Lector at the altar during consecration

[steenrots]

Hi all!

please help me with this:

Yesterday I had a ‘surprising’ mass. When the priest came with the acolyte at the beginning of the mass, the woman who reads the first lecture walked with them. She sat at the chairs which are meant for the priests and acolytes the whole mass and came forward to do the first reading and the intercession prayers.

But that wasn’t everything. When the priest went to the altar for the eucharistic prayers she stood next to him beside the altar. She kept standing there till the communion was given to her.

Should something like that happen? I am a young catholic. I read a lot but I just don’t know everything. I am from The Netherlands but I got a theology course in Austria. A lot of things happening here are very confusing to me. In Austria things like this don’t happen.

 

[palmas85]

steenrots:

Hi all!

please help me with this:

Yesterday I had a ‘surprising’ mass. When the priest came with the acolyte at the beginning of the mass, the woman who reads the first lecture walked with them. She sat at the chairs which are meant for the priests and acolytes the whole mass and came forward to do the first reading and the intercession prayers.

But that wasn’t everything. When the priest went to the altar for the eucharistic prayers she stood next to him beside the altar. She kept standing there till the communion was given to her.

Should something like that happen? I am a young catholic. I read a lot but I just don’t know everything. I am from The Netherlands but I got a theology course in Austria. A lot of things happening here are very confusing to me. In Austria things like this don’t happen.

No, she wasn’t supposed to be there. Actually here in the U.S. many many things happen at Mass that aren’t supposed to. Just keep your eyes open, and you’ll see things you could probably never even imagine.

I know thats a terrible thing to say but sadly it is very very true.

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

steenrots:

Hi all!

please help me with this:

Yesterday I had a ‘surprising’ mass. When the priest came with the acolyte at the beginning of the mass, the woman who reads the first lecture walked with them. She sat at the chairs which are meant for the priests and acolytes the whole mass and came forward to do the first reading and the intercession prayers.

But that wasn’t everything. When the priest went to the altar for the eucharistic prayers she stood next to him beside the altar. She kept standing there till the communion was given to her.

Should something like that happen? I am a young catholic. I read a lot but I just don’t know everything. I am from The Netherlands but I got a theology course in Austria. A lot of things happening here are very confusing to me. In Austria things like this don’t happen.

No she should not have been there. Extra-Ordinary ministers are only to be in the sanctuary when they have a specific function that requires them to be there, otherwise they should be in the pews. This is why Extra-Ordinary ministers of Holy Communion do not enter the sanctuary until the priest has received Communion. They have no function to fill there until then.

I suggest that the EMHC do not receive until after everyone else. Usually there are two people distributing the Body of Christ side by side. When the last person receives they can then give Communion to each other. Those distributing the Chalice usually consume the remaining Blood of Christ in the Chalice.

This eliminates a whole group of ministers gathering around the altar while the priest receives Communion when they have no need to be there.

 

[palmas85]

Br. Rich SFO:

No she should not have been there. Extra-Ordinary ministers are only to be in the sanctuary when they have a specific function that requires them to be there, otherwise they should be in the pews. This is why Extra-Ordinary ministers of Holy Communion do not enter the sanctuary until the priest has received Communion. They have no function to fill there until then.

I suggest that the EMHC do not receive until after everyone else. Usually there are two people distributing the Body of Christ side by side. When the last person receives they can then give Communion to each other. Those distributing the Chalice usually consume the remaining Blood of Christ in the Chalice.

This eliminates a whole group of ministers gathering around the altar while the priest receives Communion when they have no need to be there.

Well Brother, I agree that they should not be hovering around up there but they usually are, and I have never seen a case where they received after the congregation, always before. In fact they are usually up there from well before the consecration at the Churches I’ve been to.

 

[kmktexas]

Br. Rich SFO:

I suggest that the EMHC do not receive until after everyone else. Usually there are two people distributing the Body of Christ side by side. When the last person receives they can then give Communion to each other. Those distributing the Chalice usually consume the remaining Blood of Christ in the Chalice.

No, I think that the EMHC must always receive Communion directly from the celebrating priest. From the USCCB web site:

All receive Holy Communion in the manner described by the General Instruction to the Roman Missal, whether priest concelebrants (cf. GIRM, nos. 159, 242, 243, 246), deacons (cf. GIRM, nos. 182, 244, 246), or Extraordinary Ministers of Holy Communion (cf. GIRM, no. 284). Neither deacons nor lay ministers may ever receive Holy Communion in the manner of a concelebrating priest. The practice of Extraordinary Ministers of Holy Communion waiting to receive Holy Communion until after the distribution of Holy Communion is not in accord with liturgical law. (NDRHC, 39; GIRM, 160).

I have also read (somewhere) that the EHMCs must always receive from a priest or deacon and may not distribute Communion to each other. I am still looking for that reference.

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

kmktexas:

No, I think that the EMHC must always receive Communion directly from the celebrating priest. From the USCCB web site:

I have also read (somewhere) that the EHMCs must always receive from a priest or deacon and may not distribute Communion to each other. I am still looking for that reference.

I have floated this idea a few times. No parish has ever tried it that I know of.

"The practice of Extraordinary Ministers of Holy Communion waiting to receive Holy Communion until after the distribution of Holy Communion is not in accord with liturgical law. (NDRHC, 39; GIRM, 160). "

I wonder what the reasoning or theology behind the prohibition is.

I understand that they should not Communicate themselves. But then the EMHC’s who administer the Chalice do just this as they comsume the remaining Blood of Christ after Holy Communion. Which is why the remaining Blood of Christ should be consumed at the altar by the Priest and Deacon. Which almost never occurs in the parishes I have been in.

 

[kmktexas]

Br. Rich SFO:

I have floated this idea a few times. No parish has ever tried it that I know of.

I understand that they should not Communicate themselves. But then the EMHC’s who administer the Chalice do just this as they comsume the remaining Blood of Christ after Holy Communion. Which is why the remaining Blood of Christ should be consumed at the altar by the Priest and Deacon. Which almost never occurs in the parishes I have been in.

Which idea have you floated? Around here, the EMHCs always receive both the Consecrated Hosts and the Precious Blood directly from the celebrating priest (or the Blood from the deacon, if there is one). This is a diocese that is not known for overly adherent to the GIRM either.

EMHCs are not supposed to be consuming the “left over” blood in the universal GIRM. There is an accomodation approved to allow it in the US but that doesn’t change the rules for the initial distribution.

 

[steenrots]

Hi!

thank you all for your advice!!
Yesterday we spoke about the lector at the altar. We were with different people in a workgroup and my priest was also there. I wasn’t even the one who addressed the topic to him. Another lector asked if it really was ok to be at the altar. He said it was. Of course after your advice I said to my priest it was against the rules to do that.
He simply answered that he didn’t so much care about that rule. He made me a bit ridiculous in front of people who do not know about liturgy. No one has told them that.

So that about ends my role in this. Unfortunately due to problems in my diocese it is not possible to send a letter to the bishop about these things. We have a bishop who is too sick to play an active role. His staff is very liberal. Rome just waits till the old bishop will resign and then they will replace him by a better bishop or cancel the whole diocese. I think the latter is the most likely option.

Please play for my priest and for the situation overhere.

Thank you all!

Peter

 

[Angels_Watchin]

steenrots:

Hi!

thank you all for your advice!!
Yesterday we spoke about the lector at the altar. We were with different people in a workgroup and my priest was also there. I wasn’t even the one who addressed the topic to him. Another lector asked if it really was ok to be at the altar. He said it was. Of course after your advice I said to my priest it was against the rules to do that.
He simply answered that he didn’t so much care about that rule. He made me a bit ridiculous in front of people who do not know about liturgy. No one has told them that.

So that about ends my role in this. Unfortunately due to problems in my diocese it is not possible to send a letter to the bishop about these things. We have a bishop who is too sick to play an active role. His staff is very liberal. Rome just waits till the old bishop will resign and then they will replace him by a better bishop or cancel the whole diocese. I think the latter is the most likely option.

Please play for my priest and for the situation overhere.

Thank you all!

Peter

If they want to make up their own rules - they can go to a protestant church that has no rules.

Get a copy of ;the GIRM (2000-2003)- for your country - from your bishop’s office or another chancery (or cardinal) or online

Write a letter, so that it is on the record. Address it to the priest and the pastor and the Bishop, with the reference to and quotes from the GIRM. Mention the abuse specifically, (day, date, time of mass, presiding priest, etc) (if it is ongoing then mention that)state that you want it reconciled to the churches rules and teachings and you want a written response within 10 days. Then, if you don’t get a response IN WRITING, send a copy of all of the records (with an explanation of the abuse) to the Papal Nuncio of your country (I’m pretty sure every country has one) Get the name and address and or Fax number from your bishop’s office or another chancery in your country. And ask for a written response, give him 21 days. Then, if things aren’t fixed - email all the documents to the pope with an explanation of not fixed, not replied to, or whatever.

benedictxvi@vatican.va

I know it takes time - but no one has done much to get after these abuses for so long, it’s going to take some concerted effort. Hav a few others in your parish do the same thing, start an email list to send out parts of the GIRM each week or month

Get a few others to sign the letter (doctors and professionals and lawyers and politicians are good ones)

I hope you decide to be part of the solution DON"T GIVE UP!!! Our Holy Roman Catholic Faith is WELL worth it!!! YES?

God Bless,
Angel