Liberalism

[LittleFlower378]

If you get a chance read the catholic encyclopedia definition of liberalism. It hits home on some of the problems we see today. Read the part on liberal catholicism. Its interesting to see that catholic liberalism has sympathy with the state even when it goes against the liberty of the Church. What are your thoughts?

newadvent.org/cathen/09212a.htm

 

[Cojuanco]

It is interesting to note in the American context that to a great extent much of the leadership in both parties are now espousing most of the elements of liberalism mentioned in the entry.

 

[LittleFlower378]

Do you mean they are both anti ecclesiastical? If so that wouldn’t be good.

Another good Writing to read -http://www.vatican.va/holy_father/l...ments/hf_l-xiii_enc_20061888_libertas_en.html

 

[christofirst]

Compare Pope Gregory XVI’s “Mirari Vos: On Liberalism and Religious Indifferentism” with Pope Francis’ “Evangelii Gaudum: The Joy of the Gospel” (Yes, I know, one is an encyclical and the other is an apostolic exhortation). It is said that the message of the popes and the Church never changes, but it seems to me that the tone of that message certainly does! Good Pope Gregory just comes across as chastising and, dare I say, conservative, compared to Pope Francis.

As society itself has arguably become more liberal, the tone of the Church’s eternal message seems to adapt. At first, with Gregory, it appears as a stern warning. Now, with Francis, it appears more inviting and conciliatory, reaching out to those of us who have been swept along with the changing times. This is not a bad thing, in my opinion. The Church’s mission is to save as many as possible, to reach out to all as effectively as possible. Just my observation.

 

[christofirst]

The point of my last post, I suppose, is that the Catholic Encyclopedia, published in 1917, reflects the tone of the times, which often appears closer to Mirari Vos than Evangelii Gaudem. Both contain the truth, but with a different emphasis.

Can we agree that, at least here in the west, the cat of liberalism is already out of the bag? The question then seems to be, how do we get the cat to return to the bag, or at least corral the cat closer to the bag, since I’m still not convinced that all elements of what we now broadly term liberalism ever really belonged in the bag in the first place.

We can use the negative approach, stamping our feet and yelling, “You bad cat! Get back in the bag this instant!” I know how my cat reacts to that approach. Or we can use a positive approach, acknowledging that not all change is bad. Without giving way on the true essentials, we can dialogue without always seeking to lay down the law. With this more inviting approach, the cat might just use her feline free will and come back closer to the safety of the bag.

There is room for dialogue, but I don’t always get that impression when I read the Catholic Encyclopedia.

 

[LittleFlower378]

christofirst you made some good points. While previous popes had styles that were fit for the times you seem to be right as listening to Pope Francis is a different soft inviting style while still being strong in the essentials. I once read about St.Therese the Little Flower where she said something along the lines that people respond differently to hearing the truth. Some you may want to be harder with, they will accept the message better while with some gentleness is the best path. Also there is a difference between styles and not with being passive to the evils of that go against the morality of the Church. While the encyclopedia was from 1916, there is still alot you can take from it. One of the approaches I take is that if there is something problematic with society such as liberalism and reletavism, freemasonry it is a good idea to learn as much about it as possible so that you can better respond in love whether that be a chastisement or a soft inviting approach.