Lent fasts -- 2 small meals + 1 reg one?

[whatevergirl]

What might constitute a small meal (we need to have 2 smaller meals and 1 regular one) during Lent? I have done this in the past–but would like some different ideas?

Also…what makes up a regular meal? Is this something that is obligatory, and thus if we do not follow it, we are in sin? Is this a daily requirement? In the past, my dh and I will eat 2 smaller meals and one regular one on most days, but not every day…is it required of us every day?

Your thoughts are appreciated…Thank you.

 

[laudamus_te]

What might constitute a small meal (we need to have 2 smaller meals and 1 regular one) during Lent? I have done this in the past–but would like some different ideas?

Also…what makes up a regular meal? Is this something that is obligatory, and thus if we do not follow it, we are in sin? Is this a daily requirement? In the past, my dh and I will eat 2 smaller meals and one regular one on most days, but not every day…is it required of us every day?

Your thoughts are appreciated…Thank you.

The two small meals of a fast day should not, combined, equal one regular meal. As to what makes up a regular meal, it depends on the person and what they would normally eat, I suppose. Also, only the regular meal of the day may contain meat (except on days of abstinence, obviously). For instance, I might have a couple of slices of toast in the morning, eat a normal meal for lunch, and then a salad or vegetable soup for dinner. It is not a requirement to follow the Lenten fast (every day during Lent) nowadays, but it is certainly encouraged if one attends the TLM and follows the traditions of the Church.

 

[pnewton]

Sometimes my “small meal” might be a pack of crackers or a Ramen noodle pack. Sometimes I do not eat any small meal and just eat the one regular meal. A lot depends on my schedule, as I work nights sometimes, days sometimes. It is only require to follow this on Ash Wednesday and Good Friday.

 

[michaeldaniels]

The Holy Season of Lent

Fast and Abstinence.

It is a traditional doctrine of Christian spirituality that a constituent part of repentance, of turning away from sin and back to God, includes some form of penance, without which the Christian is unlikely to remain on the narrow path and be saved (Jer. 18:11, 25:5; Ez. 18:30, 33:11-15; Joel 2:12; Mt. 3:2; Mt. 4:17; Acts 2:38). Christ Himself said that His disciples would fast once He had departed (Lk. 5:35). The general law of penance, therefore, is part of the law of God for man.
The Church has specified certain forms of penance, both to ensure that the Catholic will do something, as required by divine law, while making it easy for Catholics to fulfill the obligation. Thus, the 1983 Code of Canon Law specifies the obligations of Latin Rite Catholics [Eastern Rite Catholics have their own penitential practices as specified by the Code of Canons for the Eastern Churches].

Canon 1250 All Fridays through the year and the time of Lent are penitential days and times throughout the entire Church.

Canon 1251 Abstinence from eating meat or another food according to the prescriptions of the conference of bishops is to be observed on Fridays throughout the year unless they are solemnities; abstinence and fast are to be observed on Ash Wednesday and on the Friday of the Passion and Death of Our Lord Jesus Christ.

Canon 1252 All persons who have completed their fourteenth year are bound by the law of abstinence; all adults are bound by the law of fast up to the beginning of their sixtieth year. Nevertheless, pastors and parents are to see to it that minors who are not bound by the law of fast and abstinence are educated in an authentic sense of penance.

Can. 1253 It is for the conference of bishops to determine more precisely the observance of fast and abstinence and to substitute in whole or in part for fast and abstinence other forms of penance, especially works of charity and exercises of piety.

The Church, therefore, has two forms of official penitential practices - three if the Eucharistic fast before Communion is included.

Abstinence The law of abstinence requires a Catholic 14 years of age until death to abstain from eating meat on Fridays in honor of the Passion of Jesus on Good Friday. Meat is considered to be the flesh and organs of mammals and fowl. Moral theologians have traditionally considered this also to forbid soups or gravies made from them. Salt and freshwater species of fish, amphibians, reptiles and shellfish are permitted, as are animal derived products such as margarine and gelatin which do not have any meat taste.

On the Fridays outside of Lent the U.S. bishops conference obtained the permission of the Holy See for Catholics in the US to substitute a penitential, or even a charitable, practice of their own choosing. Since this was not stated as binding under pain of sin, not to do so on a single occasion would not in itself be sinful. However, since penance is a divine command, the general refusal to do penance is certainly gravely sinful. For most people the easiest way to consistently fulfill this command is the traditional one, to abstain from meat on all Fridays of the year which are not liturgical solemnities. When solemnities, such as the Annunciation, Assumption, All Saints etc. fall on a Friday, we neither abstain or fast.

During Lent abstinence from meat on Fridays is obligatory in the United States as elsewhere, and it is sinful not to observe this discipline without a serious reason (physical labor, pregnancy, sickness etc.).

Fasting The law of fasting requires a Catholic from the 18th Birthday [Canon 97] to the 59th Birthday * to reduce the amount of food eaten from normal. The Church defines this as one meal a day, and two smaller meals which if added together would not exceed the main meal in quantity. Such fasting is obligatory on Ash Wednesday and Good Friday. The fast is broken by eating between meals and by drinks which could be considered food (milk shakes, but not milk). Alcoholic beverages do not break the fast; however, they seem contrary to the spirit of doing penance.

Those who are excused from fast or abstinence Besides those outside the age limits, those of unsound mind, the sick, the frail, pregnant or nursing women according to need for meat or nourishment, manual laborers according to need, guests at a meal who cannot excuse themselves without giving great offense or causing enmity and other situations of moral or physical impossibility to observe the penitential discipline.

Aside from these minimum penitential requirements Catholics are encouraged to impose some personal penance on themselves at other times. It could be modeled after abstinence and fasting. A person could, for example, multiply the number of days they abstain. Some people give up meat entirely for religious motives (as opposed to those who give it up for health or other motives). Some religious orders, as a penance, never eat meat. Similarly, one could multiply the number of days that one fasted. The early Church had a practice of a Wednesday and Saturday fast. This fast could be the same as the Church’s law (one main meal and two smaller ones) or stricter, even bread and water. Such freely chosen fasting could also consist in giving up something one enjoys - candy, soft drinks, smoking, that cocktail before supper, and so on. This is left to the individual.

One final consideration. Before all else we are obliged to perform the duties of our state in life. When considering stricter practices than the norm, it is prudent to discuss the matter with one’s confessor or director. Any deprivation that would seriously hinder us in carrying out our work, as students, employees or parents would be contrary to the will of God.

---- Colin B. Donovan, STL*

 

[fix]

What about this?:

From the apostolic constitution Paenitemini by Pope Paul VI:III. 1. The law of abstinence forbids the use of meat, but not of eggs, the products of milk or condiments made of animal fat.
2. The law of fasting allows only one full meal a day, but does not prohibit taking some food in the morning and evening, observing—as far as quantity and quality are concerned—approved local custom.

You often hear the law of fast summarized this way: “You can have one full meal plus two smaller meals as long as they do not add up to a second meal.” THIS IS FALSE. The law (from Paenitemini, quoted above) doesn’t say anything about what the two smaller portions of food add up to. What the law says that you can have “some food” twice, and “some food” is clearly less than a “full meal,” but it doesn’t say anything about how much the two instances of “some food” add up to…

Ash Wednesday

  [(Jimmy Akin)](http://jimmyakin.typepad.com/defensor_fidei/2007/02/ash_wednesday.html)

 

[laudamus_te]

What about this?:

…You often hear the law of fast summarized this way: “You can have one full meal plus two smaller meals as long as they do not add up to a second meal.” THIS IS FALSE.

It is not false if one is following the older tradition of fasting. My traditionalist priest summarized it that way. I don’t really know what the argument with this summary is, unless it is simply a desire to be disagreeable because it is put forth by traditionalists. It makes it so much more clear how one should observe a fast than “some food twice a day.”

 

[fix]

It is not false if one is following the older tradition of fasting.

My traditionalist priest summarized it that way. I don’t really know what the argument with this summary is, unless it is simply a desire to be disagreeable because it is put forth by traditionalists. It makes it so much more clear how one should observe a fast than “some food twice a day.”

I think he was simply trying to be accurate.

 

[laudamus_te]

I think he was simply trying to be accurate.

I don’t understand. How is it accurate to say “summarizing the fast as one normal meal + 2 small meals that don’t equal 1 full meal” is FALSE?

 

[fix]

I don’t understand. How is it accurate to say “summarizing the fast as one normal meal + 2 small meals that don’t equal 1 full meal” is FALSE?

Well, here is the rest of his reasoning:

Obviously, the less the “some food” amounts to, the more in keeping with the spirit of fast it is, but the law does not require or encourage people to scruple over how much “two smaller meals” add up to. That’s dumb, anyway, since people do not generally eat three, equally large meals (in terms of calories or volume), making it impractical to try adding up the two lesser quantities of food.

A more helpful way of thinking of it (and a way more in keeping with the way the law is written) is to think of one full meal and two snacks, a snack being something less than a meal.

 

[laudamus_te]

Well, here is the rest of his reasoning:

It would have been best to include that in the original quote, then. That still doesn’t make the other reasoning FALSE. It is just another way of looking at the same thing. Some may find it easier to think in terms of “two snacks” and some (like myself) find it easier to think in terms of “two meals that don’t equal 1 full meal.” It is also more adaptable to different people, as not everyone has the same idea as to what a “full meal” is. Different people have different caloric requirements.

 

[jmcrae]

What might constitute a small meal (we need to have 2 smaller meals and 1 regular one) during Lent? I have done this in the past–but would like some different ideas?

That’s more than I eat on a normal day. Are you sure that’s the fasting requirement? I normally only have two meals a day - one small one, and one large one.

I am thinking that on Ash Wednesday I will have either one small meal or two small meals.

 

[fix]

It would have been best to include that in the original quote, then. That still doesn’t make the other reasoning FALSE. It is just another way of looking at the same thing. Some may find it easier to think in terms of “two snacks” and some (like myself) find it easier to think in terms of “two meals that don’t equal 1 full meal.” It is also more adaptable to different people, as not everyone has the same idea as to what a “full meal” is. Different people have different caloric requirements.

I gave the link in the first post for all to read and comment on if they chose.

If I am reading him right he is being exact and I do not think his interpretation is saying that two smaller meals cannot add up to the one larger meal, that is why he said it is false.

He is saying the rule does not say that explicitly. It does not quantify exactly as the common saying claims it does.

Now whether he is correct is another argument.

 

[whatevergirl]

That’s more than I eat on a normal day. Are you sure that’s the fasting requirement? I normally only have two meals a day - one small one, and one large one.

I am thinking that on Ash Wednesday I will have either one small meal or two small meals.

I think so–this is what was highlighted in our bulletin. I learned something from this thread–or at least the cobwebs of confusion have been wiped away! So…the ‘obligation’ to fast for people between 18 and 59–are only for Ash Wed and Good Friday? Or all Fridays? I plan on fasting more than this, but at first, when I posted this–I thought the obligation was for the entire Lent season.

 

[jmcrae]

I think so–this is what was highlighted in our bulletin. I learned something from this thread–or at least the cobwebs of confusion have been wiped away! So…the ‘obligation’ to fast for people between 18 and 59–are only for Ash Wed and Good Friday?

The obligation to fast and to abstain from meat applies to Ash Wednesday and Good Friday, at minimum.

Or all Fridays?

We are supposed to abstain from meat on all Fridays of the year. Outside of Lent only, we can choose to observe a different penance on Fridays, instead of abstinence from meat.

I plan on fasting more than this, but at first, when I posted this–I thought the obligation was for the entire Lent season.

No. At one time there were “ember days” which had the fasting and abstinence requirements as well, but those are no longer observed.

 

[KathleenElsie]

The Holy Season of Lent

Fast and Abstinence.

It is a traditional doctrine of Christian spirituality that a constituent part of repentance, of turning away from sin and back to God, includes some form of penance, without which the Christian is unlikely to remain on the narrow path and be saved (Jer. 18:11, 25:5; Ez. 18:30, 33:11-15; Joel 2:12; Mt. 3:2; Mt. 4:17; Acts 2:38). Christ Himself said that His disciples would fast once He had departed (Lk. 5:35). The general law of penance, therefore, is part of the law of God for man.
The Church has specified certain forms of penance, both to ensure that the Catholic will do something, as required by divine law, while making it easy for Catholics to fulfill the obligation. Thus, the 1983 Code of Canon Law specifies the obligations of Latin Rite Catholics [Eastern Rite Catholics have their own penitential practices as specified by the Code of Canons for the Eastern Churches].

Canon 1250 All Fridays through the year and the time of Lent are penitential days and times throughout the entire Church. We do this every Friday.

Canon 1251 Abstinence from eating meat or another food according to the prescriptions of the conference of bishops is to be observed on Fridays throughout the year unless they are solemnities; abstinence and fast are to be observed on Ash Wednesday and on the Friday of the Passion and Death of Our Lord Jesus Christ. This is also followed b y our family.

Canon 1252 All persons who have completed their fourteenth year are bound by the law of abstinence; all adults are bound by the law of fast up to the beginning of their sixtieth year. Nevertheless, pastors and parents are to see to it that minors who are not bound by the law of fast and abstinence are educated in an authentic sense of penance. As we all eat together young and elder we ALL follow the law of abstinence. Fasting depends on the physical condition and needs of the individual.

Can. 1253 It is for the conference of bishops to determine more precisely the observance of fast and abstinence and to substitute in whole or in part for fast and abstinence other forms of penance, especially works of charity and exercises of piety.

We follow the old rule of fasting and abstinence in our home.

 

[KathleenElsie]

The Church, therefore, has two forms of official penitential practices - three if the Eucharistic fast before Communion is included.

Abstinence The law of abstinence requires a Catholic 14 years of age until death to abstain from eating meat on Fridays in honor of the Passion of Jesus on Good Friday. Meat is considered to be the flesh and organs of mammals and fowl. Moral theologians have traditionally considered this also to forbid soups or gravies made from them. Salt and freshwater species of fish, amphibians, reptiles and shellfish are permitted, as are animal derived products such as margarine and gelatin which do not have any meat taste.

On the Fridays outside of Lent the U.S. bishops conference obtained the permission of the Holy See for Catholics in the US to substitute a penitential, or even a charitable, practice of their own choosing. Since this was not stated as binding under pain of sin, not to do so on a single occasion would not in itself be sinful. However, since penance is a divine command, the general refusal to do penance is certainly gravely sinful. For most people the easiest way to consistently fulfill this command is the traditional one, to abstain from meat on all Fridays of the year which are not liturgical solemnities. We do this as well as doing a “good” deed for another. It is a good way to teach the children moral responsibility. When solemnities, such as the Annunciation, Assumption, All Saints etc. fall on a Friday, we neither abstain or fast.

During Lent abstinence from meat on Fridays is obligatory in the United States as elsewhere, and it is sinful not to observe this discipline without a serious reason (physical labor, pregnancy, sickness etc.).

Fasting The law of fasting requires a Catholic from the 18th Birthday [Canon 97] to the 59th Birthday This is the newer rule. The old rule did not give ages but made exceptions for physical reasons.* to reduce the amount of food eaten from normal. The Church defines this as one meal a day, and two smaller meals which if added together would not exceed the main meal in quantity. But can be less if your physical condition allows. *Such fasting is obligatory on Ash Wednesday and Good Friday. The fast is broken by eating between meals and by drinks which could be considered food (milk shakes, but not milk). Alcoholic beverages do not break the fast; however, they seem contrary to the spirit of doing penance.

Those who are excused from fast or abstinence Besides those outside the age limits, those of unsound mind, the sick, the frail, pregnant or nursing women according to need for meat or nourishment, manual laborers according to need, guests at a meal who cannot excuse themselves without giving great offense or causing enmity and other situations of moral or physical impossibility to observe the penitential discipline.

Aside from these minimum penitential requirements Catholics are encouraged to impose some personal penance on themselves at other times. It could be modeled after abstinence and fasting. A person could, for example, multiply the number of days they abstain. Some people give up meat entirely for religious motives (as opposed to those who give it up for health or other motives). Some religious orders, as a penance, never eat meat. Similarly, one could multiply the number of days that one fasted. The early Church had a practice of a Wednesday and Saturday fast. This fast could be the same as the Church’s law (one main meal and two smaller ones) or stricter, even bread and water. Such freely chosen fasting could also consist in giving up something one enjoys - candy, soft drinks, smoking, that cocktail before supper, and so on. This is left to the individual.

One final consideration. Before all else we are obliged to perform the duties of our state in life. When considering stricter practices than the norm, it is prudent to discuss the matter with one’s confessor or director. Any deprivation that would seriously hinder us in carrying out our work, as students, employees or parents would be contrary to the will of God.

---- Colin B. Donovan, STL

We have a wonderful OLD OLD cookbook that gives the menus for every day of the year. Makes it easier to follow the old fast and abstinence rules.

 

[Conservative]

What might constitute a small meal (we need to have 2 smaller meals and 1 regular one) during Lent? I have done this in the past–but would like some different ideas?

Also…what makes up a regular meal? Is this something that is obligatory, and thus if we do not follow it, we are in sin? Is this a daily requirement? In the past, my dh and I will eat 2 smaller meals and one regular one on most days, but not every day…is it required of us every day?
…

If you check pnewton’s post, it will say what I’d planned. I think alot depends on what your normal daily diet is. The fasting rule is based on eliminating eating three full meals - whatever that is for you. Pnewton says one of their regular meals is usually some crackers. Depending on their health and age, they would have to determine what is to be eliminated.

In my case - I don’t eat three full meals normally - Coffee (lots of it) is my breakfast. Lunch (sometimes yes/sometimes not). And dinner - relatively full meal including seconds and as much desert as I want. So, on a fast day, I only have one cup of coffee in the morning, skip lunch - no coffee - and while liquids are permitted (water doesn’t break fast) I try not to have sodas, etc., and I try to wait till evening for my full meal. If coffee is served then - just one cup and one serving on desert - no more. *** (and then I stay up till midnight - to raid the kitchen!) ***IOW - if your day already is minimal intake, you have to determine what you could eliminate, in order to follow fasting rule, but not damage your health. It’s a matter of giving something up. (just think - some of our ancestors really did it - fasting the whole 40 days!) Sorry for getting longwinded.

 

[whatevergirl]

We have a wonderful OLD OLD cookbook that gives the menus for every day of the year. Makes it easier to follow the old fast and abstinence rules.

I think that would be quite helpful to my dh and me.

 

[whatevergirl]

If you check pnewton’s post, it will say what I’d planned. I think alot depends on what your normal daily diet is. The fasting rule is based on eliminating eating three full meals - whatever that is for you. Pnewton says one of their regular meals is usually some crackers. Depending on their health and age, they would have to determine what is to be eliminated.

In my case - I don’t eat three full meals normally - Coffee (lots of it) is my breakfast. Lunch (sometimes yes/sometimes not). And dinner - relatively full meal including seconds and as much desert as I want. So, on a fast day, I only have one cup of coffee in the morning, skip lunch - no coffee - and while liquids are permitted (water doesn’t break fast) I try not to have sodas, etc., and I try to wait till evening for my full meal. If coffee is served then - just one cup and one serving on desert - no more. *** (and then I stay up till midnight - to raid the kitchen!) ***IOW - if your day already is minimal intake, you have to determine what you could eliminate, in order to follow fasting rule, but not damage your health. It’s a matter of giving something up. (just think - some of our ancestors really did it - fasting the whole 40 days!) Sorry for getting longwinded.

Thank you for your post–this has been quite helpful, as well as everyone else’s advice. I eat a small bowl of oatmeal in the mornings, normally…one cup of coffee. I drink about 64 oz of water per day, and work out pretty regularly…so, I don’t want to not eat enough where I’m weak. But, I tend to eat a salad or piece of fish with small salad at lunch, typically. Dinner has gotten smaller, since I don’t believe it should be the biggest meal of the day anyways. Skipping snacks would be where I could (name removed by moderator)ut the fasting requirements…but, I actually have grown into a lifestyle of 6 small ‘meals’ per day…where your metabolism, blood sugar, etc…is never dipping so low from being hungry. They (fitness gurus) that eating between meals is healthier than not…but fasting is for the soul, not for our bodies. If I’m sacrificing food, it is to mirror the sacrifice (even though it pales in comparison) to Christ’s sacrifice to me…so…that being said–I think a few days per week, I’ll do the fast. Thank you to everyone here who helped me with this!

 

[KathleenElsie]

I think that would be quite helpful to my dh and me.

It is called:
MODERN GUIDE to BETTER MEALS
WITH CALENDAR OF DINNERS AND ABSTINTENCE SCHEDULES

The last year used is 1945. But it sure does give good ideas.