LDS beliefs about Jesus Christ?

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LDS have added since then, but haven’t taken anything away. They have revised the Book of Mormon at least twice since then, I think, once I know for certain as it happened in my lifetime. That was when they tried to make it more color neutral.
Section 101 removed, replaced with section 132. “Lectures On Faith” removed.

1835 edition section 101:

“Inasmuch as this Church of Christ has been reproached with the crime of fornication and polygamy, we declare that we believe that one man should have one wife, and one woman but one husband, except in the case of death, when either is at liberty to marry again.”

(JS “married” Fanny Alger in 1833.)
 
I will point to my last comments to ParkerD: It took Christians a few hundred years to get its ducks in a row, and then it still had problems dealing with power when it got it, and defining many dogmas for a few more centuries. I suppose that Mormons can’t acknowledge that what they experience inn these revisionist movements equates to our revelation through tradition which they call Apostasy.
Mormonism changes for pragmatic reasons, which has nothing to do with the Early Church.
 
So you are using conjecture and insisting it is logical and thus must be LDS Doctirne?

Have you ever bothered to apply your keen mind and logical intuition to your own faith?
No conjecture. No logic. The result of listening to teachers and leaders. Yes, I applied my keen mind and intuition to my own faith for decades, and accepted the things that did not make sense despite my personal reasoning. One must doubt oneself before the Wisdom of Church leaders, and their explanations of contradiction in scripture, mustn’t one? I found this particularly true as one who recognized how far my behavior fell short of Church expectations, and admitted so to leaders.

Then, without looking for it, I found Catholicism. You may want to read some of my older posts.
 
Peter, my statement is valid because I was pointing out the irony of our dectractors and what they say about our respective leaders.

I can’t coimment on your gossip and I’m not familiar nor am I interested. I repeat that we are led by men like the rest of us. They will sin and we will have to deal with it. If you believe the Catholic church has handled their scandles much better, I caution you to reconsider.
Gossip?
Polygamy was a scandal. The Mt. Meadows Massacre was a scandal. Paul H. Dunn’s deception is so public record he even published a letter of apology in the LDS Church News – but the church employee who found out about the lie and disclosed it was fired because he violated a requirement of church employment to not disseminate disparaging information about LDS leaders, even if true.

For all that, Catholic leaders have done worse things because they have had greater power to abuse, but we do not try to call a manure pile chocolate pudding.
 
Please post an offical reference to this teaching. The LDS chuch still has prior versions of their teaching manuals online, for you to reference. I will be the first to admit some teachings have been removed because they are not doctrine.

Again, please support your claim.

ps. I take it you now admit we believe the same on Jesus?
Last question first: Where did you get that from? I believe what the 1830 edition of the Book of Mormon says about Jesus, even though I believe the Book of Mormon a fabrication itself: Jesus is the Very Eternal Father and Mary is the Mother of God.

I do not believe that Jesus is a spirit child of the Father, because he is the Father. I do not believe that God had spirit children in a pre-existence, making Jesus our literal brother. We are his creations, and did not exist except as a dream in the mind of God (so to speak) until our conception.

I do not believe that Jesus is 1/3 of the Trinity. Part of the mystery of God is that each member of the Trinity is fully God, and each is also an individual, and God is indivisible even though including all of them. The only body God has is the Body of Christ. 1X1X1=1.

Regarding the rest of it, it may have to wait a few months until I can get home and go through my grandfather’s books.
 
SteveVH,

The “select group of people” could be children in elementary school, if they learned grammar and followed the grammar of the passage we are talking about. How it got “hidden” and “veiled” is by those who wanted no such thing as eternal marriage, easily finding a way of looking at those verses in the way they wanted them to mean, and then everyone else following their lead.

The verses and the grammar are simple enough. A child, using grammar but not having the prior influence of “this is what it says” (i.e. tradition), could easily see the direct meaning in the passage, particularly with some basic knowledge of understood pronouns within verb conjugations.
I see. So even a child can understand. And the influence of the apostate Church has diminished the ability of its members to engage in critical thinking. Maybe this question should be asked on the television show “Are You Smarter Than A Fifth Grader”. This is one of the more patronizing remarks I’ve seen, Parker.

Along with that is the supposition that there are those who, for no apparent reason, “wanted no such thing as eternal marriage” and therefore twisted the meaning of the scriptures to keep this hidden. You do not even consider the possibility that this view was arrived at by listening to very words of Jesus and knowing that eternal life in heaven is above our human ability to even conceive. It assumes that we must take the Mormon position which can not imagine anything greater than purely human relationships and a God who is no greater in his very essence than we; He has just been around longer and had more time to progress.
He did make it very clear. Others took what He said and made it less clear, less impactful to them and others who followed them.
Yes, and his name was Joseph Smith.
Jesus spoke very plainly about the marriage of Adam and Eve, which marriage “God hath joined together” and man should not “put asunder”. Adam and Eve were given commandments for their happiness, not for less than their happiness. They were given to each other for an eternal purpose, not for a “time only” purpose.
Please show me where, after the fall, that God said they were given to each other for eternity.
 
I see. So even a child can understand. And the influence of the apostate Church has diminished the ability of its members to engage in critical thinking.
My remark had to do with critical thinking, yes, and with the use of pronouns and verbs and construction of sentences and paragraphs (i.e. if one takes the verses and puts them into paragraph format). I didn’t say anything about an “apostate church”. But people often will not take words of a scriptural passage and think about them as an "experience’ where people were actually there, on the scene, listening.

Jesus was the absolute Master teacher, the absolute best user of language who has ever walked upon the earth. One who thinks He would take the subject of a paragraph, use the verb that continued with the theme and the subject and greatly expand the subject without inserting a new subject, does not give Him much credit for being a Master teacher or a Master user of language. I know of no precedent in any other passage in the New Testament where “they” suddenly embraces a universal meaning when just before it had a specific meaning about a specific, clearly identified subject. The pronoun “they” is added for us in English, but in many languages the pronoun is understood within the verb conjugation.

Put another way, “Sadducees” is a small subset of the “set” that is “all of humankind”. If a subject begins with a subset, a good user of language stays with that subset to make their meaning clear, if they are using understood pronouns in the way Jesus used them. He doesn’t change to the “universal set” without announcing that there is now a new, expanded, “universal” subject for what He is about to say and teach.
… It assumes that we must take the Mormon position which can not imagine anything greater than purely human relationships…
Actually, I have explained already that Latter-day Saints view an eternal marriage relationship as far beyond a “human relationship”, but it does get its start in this life, just as Jesus said of Adam and Eve’s “human relationship”–that it was a God-given relationship, and that they were given to each other as “help meets”.

They were given to each other to build each other’s happiness, joy, fulfillment, wholeness, a God-given “oneness” that is selfless and service-oriented, and requires heartfelt communication and sharing and forgiving and changing and growing.
Please show me where, after the fall, that God said they were given to each other for eternity.
Jesus said “what God hath joined together, let not man put asunder.” It is a simple concept. God did the joining. He created a union. He is eternal. He can certainly create an eternal union.

Jesus did not say, “God hath joined them together and in eternity their marriage will be dissolved and they will be married to me.”
 
Parker,

People in heaven don’t break up relationships and send loved ones asunder.
 
Parker,

People in heaven don’t break up relationships and send loved ones asunder.
Kathleen,

It sounds to me like there is a loss of meaning going on. Jesus didn’t say “let not man send the loved one asunder”. He said “let not man put asunder,” and He was speaking specifically about marriage, where God did the joining which means it was a covenant marriage. It means the marriage, specifically, lasts because God did the joining–the union.

He had a purpose in that–evidently a purpose that was important enough that it be considered something that “let not man put asunder”. Those words are talking about marriage–not about other kinds of relationships.
 
It is a simple concept. God did the joining. He created a union. He is eternal. He can certainly create an eternal union.
Indeed. He exists in a union so tight that the three of Him is One. By His Incarnation as one of us He marries humanity, uniting us all to God. in Christ, through the Holy Ghost.
Jesus did not say, “God hath joined them together and in eternity their marriage will be dissolved and they will be married to me.”
No! Paul did, in almost those words ! ! 👍
Romans 7:2-3
2] For the woman which hath an husband is bound by the law to her husband so long as he liveth; but if the husband be dead, she is loosed from the law of her husband.
3] So then if, while her husband liveth, she be married to another man, she shall be called an adulteress: but if her husband be dead, she is free from that law; so that she is no adulteress, though she be married to another man.
4] Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God.
I do not think I ever told you I numbered among the best scripture chasers in my stake?👍
 
Parker, I realize the Lord was speaking of marriage…but in heaven, as Gospels say, there is no marriage…and we are in communion with each other in the Lord…and nobody has any inclination to break up a Christ-centered marriage whose love extends in heaven…and shared with us…

We will share our love that we have for our particulars with one another as well…
 
Ill defined - what are tyou talking about?

And I take it you conversely believe the trinity is well defined and clearly understood by Catholics?
ROFL
Yes The Trinity is clearly defined while still remaining a mystery. And I have found through working in various ministries that yes Catholic do understand, whether or not they can articulate it is a different story.

The LDS concept does strike me as ill defined, God the Father has a body and a wife, both required for exhaltaion, or being made God. Jesus Christ has one of those yet he’s God, the Holy Ghost has neither of them and he’s God too. The Holy Ghost is a rather timid God though since He can be chased away by loud laughter, irreverent children and even a whiff of contention. Then of course we have the unmentionable God, Heavenly Mother who is apparently is necessary in order for Heavenly Father to God but is not part of the godhead. I find it all ill defined:shrug:
 
This talk makes me think when I was speaking to my superstitious in-law grandmother…whose origins I won’t disclose.

She was terrified of ghosts after her husband’s death.

I told her if they are in heaven, why would they want to come back here…and if they are in purgatory, they see God now and only want to be with Him.

And if they are in hell, they can’t get out anyway.

Long day at work…
 
Indeed. He exists in a union so tight that the three of Him is One. By His Incarnation as one of us He marries humanity, uniting us all to God. in Christ, through the Holy Ghost. No! Paul did, in almost those words ! ! 👍
Peter John,

We were discussing marriage, as in the marriage that Adam and Eve enjoyed, which was joined together by God. We weren’t discussing the uniting to God and with God that is to happen through the atoning grace of Christ as He prayed for so beautifully in His intercessory prayer. Those are two different kinds of “unions”.

You may indeed take Paul’s words and believe that they mean a real “marriage” to Christ in heaven.

But I think by reading Romans 6 and 7, one can discern that the meaning of “married” in 7:4 has to do with being “dead to the law” or in other words, receiving mercy through the grace of Christ who died for our sins, but yet He was resurrected and thus “is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God”–meaning there is a “new marriage” symbolized by real belief in Christ’s resurrection from the dead, and newness of life through Him.

That newness of life doesn’t just happen in the resurrection for us–it is supposed to happen in this life, and Paul was writing about this life, about not justifying one’s sins but living in a way that really shows a newness of life, bringing forth the fruits of the gospel in one’s life.
 
Peter John,

We were discussing marriage, as in the marriage that Adam and Eve enjoyed, which was joined together by God. We weren’t discussing the uniting to God and with God that is to happen through the atoning grace of Christ as He prayed for so beautifully in His intercessory prayer. Those are two different kinds of “unions”.

You may indeed take Paul’s words and believe that they mean a real “marriage” to Christ in heaven.

But I think by reading Romans 6 and 7, one can discern that the meaning of “married” in 7:4 has to do with being “dead to the law” or in other words, receiving mercy through the grace of Christ who died for our sins, but yet He was resurrected and thus “is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God”–meaning there is a “new marriage” symbolized by real belief in Christ’s resurrection from the dead, and newness of life through Him.

That newness of life doesn’t just happen in the resurrection for us–it is supposed to happen in this life, and Paul was writing about this life, about not justifying one’s sins but living in a way that really shows a newness of life, bringing forth the fruits of the gospel in one’s life.
Verses 7:2-4 verses say that people who are married now will not be in etermity because they will be married to Jesus instead, your choice of words. Paul understood that his audience of faithful Christians did not recognize Eternal marriage, and did not try to correct them, therefore Paul did not recognize it himself.emphasizing Matrimony as a specifically mortal vocation.
 
This talk makes me think when I was speaking to my superstitious in-law grandmother…whose origins I won’t disclose.

She was terrified of ghosts after her husband’s death.

I told her if they are in heaven, why would they want to come back here…and if they are in purgatory, they see God now and only want to be with Him.

And if they are in hell, they can’t get out anyway.

Long day at work…
If ghosts really manifest to mortals, I believe they are in purgatory. They are not in hell and are unable to move on to heaven.
 
Verses 7:2-4 verses say that people who are married now will not be in etermity because they will be married to Jesus instead, your choice of words. Paul understood that his audience of faithful Christians did not recognize Eternal marriage, and did not try to correct them, therefore Paul did not recognize it himself.emphasizing Matrimony as a specifically mortal vocation.
Peter John,

I’d be interested to know if this specific interpretation of these verses is something you came up with, or if that is a generalized commentary that is commonly taught?
 
Christ was quite clear when He said that people do not marry in heaven.

I don’t know why anyone would want to contest Jesus Christ – Who is God.

What pervades the Sacred Scriptures is first, Israel being as a bride to God, and then in the New Testament, Christ and His members as Groom and Bride…

So the eternal relationships are transcendent united in God, and marriage as we know it for this world. There are many families that have an offspring or two that do not believe, and so the work of the family is then to pray and support that one who does not have faith.

I just see Mormon penchant for such concepts in support of marriage, really a support to have belief in being a god some day with their own planet…again nothing like this in Sacred Scriptures.
 
Christ was quite clear when He said that people do not marry in heaven.

I don’t know why anyone would want to contest Jesus Christ …
Kathleen,

Since it appears your comment was directed toward me, I assure you I don’t “contest Jesus Christ.”

What I do differ with is the assumption that He was a poor user of grammar. I assuredly know that He knew the use of language, and was the world’s best user of language.

He was not a poor user of grammar, which would be the case if He had made the grammatical error that you have ascribed to His words.

Peace to you, and have a good day.
 
Again, LDS image of Christ is not the Lord. The LDS does not recognize Pentecost as the birth of the Church…and that some how the Holy Spirit disappeared or stopped working or only touched an elite few.

Jesus is God. Ancient Scriptures prophesized the coming Messiah would speak in parables.

The Lord spoke a most simple means of language

Christ’s use of words were infused with the penetrating Holy Spirit.

Christ, in union with the Holy Spirit, had power to redirect man to stop obsessing on the splinter of his neighbor’s eye, and to instead arrive at mortal man’s heart to see his possession of dark sinfulness of heart.

Some times the greatest power on earth is that which can change one’s attitude from bad to self-knowledge.

Presumptious pride is the worst sin.
 
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