C
CopticChristian
Guest
The Feds are people and there is no telling what anyone person/Fed will do…it is not an organism and there is always a risk…
- Status
F
Fairwinds
Guest
the Department of Justice will memo the US Attorneys and tell them how and when to prosecute or not prosecute certain crimes. the USAs will also act on their own initiative based on what they think the Secretary wants (these are political appointees).
its also my impression (at least in southern California) that state and city law enforcement tolerates, in varying degrees, medical marijuana, and that the in-your-face sales will draw down prosecution.
J
JamesCaruso
Guest
I am not sure about the morality of usage, especially in moderation, but it is amazing how many bad things are associated with usage, sometimes even in moderate doses. In addition to throwing off the body’s homeostasis, used excessively it may result in a number of other significant consequences. The following is a listing of some of metabolic consequences from a variety of medical journals and other scientific publications for use of this addictive substance:
• high usage can cause epileptic seizures.
• can be intoxicating, similar to alcohol.
• can suppress your immune system and impair your defenses against infectious disease.
• upsets the mineral relationships in your body: causes chromium and copper deficiencies and interferes with absorption of calcium and magnesium.
• can produce a significant rise in total cholesterol, triglycerides and bad cholesterol and a decrease in good cholesterol.
• causes a loss of tissue elasticity and function.
• feeds cancer cells and has been connected with the development of cancer of the breast, ovaries, prostate, rectum, pancreas, biliary tract, lung, gallbladder and stomach.
• can weaken eyesight.
• can cause many problems with the gastrointestinal tract including: an acidic digestive tract, indigestion, malabsorption in patients with functional bowel disease, increased risk of Crohn’s disease, and ulcerative colitis.
• can cause premature aging.
• can lead to alcoholism.
• can cause your saliva to become acidic.
• can cause autoimmune diseases such as: arthritis, asthma, multiple sclerosis.
• greatly assists the uncontrolled growth of Candida Albicans (yeast infections).
• can cause gallstones.
• can cause appendicitis.
• can cause hemorrhoids.
• can cause varicose veins.
• can contribute to osteoporosis.
• can lower your Vitamin E levels.
• can increase your systolic blood pressure.
• Large doses increase advanced glycation end products (AGEs)
• can interfere with your absorption of protein.
• causes food allergies.
• can cause toxemia during pregnancy.
• can cause atherosclerosis and cardiovascular disease.
• can impair the structure of your DNA.
• can change the structure of protein and cause a permanent alteration of the way the proteins act in your body.
• can make your skin age by changing the structure of collagen.
• can cause cataracts and nearsightedness.
• can cause emphysema.
• High dosage can impair the physiological homeostasis of many systems in your body.
• lowers the ability of enzymes to function.
• can increase the size of your liver by making your liver cells divide and it can increase the amount of liver fat.
• can increase kidney size and produce pathological changes in the kidney such as the formation of kidney stones.
• can damage your pancreas.
• can increase your body’s fluid retention.
• enemy of your bowel movement.
• can compromise the lining of your capillaries.
• can make your tendons more brittle.
• can cause headaches, including migraines.
• can reduce the learning capacity
• can cause an increase in delta, alpha, and theta brain waves which can alter your mind’s ability to think clearly.
• can cause depression.
• can increase your risk of gout.
• can increase your risk of Alzheimer’s disease.
• can cause hormonal imbalances such as: increasing estrogen in men, exacerbating PMS, and decreasing growth hormone.
• can lead to dizziness.
• High usage by subjects with peripheral vascular disease significantly increases platelet adhesion.
• High consumption of pregnant adolescents can lead to substantial decrease in gestation duration and is associated with a twofold increased risk for delivering a small-for-gestational-age (SGA) infant.
• given to premature babies can affect the amount of carbon dioxide they produce.
• Decrease in intake can increase emotional stability.
• its rapid absorption promotes excessive food intake in obese subjects.
• can worsen the symptoms of children with attention deficit hyperactivity disorder
• adversely affects urinary electrolyte composition.
• can slow down the ability of your adrenal glands to function.
• has the potential of inducing abnormal metabolic processes in a normal healthy individual and to promote chronic degenerative diseases.
• I.V.s (intravenous feedings) of this substance mixed with water can cut off oxygen to your brain.
• increases your risk of polio.
• causes high blood pressure in obese people
• may induce cell death.
• dehydrates newborns.
The substance referred to is sugar. articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2005/05/04/sugar-dangers-part-two.aspx
• high usage can cause epileptic seizures.
• can be intoxicating, similar to alcohol.
• can suppress your immune system and impair your defenses against infectious disease.
• upsets the mineral relationships in your body: causes chromium and copper deficiencies and interferes with absorption of calcium and magnesium.
• can produce a significant rise in total cholesterol, triglycerides and bad cholesterol and a decrease in good cholesterol.
• causes a loss of tissue elasticity and function.
• feeds cancer cells and has been connected with the development of cancer of the breast, ovaries, prostate, rectum, pancreas, biliary tract, lung, gallbladder and stomach.
• can weaken eyesight.
• can cause many problems with the gastrointestinal tract including: an acidic digestive tract, indigestion, malabsorption in patients with functional bowel disease, increased risk of Crohn’s disease, and ulcerative colitis.
• can cause premature aging.
• can lead to alcoholism.
• can cause your saliva to become acidic.
• can cause autoimmune diseases such as: arthritis, asthma, multiple sclerosis.
• greatly assists the uncontrolled growth of Candida Albicans (yeast infections).
• can cause gallstones.
• can cause appendicitis.
• can cause hemorrhoids.
• can cause varicose veins.
• can contribute to osteoporosis.
• can lower your Vitamin E levels.
• can increase your systolic blood pressure.
• Large doses increase advanced glycation end products (AGEs)
• can interfere with your absorption of protein.
• causes food allergies.
• can cause toxemia during pregnancy.
• can cause atherosclerosis and cardiovascular disease.
• can impair the structure of your DNA.
• can change the structure of protein and cause a permanent alteration of the way the proteins act in your body.
• can make your skin age by changing the structure of collagen.
• can cause cataracts and nearsightedness.
• can cause emphysema.
• High dosage can impair the physiological homeostasis of many systems in your body.
• lowers the ability of enzymes to function.
• can increase the size of your liver by making your liver cells divide and it can increase the amount of liver fat.
• can increase kidney size and produce pathological changes in the kidney such as the formation of kidney stones.
• can damage your pancreas.
• can increase your body’s fluid retention.
• enemy of your bowel movement.
• can compromise the lining of your capillaries.
• can make your tendons more brittle.
• can cause headaches, including migraines.
• can reduce the learning capacity
• can cause an increase in delta, alpha, and theta brain waves which can alter your mind’s ability to think clearly.
• can cause depression.
• can increase your risk of gout.
• can increase your risk of Alzheimer’s disease.
• can cause hormonal imbalances such as: increasing estrogen in men, exacerbating PMS, and decreasing growth hormone.
• can lead to dizziness.
• High usage by subjects with peripheral vascular disease significantly increases platelet adhesion.
• High consumption of pregnant adolescents can lead to substantial decrease in gestation duration and is associated with a twofold increased risk for delivering a small-for-gestational-age (SGA) infant.
• given to premature babies can affect the amount of carbon dioxide they produce.
• Decrease in intake can increase emotional stability.
• its rapid absorption promotes excessive food intake in obese subjects.
• can worsen the symptoms of children with attention deficit hyperactivity disorder
• adversely affects urinary electrolyte composition.
• can slow down the ability of your adrenal glands to function.
• has the potential of inducing abnormal metabolic processes in a normal healthy individual and to promote chronic degenerative diseases.
• I.V.s (intravenous feedings) of this substance mixed with water can cut off oxygen to your brain.
• increases your risk of polio.
• causes high blood pressure in obese people
• may induce cell death.
• dehydrates newborns.
The substance referred to is sugar. articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2005/05/04/sugar-dangers-part-two.aspx
C
CopticChristian
Guest
L
LaSainte
Guest
I don’t think that is necessarily true at all. The Federal government refusing to acknowledge the states’ rulings on this is a huge overstep of their authority. Anybody smoking marijuana in Colorado is simply following the local laws and regulations put in place by their local government. If Kim Jong Un declares himself suddenly head of the universe and says that all people must eat an orange at every meal, am I bound to do it? Or can I just say to myself “That’s ridiculous” and proceed to follow my local laws? It’s not immoral to eat an orange at every meal, so by your rationale, then yes I am.
L
LaSainte
Guest
And yet eating sugar is not immoral…who would have thought?
L
LaSainte
Guest
You honestly find this to be a credible source on the matter? Can I start citing NORML references now too? Talk about bias…
C
CopticChristian
Guest
First point. You must think. To not think that you are obeying a State Law and disoberying a Federal Law puts you in the same hemisphere as Kim Jong Un.
Unless Kim Jong Un works for the DEA and the DEA then classifies oranges as a controlled substance then this thought has nothing to do with anything. Have you been puffing prior to posting?
C
CopticChristian
Guest
C
CopticChristian
Guest
Well then, that depends on whether or not you need someone to have a law that declares something to be illegal to be immoral…
I believe that it is immoral the way the food industry propagagates Unhealthy Food down everyone’s throat…
I doubt many know how much Protein they need in a day
I doubt many know how much Carbohydrate they need in a day
I doubt many know why some fat is needed in the diet and why fat is necessary and how difficult it is to eliminate fat from the diet and that is why you don’t need to add fat to your diet…
I believe it is immoral that people are obese when they should be healthy…
and not one State or Federal law against French Fries…or Cinnabun…
A
andrewstx
Guest
I don’t have a dog in this hunt. Years ago before I grew up I smoked some marijuana and never saw the point. You can get the same effect for free just by staying awake for a long time.
And then I got COPD and can’t smoke anything. It all stinks pot, or tobacco anyway.
And then I got COPD and can’t smoke anything. It all stinks pot, or tobacco anyway.
T
Trigonometric
Guest
Alchohol doesn’t seem to be included in the drug category. Marijuana, however, contains some pretty nasty stuff, and seems to be not just more intoxicating, but more toxic, than tobacco- and the secondhand smoke effects appear worse as well.
pubs.acs.org/doi/full/10.1021/tx700275p
From the American Chemical Society journal Chemical Research in Toxicology (note that mainstream refers to the smoke the smoker inhales, not to the common use of the word.)
It’s misleading to say that he is “following” the local laws, as local law (actually state) in colorado does not mandate smoking marijuana, but merely allows it. However, smoking it would still be a violation of federal law. By not smoking, a person violates neither.
L
LaSainte
Guest
Firstly, marijuana is NOT, nor has it ever been, an intoxicant. Alcohol is an intoxicant because it is, in fact, a TOXIC substance which kills brain cells. Marijuana is not a toxic substance and is not an intoxicant as a result.
Also, the morality of something is not based on the health effects of smoking, as we know from cigarettes. But let us put that aside and remember that marijuana can be vaporized, and all of these little health objections disappear.
Bottom line: marijuana is much healthier than alcohol, period.
Coptic, I’m not sure what you are getting at when you compare me to Kim Jong Un. But ok.
As far as Federal Law goes, this is what our President has to say:
"Will the Fed legalize marijuana?
In December 2012, President Obama said in an interview with Barbara Walters that recreational users of marijuana should not be a “top priority” of federal law enforcement agents in states that have legalized.
“We’ve got bigger fish to fry,” Obama said of pot users in Colorado and Washington during an interview with ABC News’ Barbara Walters.
That stance is really nothing new, notes Tvert.
However, Obama also said that Congress needs to have a conversation about reconciling state and federal marijuana laws, which is important.
And there are bills in Congress that address that reconciliation.
One bill, says Tvert, would regulate marijuana like alcohol at the federal level, taking marijuana out of the jurisdiction of the DEA and giving it to the ATF.
Another proposal would immunize people, who are following state and local law, from federal prosecution.
And then there’s a proposal to establish a federal marijuana commission, which would address the conflict between federal and state marijuana laws.
There are various ideas about how things are going to move forward, and we don’t really know where things stand quite yet, says Tvert."
As you can see, the Feds are waiting to see what happens with legalized marijuana before taking a hard line on it. Local governments are free to enact laws that permit marijuana and the national government is going to sit by and see how it goes. 19 states already have legalized medical marijuana and 2 have legalized recreational marijuana. The Feds are not enforcing the ban because they want to see what will happen with legalized marijuana. There are laws all over the country that people rightfully ignore because they are outdated and ineffective. Is that immoral?
Here is a Federal law that prohibits the sending of dentures through the mail:
Whoever transports by mail or otherwise to or within the District of Columbia or any Possession of the United States or uses the mails or any instrumentality of interstate commerce for the purpose of sending or bringing into any State or Territory any set of artificial teeth or prosthetic dental appliance or other denture, constructed from any cast or impression made by any person other than, or without the authorization or prescription of, a person licensed to practice dentistry under the laws of the place into which such denture is sent or brought, where such laws prohibit;
(1) the taking of impressions or casts of the human mouth or teeth by a person not licensed under such laws to practice dentistry;
(2) the construction or supply of dentures by a person other than, or without the authorization or prescription of, a person licensed under such laws to practice dentistry; or
(3) the construction or supply of dentures from impressions or casts made by a person not licensed under such laws to practice dentistry—
Shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than one year, or both.
If grandpa forgets his dentures at home when he goes on a trip, it is illegal for grandma to send them in the mail. But this is a Federal law, not a state law. So if I wanted to mail a pair of dentures to another state, I would not be breaking state law but I WOULD be breaking federal law. I guess grandpa should have thought of that before forgetting his teeth.
And just for fun:
Eating THC regrows brain cells and shrinks brain tumors in mice and humans.
m.youtube.com/#/watch?v=-LPxBK9cxcM&desktop_uri=%2Fwatch%3Fv%3D-LPxBK9cxcM
THC may prevent Alzheimer’s-
nbcnews.com/id/15145917/ns/health-alzheimers_disease/t/marijuana-may-help-stave-alzheimers/
Also, it slows or stops the growth of breast cancer, colo-rectal cancer, lung cancer, etc. -
nbcnews.com/id/15145917/ns/health-alzheimers_disease/t/marijuana-may-help-stave-alzheimers/
Prevents diabetes-
m.wcvb.com/news/new-study-suggests-marijuana-prevents-diabetes/-/17428308/20364894/-/11mue1s/-/index.html
Prevents brain damage-
articles.latimes.com/2013/may/31/science/la-sci-medical-marijuana-brain-damage-20130530
Helps control epilepsy-
news.vcu.edu/news/Marijuana_and_its_receptor_protein_in_brain_control_epilepsy
Treats depression in low doses-
sciencedaily.com/releases/2007/10/071023183937.htm
AND it comes straight out of the ground, with no pharmaceutical companies to pay or dangerous, addictive, side-effect laden drugs to take. It is basically free, so anyone without insurance can afford it. Catholics should LOVE marijuana. It levels the playing field for a huge number of people all over the world who cannot afford insurance or expensive prescriptions.
Face it people, you’ve bought into the propaganda. Marijuana as a relaxant is safer and healthier than alcohol, especially when vaporized. And as a medical treatment, we are just scratching the surface.
Even the Federal government is slowly giving up on national prohibition.
Also, the morality of something is not based on the health effects of smoking, as we know from cigarettes. But let us put that aside and remember that marijuana can be vaporized, and all of these little health objections disappear.
Bottom line: marijuana is much healthier than alcohol, period.
Coptic, I’m not sure what you are getting at when you compare me to Kim Jong Un. But ok.
As far as Federal Law goes, this is what our President has to say:
"Will the Fed legalize marijuana?
In December 2012, President Obama said in an interview with Barbara Walters that recreational users of marijuana should not be a “top priority” of federal law enforcement agents in states that have legalized.
“We’ve got bigger fish to fry,” Obama said of pot users in Colorado and Washington during an interview with ABC News’ Barbara Walters.
That stance is really nothing new, notes Tvert.
However, Obama also said that Congress needs to have a conversation about reconciling state and federal marijuana laws, which is important.
And there are bills in Congress that address that reconciliation.
One bill, says Tvert, would regulate marijuana like alcohol at the federal level, taking marijuana out of the jurisdiction of the DEA and giving it to the ATF.
Another proposal would immunize people, who are following state and local law, from federal prosecution.
And then there’s a proposal to establish a federal marijuana commission, which would address the conflict between federal and state marijuana laws.
There are various ideas about how things are going to move forward, and we don’t really know where things stand quite yet, says Tvert."
As you can see, the Feds are waiting to see what happens with legalized marijuana before taking a hard line on it. Local governments are free to enact laws that permit marijuana and the national government is going to sit by and see how it goes. 19 states already have legalized medical marijuana and 2 have legalized recreational marijuana. The Feds are not enforcing the ban because they want to see what will happen with legalized marijuana. There are laws all over the country that people rightfully ignore because they are outdated and ineffective. Is that immoral?
Here is a Federal law that prohibits the sending of dentures through the mail:
Whoever transports by mail or otherwise to or within the District of Columbia or any Possession of the United States or uses the mails or any instrumentality of interstate commerce for the purpose of sending or bringing into any State or Territory any set of artificial teeth or prosthetic dental appliance or other denture, constructed from any cast or impression made by any person other than, or without the authorization or prescription of, a person licensed to practice dentistry under the laws of the place into which such denture is sent or brought, where such laws prohibit;
(1) the taking of impressions or casts of the human mouth or teeth by a person not licensed under such laws to practice dentistry;
(2) the construction or supply of dentures by a person other than, or without the authorization or prescription of, a person licensed under such laws to practice dentistry; or
(3) the construction or supply of dentures from impressions or casts made by a person not licensed under such laws to practice dentistry—
Shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than one year, or both.
If grandpa forgets his dentures at home when he goes on a trip, it is illegal for grandma to send them in the mail. But this is a Federal law, not a state law. So if I wanted to mail a pair of dentures to another state, I would not be breaking state law but I WOULD be breaking federal law. I guess grandpa should have thought of that before forgetting his teeth.
And just for fun:
Eating THC regrows brain cells and shrinks brain tumors in mice and humans.
m.youtube.com/#/watch?v=-LPxBK9cxcM&desktop_uri=%2Fwatch%3Fv%3D-LPxBK9cxcM
THC may prevent Alzheimer’s-
nbcnews.com/id/15145917/ns/health-alzheimers_disease/t/marijuana-may-help-stave-alzheimers/
Also, it slows or stops the growth of breast cancer, colo-rectal cancer, lung cancer, etc. -
nbcnews.com/id/15145917/ns/health-alzheimers_disease/t/marijuana-may-help-stave-alzheimers/
Prevents diabetes-
m.wcvb.com/news/new-study-suggests-marijuana-prevents-diabetes/-/17428308/20364894/-/11mue1s/-/index.html
Prevents brain damage-
articles.latimes.com/2013/may/31/science/la-sci-medical-marijuana-brain-damage-20130530
Helps control epilepsy-
news.vcu.edu/news/Marijuana_and_its_receptor_protein_in_brain_control_epilepsy
Treats depression in low doses-
sciencedaily.com/releases/2007/10/071023183937.htm
AND it comes straight out of the ground, with no pharmaceutical companies to pay or dangerous, addictive, side-effect laden drugs to take. It is basically free, so anyone without insurance can afford it. Catholics should LOVE marijuana. It levels the playing field for a huge number of people all over the world who cannot afford insurance or expensive prescriptions.
Face it people, you’ve bought into the propaganda. Marijuana as a relaxant is safer and healthier than alcohol, especially when vaporized. And as a medical treatment, we are just scratching the surface.
Even the Federal government is slowly giving up on national prohibition.
F
Fairwinds
Guest
marijuana is a Schedule I drug per the* Controlled Substances Ac*t, meaning the drug or other substance has a high potential for abuse, has no currently accepted medical use in treatment in the United States and there is a lack of accepted safety for use of the drug or other substance under medical supervision.
whether this is true factually is trumped by the fact that the government (the Drug Enforcement Administration and the Food and Drug Administration, but de-scheduling marijuana would require for all practical purposes, congressional approval) decides it belongs there. the administration can tell the US Attorneys to not prosecute minor drug offenses involving marijuana, or the government, at some future time, take it off the list.
whether this is true factually is trumped by the fact that the government (the Drug Enforcement Administration and the Food and Drug Administration, but de-scheduling marijuana would require for all practical purposes, congressional approval) decides it belongs there. the administration can tell the US Attorneys to not prosecute minor drug offenses involving marijuana, or the government, at some future time, take it off the list.
B
Brendan_64
Guest
How many people smoke cigarettes for the taste of it?
F
Fairwinds
Guest
I do, even more so with seegars.
L
LaSainte
Guest
Exactly right. The real question is “What makes alcohol and cigarettes permissible, but not marijuana in a scenario where all are legal?”, and “Are we required to obey the Federal ban when it is not enforced and local governments have legalized it and made provisio a for the people to procure it?”
As to question 1, it is clearly permissible to use a substance that may physically harm you in moderation, such as alcohol, cigarettes, sugar, fat, caffeine, etc. the fact that something may be somewhat harmful physically does not make it immoral.
It is also clearly permissible to use these things for the purpose of pure effect. People smoke cigarettes for the effect, drink coffee for the effect, drink alcohol for the effect. It is not sinful to drink coffee for a “pick-me-up” even though you hate the taste. The fact that one uses a substance for effect only does not make it immoral.
It is also permissible to experience mild to moderate effects from these things up to the point where reason a d free will is compromised as with alcohol. It is only gravely sinful if I lose my capacity for determining right from wrong, if I pass out or become unable to function, etc. the fact that one experiences an altered state of body or mind does not make the use of a substance immoral.
catholicculture.org/culture/library/dictionary/index.cfm?id=33231
And it IS possible to use marijuana in moderation. One or two “hits” does not make one lose his sense of reason, lose the ability to function, unable to tell the difference between right and wrong, etc.
It is also permissible to use an addictive substance in moderation (alcohol, caffeine, nicotine, etc.). And it is a fact that nicotine is as addictive or more than heroin. Marijuana doesn’t even come close to this. The fact that a substance may be addictive does not make its use immoral.
So the question is, what separates marijuana from alcohol, caffeine, nicotine, sugar, etc. from a morally theological standpoint? This is not a question of OPINION, but one where specific principles of moral theology should be applied.
And the last question is, are we obligated to obey a law that the federal government has specifically and strategically decided NOT to enforce (and been vocal a out this choice) when local and state governments have made it legal and made provisions for the people to be able to procure and indulge in it?
F
Fairwinds
Guest
we’re obligated to obey federal drug laws. and don’t be overly optimistic about the feds not enforcing these laws, they might exercise prosecutorial discretion in some cases, but not all:
C
CopticChristian
Guest
We are required to obey Federal Law and as Catholics be models of virtue. To not do so causes Scandal and that creates problems for those believing that the Church has the Truth.
Alchohol and cigarettes are legal. Marijuana is illegal based on Federal Statute.
They are not illegal.
They are all legal with the exception of Marijuana by Federal Statute.
The answer is legal vs illegal.
Avoid Scandal and obey the law.
R
Robert_Sock
Guest
Just wondering why you place federal law above state laws. What you’re saying about marijuana being illegal is only half true in 21 states.
Just like it’s a matter of time before gay marriage become legal across the US, so too it’s just a matter of time before pot become legal. Like it or not, that’s what’s on the agenda. All you have got to do is to look at the social pendulum and see the direction it’s swinging.
- Status