Let's Try This Again....Death means sleep

[Bill_Pick]

You keep bringing up things that I have already explained. I wont explain it again unless privately.

Well we have a lot of people posting here and I do not get to see all the answer so will you please just post it again unless you are ashame of your answer

 

[Bill_Pick]

Did you just not get to the 24 instances of Hell in the Bible that I posted? Or do you just not like those verses? Surely not all of them could be “wrong”.

Can you give me a post #are tell me who is this post for

 

[benidict]

According to the Bible and if you disagree please provide scripture. If not, there is no purpose in posting without using God’s Word as proof. PLEASE READ CAREFULLY.

Why do we (people) continue to say you go immediately to Heaven or Hell, when the Bible plainly says a person returns to the dust after he/she has died (sleep/slept)

Job 7:21 And why dost thou not pardon my transgression, and take away mine iniquity? for now shall I sleep in the dust; and thou shalt seek me in the morning, but I shall not be

Psalms 13:3 Consider and hear me, O LORD my God: lighten mine eyes, lest I sleep the sleep of death;

Daniel 12:2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.

1 Corinthians 15:51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,

1 Thessalonians 4:14, 15 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him. For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.

2 Peter 3:4 And saying, Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation.

1 Corinthians 15:18 Then they also which are fallen asleep in Christ are perished.

If you would like to disagree, that’s fine. But please provide atleast 3 unbiased scriptures/opinion to back you answer.

ok so your a seventh day adventist. you can stop hiding behind the Christian title youve been using. just kidding. i know adventist are not the only ones to hold this view. how about when peter was released by the angel from prison, and when he knocked at the door to the house with the believers, they thought it was his ghost/angel? how about the great cloud of witnesses found in hebrews, how about moses meeting with Christ at the transfiguration. how about the the early church fathers like clement, who was a desciple of st. peter, stating that peter and paul had gone to heaven and recieved the reward promised them? there you go. and i threw in clement as a bonus. peace be to you.

 

[benidict]

Can you give a scripture for paradise and purgatory?

as far as paradise, it was known as abrahams bosom. pugatory, is not a Catholic invention. on the contrary. it was a Jewish teaching long before. just read josephus and some of his debates with scholars at the end of his history book. interesting.

 

[Randy_Carson]

Do you agree or disagree. If you disagree, please provide scripture.

Also, my denomination has nothing to do with following the Word of God. Having a title does not save you. But believing on Jesus Christ and keeping His commandments, I shall be saved.

If I tell you my denomination, what does that profit you? Especially if I follow the Law of God.

Knowing the faith tradition that you are a part of will assist us in formulating answers to your questions more precisely.

Is this something you are embarassed about?

 

[Bill_Pick]

as far as paradise, it was known as abrahams bosom. pugatory, is not a Catholic invention. on the contrary. it was a Jewish teaching long before. just read josephus and some of his debates with scholars at the end of his history book. interesting.

When you leave this world you go to purgatory and then Heaven and if you are in sin you go in hell

 

[benidict]

When you leave this world you go to purgatory and then Heaven and if you are in sin you go in hell

right with you bill. in fact, i believe purgatory is a neccesarry step. it helps purify us, and cleanse us of not only sins, but other thing in our lives that we may not be able to let go of. not necessarily things that are evil as such, but the after affects of things we have done that we cannot correct. kind of like dross being sanded off to purify the metal, if that makes any sense. peace be to you.

 

[Rence]

According to the Bible and if you disagree please provide scripture. If not, there is no purpose in posting without using God’s Word as proof. PLEASE READ CAREFULLY.

Why do we (people) continue to say you go immediately to Heaven or Hell, when the Bible plainly says a person returns to the dust after he/she has died (sleep/slept)

If you would like to disagree, that’s fine. But please provide atleast 3 unbiased scriptures/opinion to back you answer.

Here you go:
1 Matthew 5:22
But I say to you, that whosoever is angry with his brother, shall be in danger of the judgment. And whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council. And whosoever shall say, Thou Fool, shall be in danger of hell fire.

2 Matthew 5:29
And if thy right eye scandalize thee, pluck it out and cast it from thee. For it is expedient for thee that one of thy members should perish, rather than that thy whole body be cast into hell.

3 Matthew 5:30
And if thy right hand scandalize thee, cut it off, and cast it from thee: for it is expedient for thee that one of thy members should perish, rather than that thy whole body be cast into hell.

4 Matthew 10:28
And fear ye not them that kill the body, and are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him that can destroy both soul and body in hell.

5 Matthew 11:23
And thou Capharnaum, shalt thou be exalted up to heaven? thou shalt go down even unto hell. For if in Sodom had been wrought the miracles that have been wrought in thee, perhaps it had remained unto this day.

6 Matthew 16:18
And I say to thee: That thou art Peter; and upon this rock I will build my church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

7 Matthew 18:9
And if thy eye scandalize thee, pluck it out, and cast it from thee. It is better for thee having one eye to enter into life, than having two eyes to be cast into hell fire.

8 Matthew 23:15
Woe to you scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites; because you go round about the sea and the land to make one proselyte; and when he is made, you make him the child of hell twofold more than yourselves.

9 Matthew 23:33
You serpents, generation of vipers, how will you flee from the judgment of hell?

10 Mark 9:42
And if thy hand scandalize thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter into life, maimed, than having two hands to go into hell, into unquenchable fire:

11 Mark 9:44
And if thy foot scandalize thee, cut it off. It is better for thee to enter lame into life everlasting, than having two feet, to be cast into the hell of unquenchable fire:

12 Mark 9:46
And if thy eye scandalize thee, pluck it out. It is better for thee with one eye to enter into the kingdom of God, than having two eyes to be cast into the hell of fire:

13 Luke 10:15
And thou, Capharnaum, which art exalted unto heaven, thou shalt be thrust down to hell.

14 Luke 12:5
But I will shew you whom you shall fear: fear ye him, who after he hath killed, hath power to cast into hell. Yea, I say to you, fear him.

15 Luke 16:22
And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham’s bosom. And the rich man also died: and he was buried in hell.

16 Acts Of Apostles 2:24
Whom God hath raised up, having loosed the sorrows of hell, as it was impossible that he should be holden by it.

17 Acts Of Apostles 2:27
Because thou wilt not leave my soul in hell, nor suffer thy Holy One to see corruption.

18 Acts Of Apostles 2:31
Foreseeing this, he spoke of the resurrection of Christ. For neither was he left in hell, neither did his flesh see corruption.

19 James 3:6
And the tongue is a fire, a world of iniquity. The tongue is placed among our members, which defileth the whole body, and inflameth the wheel of our nativity, being set on fire by hell.

20 2 Peter 2:4
For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but delivered them, drawn down by infernal ropes to the lower hell, unto torments, to be reserved unto judgment:

21 Apocalypse 1:18
And alive, and was dead, and behold I am living for ever and ever, and have the keys of death and of hell.

22 Apocalypse 6:8
And behold a pale horse, and he that sat upon him, his name was Death, and hell followed him. And power was given to him over the four parts of the earth, to kill with sword, with famine, and with death, and with the beasts of the earth.

23 Apocalypse 20:13
And the sea gave up the dead that were in it, and death and hell gave up their dead that were in them; and they were judged every one according to their works.

24 Apocalypse 20:14
And hell and death were cast into the pool of fire. This is the second death

 

[Truth_Seeker123]

Here you go:
1 Matthew 5:22
But I say to you, that whosoever is angry with his brother, shall be in danger of the judgment. And whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council. And whosoever shall say, Thou Fool, shall be in danger of hell fire.

2 Matthew 5:29
And if thy right eye scandalize thee, pluck it out and cast it from thee. For it is expedient for thee that one of thy members should perish, rather than that thy whole body be cast into hell.

3 Matthew 5:30
And if thy right hand scandalize thee, cut it off, and cast it from thee: for it is expedient for thee that one of thy members should perish, rather than that thy whole body be cast into hell.

4 Matthew 10:28
And fear ye not them that kill the body, and are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him that can destroy both soul and body in hell.

5 Matthew 11:23
And thou Capharnaum, shalt thou be exalted up to heaven? thou shalt go down even unto hell. For if in Sodom had been wrought the miracles that have been wrought in thee, perhaps it had remained unto this day.

6 Matthew 16:18
And I say to thee: That thou art Peter; and upon this rock I will build my church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

7 Matthew 18:9
And if thy eye scandalize thee, pluck it out, and cast it from thee. It is better for thee having one eye to enter into life, than having two eyes to be cast into hell fire.

8 Matthew 23:15
Woe to you scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites; because you go round about the sea and the land to make one proselyte; and when he is made, you make him the child of hell twofold more than yourselves.

9 Matthew 23:33
You serpents, generation of vipers, how will you flee from the judgment of hell?

10 Mark 9:42
And if thy hand scandalize thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter into life, maimed, than having two hands to go into hell, into unquenchable fire:

11 Mark 9:44
And if thy foot scandalize thee, cut it off. It is better for thee to enter lame into life everlasting, than having two feet, to be cast into the hell of unquenchable fire:

12 Mark 9:46
And if thy eye scandalize thee, pluck it out. It is better for thee with one eye to enter into the kingdom of God, than having two eyes to be cast into the hell of fire:

13 Luke 10:15
And thou, Capharnaum, which art exalted unto heaven, thou shalt be thrust down to hell.

14 Luke 12:5
But I will shew you whom you shall fear: fear ye him, who after he hath killed, hath power to cast into hell. Yea, I say to you, fear him.

15 Luke 16:22
And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham’s bosom. And the rich man also died: and he was buried in hell.

16 Acts Of Apostles 2:24
Whom God hath raised up, having loosed the sorrows of hell, as it was impossible that he should be holden by it.

17 Acts Of Apostles 2:27
Because thou wilt not leave my soul in hell, nor suffer thy Holy One to see corruption.

18 Acts Of Apostles 2:31
Foreseeing this, he spoke of the resurrection of Christ. For neither was he left in hell, neither did his flesh see corruption.

19 James 3:6
And the tongue is a fire, a world of iniquity. The tongue is placed among our members, which defileth the whole body, and inflameth the wheel of our nativity, being set on fire by hell.

20 2 Peter 2:4
For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but delivered them, drawn down by infernal ropes to the lower hell, unto torments, to be reserved unto judgment:

21 Apocalypse 1:18
And alive, and was dead, and behold I am living for ever and ever, and have the keys of death and of hell.

22 Apocalypse 6:8
And behold a pale horse, and he that sat upon him, his name was Death, and hell followed him. And power was given to him over the four parts of the earth, to kill with sword, with famine, and with death, and with the beasts of the earth.

23 Apocalypse 20:13
And the sea gave up the dead that were in it, and death and hell gave up their dead that were in them; and they were judged every one according to their works.

24 Apocalypse 20:14
And hell and death were cast into the pool of fire. This is the second death

Hell means grave.

Jonah 2:2 And said, I cried by reason of mine affliction unto the LORD, and he heard me; out of the belly of hell cried I, and thou heardest my voice.

According to your logic, the belly of the fish that jonah was in, is a place of fire right?

Proverbs 15:24 The way of life is above to the wise, that he may depart from hell beneath.

How can you depart from hell if it is a permanent punishment? Hell, the grave, is where the dead are waiting that they may have life above in Heaven.

 

[Rence]

Hell means grave.

**No, hell does not mean grave. There are two different meanings in Hebrew and in Greek for “hell”. One is the repository for souls waiting before Christ opened the gates of Heaven by is Death and Resurrection (which already happened), and the other is the hellfire and brimstone. **

Jonah 2:2 And said, I cried by reason of mine affliction unto the LORD, and he heard me; out of the belly of hell cried I, and thou heardest my voice.According to your logic, the belly of the fish that jonah was in, is a place of fire right?

**No, that was a belly of a fish. The Douay-Rheims Bible reads like this: 2 And Jonas prayed to the Lord his God out of the belly of the fish.

I’m sure you know that the Douay-Rheims was around way before the KJV, which is why it is among the approved tanslations. The KJV is not an approved translation for Catholics.
**

Proverbs 15:24 The way of life is above to the wise, that he may depart from hell beneath.

Proverbs was written in the old testament. Jews went to the underworld because their Messiah hadn’t come yet to release them. When Christ (Our Saviour) died, he descended to the dead to release the souls so they could join him in Heaven. This was part of God’s triumph over Evil. Christ changed that in his Death and Resurrection.

How can you depart from hell if it is a permanent punishment? Hell, the grave, is where the dead are waiting that they may have life above in Heaven.

**In Hebrew, there are two words for Hell, just as in English, words have different meanings. Hell can refer to the receiving place of the dead, or it can mean the hellfire and brimstone hell. You are taking the verses out of context again. This is part of the reason why:

2 Peter 1:20
Understanding this first, that no prophecy of scripture is made by private interpretation.**

That is why the Catholic Church provides this interpretation. Because the ones who translated the Bible were fluent in Hebrew, Greek, Latin and English, so that their meanings were not lost.

This is why people ask you by what authority you interpret the scriptures. You wanna know where Catholic interpretation comes from?

The Apostles received direct instructions from Christ Himself, who instructed them to preach everything he taught. No other church can claim that. Continuing, the Apostles spread His teachings, as promised by the help and protection of the Holy Spirit. Part of that promise was the fact that even though individuals may may mistakes, the Church cannot. The Apostles then appointed pastors to govern different regions. The Catholic Church is the only Church whose pasters were direct successors to the Pope and prove it by pointing to Matt 18:18-20 which reads:

18 And Jesus coming, spoke to them, saying: All power is given to me in heaven and in earth. 19 Going therefore, teach ye all nations; baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost. 20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and behold I am with you all days, even to the consummation of the world.

Again, we look to the scriptures for proof that though individuals can become corrupt, the CC cannot. It was afforded that Grace uniquely in Matt 16:18,19 and 1 Tim 3:15

Matt 16:1819: 18 And I say to thee: That thou art Peter; and upon this rock I will build my church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it. 19 And I will give to thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven. And whatsoever thou shalt bind upon earth, it shall be bound also in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose upon earth, it shall be loosed also in heaven. and

1 Tim 3:15
15 But if I tarry long, that thou mayest know how thou oughtest to behave thyself in the house of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and ground of the truth.

The Catholic Church teaches us the traditions, both oral and written, given by Christ and passed down from Peter and the apostles to their appointed Bishops in an unbroken chain. Who can possibly be more qualified to teach us what the Scriptures mean?

 

[Truth_Seeker123]

What about the belly of the fish that Jonah called hell? That’s not private interpretation, if so please explain what it means.

 

[Pug]

Concerning the belly of the fish, I’m not sure if a confusion hasn’t arisen due to versification. The Douay reads in chapter 2 verse 3 of Jonah (Jonas)
3 And he said: I cried out of my affliction to the Lord, and he heard me: I cried out of the belly of hell, and thou hast heard my voice.
That is verse 2 in most other translations. So there could be confusion on that account. The Douay does contain the word “hell”, not just fish. (inferni/o in the Vulgate)

 

[Rence]

What about the belly of the fish that Jonah called hell? That’s not private interpretation, if so please explain what it means.

Here is the rest of those verses from the Douay-Rheims Bible:

Jonas 2:1-3
1 Now the Lord prepared a great fish to swallow up Jonas: and Jonas was in the belly of the fish three days and three nights. 2 And Jonas prayed to the Lord his God out of the belly of the fish. 3 And he said: I cried out of my affliction to the Lord, and he heard me: I cried out of the belly of hell, and thou hast heard my voice.

It means being in the belly of the fish is as painful and horrible as being in the belly of hell for Jonas. It does not mean that the belly of the fish is hell.

Whether or not you believe that the Lord prepared a great fish to swallow up Jonas or whether you believe it was the symbolism of something greatly distressing to Jonas, the point of it is, the Lord prepared an affliction for Jonas, that Jonas cried out in pain, a pain that was likened to hell for him.

As in, “studying all night for that test was hell!” does not mean, I was studying all night in hell. It means that it was horribly uncomfortable and distressing to be cramming all night for a test. Does that make sense to you?

You have to remember that these were written centuries ago. Their speech and writing was different than ours. That’s why sometimes you need help interpreting them by scholars who studied not only the different languages that these texts were written in, but they also studied biblical literature.

 

[StrawberryJam]

Do catholics have to take the story of Jonah literally?

I see the parallel to Jesus there with the three days, but I don’t see a need for literal there to be able to see that parallel.

I am fairly certain this is a story of testing and endurance.

But, I am open to any other view.

 

[TheQuestioner]

Do catholics have to take the story of Jonah literally?

I see the parallel to Jesus there with the three days, but I don’t see a need for literal there to be able to see that parallel.

I am fairly certain this is a story of testing and endurance.

But, I am open to any other view.

hmmm I’m not sure. Anything that pertains to the sacrifice of Christ has to be taken as fact.

 

[graceandglory]

Do catholics have to take the story of Jonah literally?

I see the parallel to Jesus there with the three days, but I don’t see a need for literal there to be able to see that parallel.

I am fairly certain this is a story of testing and endurance.

But, I am open to any other view.

HISTORICITY.—Catholics have always looked upon the Book of Jonas as a fact-narrative. In the works of some recent Catholic writers there is a leaning to regard the book as fiction. Only Simon and Jahn, among prominent Catholic scholars, have clearly denied the historicity of Jonas; and the orthodoxy of these two critics may no longer be defended: “Providentissimus Deus” implicitly condemned the ideas of both in the matter of inspiration, and the Congregation of the Index expressly condemned the “Introduction” of the latter.

**
Reasons for the traditional acceptance of the historicity of Jonas**
oce.catholic.com/index.php?title=Jonah

**
Catechism on the Scriptures**
vatican.va/archive/catechism/p1s1c2a3.htm

1. God is the author of Sacred Scripture. "The divinely revealed realities, which are contained and presented in the text of Sacred Scripture, have been written down under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit."

1. We accept as sacred and canonical the books of the Old and the New Testaments, whole and entire, with all their parts, on the grounds that, written under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit, they have God as their author, and have been handed on as such to the Church ."

1. God inspired the human authors of the sacred books. “To compose the sacred books, God chose certain men who, all the while he employed them in this task, made full use of their own faculties and powers so that, though he acted in them and by them, it was as true authors that they consigned to writing whatever he wanted written, and no more.”

1. The inspired books teach the truth. "Since therefore all that the inspired authors or sacred writers affirm should be regarded as affirmed by the Holy Spirit, we must acknowledge that the books of Scripture firmly, faithfully, and without error teach that truth which God, for the sake of our salvation, wished to see confided to the Sacred Scriptures."

1. Still, the Christian faith is not a “religion of the book.” Christianity is the religion of the “Word” of God, a word which is “not a written and mute word, but the Word is incarnate and living”. If the Scriptures are not to remain a dead letter, Christ, the eternal Word of the living God, must, through the Holy Spirit, “open [our] minds to understand the Scriptures.”

 

[adelore]

Let’s be clear. I seek TRUTH from the BIBLE. I’m not try to “convert” you, though it would be nice for you to see that a lot of catholic beliefs go against the Word of God (I can go further but I do not want to cause chaos and be band). God gives you free will and He gave you life, so it is not me you have to answer to.

Please remember my dear friend. Those scriptures that I post is what you are judge of. It is written.

Truth Seeker,

The Sad Truth is this, Many people **who do not fully understand **“Catholic Beliefs or Teachings” (such as yourself) are always “Trying” to Disprove what the Catholic Church beliefs and teaches. This is Sad for you! You see if you Really Knew and Understood “Our Beliefs and Teachings” (and your Bible better) you’d be better equipt to “try” and teach us something.

You won’t be the first, nor the last person, (JW) who has come on here to “wake us up” so to speak, by throwing out scriptures, (always out of context, I might add. Just look at how many Singel scripture verses to pick and choose from. All to get your “Point” across. ) to “prove to us” how wrong our Catholic Religon is. Of course, it goes without saying that the Church that Jesus started has lasted over 2,000 years. We are protected by the truth through Jesus.

I agree with some of the others on here, you do tend follow a lot of the Watch Tower/JW Teaching. If you are so “sure” of the teachings there, that is up to you.

But…my friend, do by all means, (since you are so sure and secure in what you believe) take a step out and look into our teachings and why we believe what we do. Now I don’t say this to convert you by no means…but you’d at least understand more fully how we as Catholics Think and why we understand the things we do. But again most JW’s won’t do this as they have a “fear” of doing this.

When people take scripture out of context or only go with a verse here or there; of course it can be made to “Look Like” however you want it to look. This is something a person must be very careful of, as it’s the same as trying to “Twist” Scripture to say something it’s not. This by no means is how the Bible was written.

But Satan seems to misguide some people by getting them to Falsely believe that this is ok. I will pray some more for you Truth Seeker…that you will read the Bible the way that it should be read, not by picking out a few Scriptures that seem to match your train of thought.

May God Bless you,

 

[Truth_Seeker123]

Truth Seeker,

The Sad Truth is this, Many people **who do not fully understand **“Catholic Beliefs or Teachings” (such as yourself) are always “Trying” to Disprove what the Catholic Church beliefs and teaches. This is Sad for you! You see if you Really Knew and Understood “Our Beliefs and Teachings” (and your Bible better) you’d be better equipt to “try” and teach us something.

You won’t be the first, nor the last person, (JW) who has come on here to “wake us up” so to speak, by throwing out scriptures, (always out of context, I might add. Just look at how many Singel scripture verses to pick and choose from. All to get your “Point” across. ) to “prove to us” how wrong our Catholic Religon is. Of course, it goes without saying that the Church that Jesus started has lasted over 2,000 years. We are protected by the truth through Jesus.

I agree with some of the others on here, you do tend follow a lot of the Watch Tower/JW Teaching. If you are so “sure” of the teachings there, that is up to you.

But…my friend, do by all means, (since you are so sure and secure in what you believe) take a step out and look into our teachings and why we believe what we do. Now I don’t say this to convert you by no means…but you’d at least understand more fully how we as Catholics Think and why we understand the things we do. But again most JW’s won’t do this as they have a “fear” of doing this.

When people take scripture out of context or only go with a verse here or there; of course it can be made to “Look Like” however you want it to look. This is something a person must be very careful of, as it’s the same as trying to “Twist” Scripture to say something it’s not. This by no means is how the Bible was written.

But Satan seems to misguide some people by getting them to Falsely believe that this is ok. I will pray some more for you Truth Seeker…that you will read the Bible the way that it should be read, not by picking out a few Scriptures that seem to match your train of thought.

May God Bless you,

When did you come to the conclusion that I am a JW? You are wrong. Please leave my denominational practice out of this. I was right and many of you know it. You only want to know my denomination to use it against me and discredit anything I say.

Face it, you don’t know my denomination and I follow the Bible. Jw’s have their own Bible, so why is it that I have only posted scripture from the KJV?

You can try to change the topic and say I don’t understand what you believe, but the truth is you and your catholic friends believe in a place called hell. But what neither of you can explain on your own WHILE USING SCRIPTURE is why did Jonah call the belly of the fish HELL.

You try to prove your point by using scritpures that you obviously have no clue as to what they are saying, because every time you use them, you make it seem like the Bible contradicts itself. I’m not catholic so don’t put me in the same boat as you. Yes I have stepped out and searched for truth but I was always taught to read my Bible.

So, if I read my Bible and I search for truth in catholicism and God says don’t follow the traditions of men and you all hold traditions over the Bible. Then catholicism is not for me unless proven other wise (you all are failing horribly). And with the years of studying that I have done. All things point away from catholicism. I just wish you could see that.

So in this case, GUESS WHAT, you are wrong or you are saying that Christ is wrong. You pick, but know that your decision is completely up to you. I’m just posting scripture.

Also know that you will not be saved by a NAME. I have catholic friends, and I know what you believe and if thats not what you believe then someone is misrepresenting your organization. That’s one reason I speak for myself and not for others in my denomination.

Please explain what Jonah meant or did I take that out of context as well? If so, like in another thread I posted, why must something be out of context when you can’t explain it?

 

[graceandglory]

You only want to know my denomination to use it against me and discredit anything I say.

I still can’t get over how weird it is that you say this.
If we know who we are talking to we can have a discussion. We would know where we agree and where we disagree.

Until then, you are just a wolf in sheep’s clothing.

 

[wanner47]

Truthseeker, you keep saying “I follow the Bible.” Well, so do we. The question is, what makes your interpretation superior to ours?