

You will see I am hard-core NOT kidding. Not by a long shot.
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Marie, I have lost count of the number of Christians who are convinced that Jesus was a Christian, and are insulted past bearing to hear that He was Jewish. Mormons are very aware that He was a Jew.
 
dianaiad said:
Marie, I have lost count of the number of Christians who are convinced that Jesus was a Christian, and are insulted past bearing to hear that He was Jewish. Mormons are very aware that He was a Jew.
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Don’t equate the views of our separated evangelical brothers with those of Catholics, who know that Jesus was Jewish…
 
It seems to me to be ironic that someone would say that Christians believe Jesus Christ was a Christian, not a Jew. Oy vey! Did it escape you that the word Christian comes from the word Christ? Please look-up the derivation of the word Christian and find out where and when it was first used, historically and Biblically.
I would be interested in knowing what significant vestiges of Jadaism of any age there are in Mormonism. Please don’t say temple building. There is no scriptural or historical evidence that Jews used the Tabernacle or Temple for anything that remotely resembles what Mormons do in the structures they call temples.
Have you considered why it is that Jews are vociferously against Mormons doing baptisms for the dead with the names of deceased Jews?
As someone who worked for two years as a volunteer for The Jewish Voice, a Hebrew-Christian ministry closely allied with Jews for Jesus, I can tell you that my Jewish friends would be aghast at your suggestion that there is anything Jewish in Mormonism.
On the other hand, there hasn’t been a day in my life as a Christian that I haven’t read from the Psalms, and also been reminded that Gabriel told Mary that Jesus would rule on the Throne of His father David over the House of Israel forever. Baruch haShem Adonai!
 
dianaiad said:
Marie, I have lost count of the number of Christians who are convinced that Jesus was a Christian, and are insulted past bearing to hear that He was Jewish. Mormons are very aware that He was a Jew.
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Diana,

The name of this thread is LDS and Catholic differences.

One of those very big difference is that Catholicism heavily echos Christ being a Jew.
In Her very worship services, Her rites, etc. etc.

Mormonism is devoid of any sense of Christianity’s Hebrew roots. Catholicism, or Orthodoxy for that matter, on the other hand, is not.

Where in any of Mormons worship services is there any sense of Christ was Jewish?

Again, take a practicing Jew to both Catholic worship services, and then Mormon worship services.

Ask them to tell you what they think.
They will find both Catholicism and Orthodoxy is far more familiar to them than Mormonism.
 
ParkerD said:
You might read Jesus the Christ, by James E Talmage, at some point, if you want to understand the LDS perspective about Jesus being a Jew.
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…or if you want to get a view of some of the nuttiest Mormon teachings, such as the belief that the wedding at Cana was Jesus’ wedding and that Jesus was a polygamist.

Paul (a former Mormon, now happily Catholic)
 
Marie5890 said:
Take a practicing Jew into Mormon worship services, the temple or sacrament meeting.
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…And he would instantly recognize the similarities with Solomon’s temple and feel very at home.

Cheesh, you have to be kidding. You obviously know nothing about the Old Testament and temple worship.
 
PaulDupre said:
…or if you want to get a view of some of the nuttiest Mormon teachings, such as the belief that the wedding at Cana was Jesus’ wedding and that Jesus was a polygamist.

Paul (a former Mormon, now happily Catholic)
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Which as usual for Paul, is a distortion and non- doctrinal.

Show me one doctrinal source for either of these.
 
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