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WilT
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The Christians I know are thought of as kind and compassionate. True to the scriptures and of our Holy Catholic Traditions. It really depends on the circle you hang around in DaveB.
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WilT
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EasterJoy
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Are you saying you don’t care what unjust laws are passed or what unwise policies are kept in place in civil society, so long as these aren’t imposed on you personally? This is compassion? This is being “non-judgmental”?
A natural marriage is a real thing and a valuable thing, not an artificial cultural construct. It is based on a real biological complementarity that exists between the sexes, a complementarity that even the most avowed atheist can see is fundamentally different than a union based on the inherently sterile mutual sexual stimulation that exists between homosexuals. Can two homosexuals have real and valuable relationship? Of course they can. So can a brother and a sister; that doesn’t mean their valuable and intimate relationship ought to be extended to sexual intimacy. It doesn’t mean their relationship is the same as a marriage. Natural marriage is based on an archetypical relationship that has kept life going in all animals higher than sponges and flatworms for millions of years.
There is nothing unloving or judgmental in defending the plain truth that a natural marriage has a nature entirely distinct from a homosexual union, even if the marriage is not sacramental. How someone who is not entirely ignorant of human sexuality and even basic biology can fail to see that or acknowledge the importance of that is beyond me. This is what the invention of contraception has done to people’s appreciation of our nature, I guess.
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chero23
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Today the Supreme Court made it unconstitutional for 2 states think it was Indiana and Utah to nt allow gay marriages. This is what we have come to.
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Joe_5859
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It wasn’t the Supreme Court, but lower federal courts. I’m sure the cases will make their way to the Supreme Court before too long.
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EasterJoy
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The Supreme Court “gave” us Roe v. Wade. They are obviously capable of inventing rights that are actually immoral license–or should I say, granting the public the license that is the logical consequence of their shared lack of wisdom.
We are a country that worships the desires of the individual beyond all common sense, and we get both the good and the bad that come from that.
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JTD_Eagle1
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I just heard that a judge overturned the ban in Indiana, I hope it is appealed. This is sad that the government is legalizing it, but the attack on marriage has been going on for decades, and this worsens it. What will be next, polygamy? I know a few people with same sex attraction, but will NOT change my definition of marriage, regardless of what the government says. God ordained marriage as a man and a woman and that is the truth whether people believe it or not. As it was said at last weeks march for marriage, if you keep changing marriage to mean what you want, it ends up meaning nothing at all! I believe that a nation can turn itself around, as we are starting to see with abortion.
massresistance.org/docs/marriage/video_2013/index.html
here is a video what same sex “marriage” has done to Massachussetts.
massresistance.org/docs/marriage/video_2013/index.html
here is a video what same sex “marriage” has done to Massachussetts.
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EasterJoy
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My understanding is that they have put off ruling on this for as long as possible, which I am afraid is going to paint them into a political corner.
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Joe_5859
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Indeed it will. I can understand them wanting to put it off as they will pretty much have the final say. It really shouldn’t be up to them in the first place. But then, it isn’t up to other judges and legislators or even the voters. Marriage is what it is.
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EasterJoy
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In a democracy, the truth is what the political system says that it is. That is not to say that some other system is better, but just that the Constitution is not some divinely-inspired document that protects us from the government and laws we collectively deserve. If those who want license are active and those who recognize morality are passive, then license is going to be the law of the land. That is how our system works, because our system presumes that those who see the truth will care and will raise their voices in the defense of what is right. When that doesn’t happen, we have had some very bad outcomes.
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ohsnapitslennon
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“Unholy” actions, not unholy people. Hate the sin, love the sinner. Legal isn’t always right, no? Look at abortions. (Not to veer this thread off topic, not my intent)
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theCrow
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Brothers and Sisters, here are the facts:
More and more people are changing their views and believe Homosexuality is NOT a sin, and more importantly, are speaking up for wanting to marry the one they love.
Now any Church may continue to have their OPINION that Homosexuality is a sin, but we as a culture are changing and there is no going back. We have friends, family and others close to us coming out as Gay, and more power to them.
Want to Stop Gay marriage, don’t marry a gay person. Otherwise, they should and they WILL have the right to marry anyone they love as well.
So the irony is, love will ALWAYS Win. God is Love. And therefore Gay Marriage will soon be legal in all 50 states.
More and more people are changing their views and believe Homosexuality is NOT a sin, and more importantly, are speaking up for wanting to marry the one they love.
Now any Church may continue to have their OPINION that Homosexuality is a sin, but we as a culture are changing and there is no going back. We have friends, family and others close to us coming out as Gay, and more power to them.
Want to Stop Gay marriage, don’t marry a gay person. Otherwise, they should and they WILL have the right to marry anyone they love as well.
So the irony is, love will ALWAYS Win. God is Love. And therefore Gay Marriage will soon be legal in all 50 states.
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Joe_5859
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It’s not about stopping “gay marriage” or denying anyone their rights or extinguishing love. It’s about upholding the reality of what marriage actually is – which is attested to by every society in human history up until the present.
You are right that the cultural views are shifting. It started with contraception. Once children were separated from the natural process and context that brings them into being, then people started to think of marriage as just the state approval of a loving adult relationship. And if that’s all that marriage is, then there really is no reason to not allow gay marriage. But that’s not what marriage is.
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China123
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Making it legal does not make it moral or make it truth. Roe v Wade made killing legal but it did not make it right or moral.
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theCrow
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This is not about Abortion.
This is about 2 people who love each other wanting to get married. Period.
While you may not think it right or moral, you simply cannot STOP and impose this opinion on others. Sorry.
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Joe_5859
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In this case, it is not the Christians doing the imposing. We are simply acknowledging the way that marriage has been defined since the dawn of human history. It is the ones who seek to redefine this natural institution who are doing the imposing.
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estesbob
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And love never expresses itself thru sin. We simply cannot the throw out the 2,000 years of teachings and traditions because the culture of the early 21st century says everybody before them got it wrong.
Making homosexual marriage legal has no bearing whatsoever on whether homosexual behavior is moral or not. I would like to know exactly what makes our culture the most enlightened in the history of mankind? Why have we suddenly determined that sin is no longer sin and marriage is whatever anyone wants to make out of it? Did God change his mind? Or did God allow people of faith to be in grievous error about sexual morality until we ,the" enlightened" ,came along.
And be aware of so-called rights granted to you by the courts. What the courts can bestow the courts can take away . Rights to not come from man nor the courts. They come from God. And of course he gives us a right to sin but a court of law, for even a majority of voters does not determine what is sin and what is not.
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estesbob
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So is your opinion that the only qualification for getting married is that two people say they are in love with each other?
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EasterJoy
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Now, how is “you may not think it right or moral” totally unrelated to abortion? The point is that society has been totally stripped of any right to have a moral code that some individuals don’t happen to like. The idea of “you can’t impose your opinion on others” means that society has no standing to make social rules. Society is losing its standing to make distinctions that truly exist.
This is not about the majority being forced to leave people alone to live as they will. This is about the majority being forced to abdicate their sense of what they are inclined to recognize as a marriage. They are being forced to accept as marriage something that is unrecognizable as a marriage, to pretend equivalency that does not exist, to reinvent social institutions against their will. What do you suppose this is going to do to society?
If the courts impose this reinvention of marriage, it will have even worse repercussions than if the majority had been conned into a false definition of marriage by free consent. It means that the court defines social institutions, not society. It is not a strike in favor of “fairness,” but a strike in favor of judicial tyranny.
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