Lifeteen Discussion (cont.)

[TheMc]

I would just like to highlight one thing: this was not written by Pope Benedict, but rather by Cardinal Ratzinger before he took on a new name and new authority. Trying to call it “written by a pope” is a bit disingenious because it was written by a Cardinal and has not been reaffirmed or republished by the man who is NOW pope.

Disingenious? Why would you believe that he has changed his views? I see nothing even close to him changing views after his election.

Also, I see nothing wrong with saying it’s “written by the pope.” He wrote it, and he’s the pope. It doesn’t get much clearer than that.

This is just silly.

 

[DCNBILL]

Disingenious? Why would you believe that he has changed his views? I see nothing even close to him changing views after his election.

Also, I see nothing wrong with saying it’s “written by the pope.” He wrote it, and he’s the pope. It doesn’t get much clearer than that.

This is just silly.

When referring to writings such as these Catholic exegetes will make that very distinction stating something akin to. “Pope Benedict, writing as Joseph Cardinal Ratzinger…”

The reason for this distinction is the authority that the Papal office has and to separate the writings and pronouncements of the holder of that office from the writings and pronouncements he made prior to holding this office of authority.

 

[pnewton]

This reasoning is flawed.

No it is not. It is my understanding, that you do not have to agree with. Inculturation is a Catholic method. Using that which we sense to better understand the transcedental is basic theology. Just because there are limits does not make my understanding alse.

Have you read Pope Benedict’s note on music in the liturgy? …

Yes, multiple times. I have referred to it often here.

 

[pnewton]

When referring to writings such as these Catholic exegetes will make that very distinction stating something akin to. “Pope Benedict, writing as Joseph Cardinal Ratzinger…”

The reason for this distinction is the authority that the Papal office has and to separate the writings and pronouncements of the holder of that office from the writings and pronouncements he made prior to holding this office of authority.

I think it worthy of note that as holy pontiff, he has the authority to implement any discipline he think prudent. I am surprised that he has not spoken on some of the stronger points in his book, like ad orientum. Since he hasn’t there must be a reason. Perhaps he does not want to encourage the “us vs. them” claim on the Mass that keeps re-occurring when traditionalist clash with the rest of the Catholic Church. Like I said, we can listen to the admonition of St. Paul, or keep pushing for what we want. I personally think it rings false to speak of reverance to God unless we are willing to put our brothers first.

 

[DCNBILL]

I think it worthy of note that as holy pontiff, he has the authority to implement any discipline he think prudent. I am surprised that he has not spoken on some of the stronger points in his book, like ad orientum. Since he hasn’t there must be a reason. Perhaps he does not want to encourage the “us vs. them” claim on the Mass that keeps re-occurring when traditionalist clash with the rest of the Catholic Church. Like I said, we can listen to the admonition of St. Paul, or keep pushing for what we want. I personally think it rings false to speak of reverance to God unless we are willing to put our brothers first.

:yup:

 

[AnneTeresa]

I think you have made a very good point, and also one that is very telling. I used to be an RE teacher for teenagers, and I can confirm what you said about how most of the teens know next to nothing about the bible, the Church, or anything else about our religion. For example, if I told them to open up their bibles to say Matthew 16:18, most of them would not be able to find it.

I believe this sad state of catechesis is the greatest threat to the Church today, and it’s not just teens either–most Catholic adults are in the same boat as well. We are in the midst of a multi-generational crisis of faith when it comes to catechesis, which I believe is also the root cause of so many other problems, such as people leaving the church, lack of mass attendance, lack of reverence, lack of tithing, liberal interpretation of Catholic teaching, etc. I don’t know how it came to be, but somehow over the last 30 years we have largely abandoned good solid catechesis in favor of a lot of nonsense, and we are now reaping the consequences.

The Church rightly so expects parents to be the primary faith educators of children, but the problem now is that most parents today are not equipped with enough catechesis themselves to fulfill that duty. The ball has been dropped, there is rampant apathy, and we are limping along. So Lifeteen is basically a last-ditch emergency effort to keep teens in the Church who otherwise would be apathetic to religion at all.

To solve this crisis, there are practical things that can be done. First of all, we have got to get Catholic adults properly catechized. Many Protestant churches have Sunday school every week for every age group from the day you join until the day you die. Not only that, but there is a cultural expectation that everyone attends Sunday school. I think we need that kind of culture–one which values RE for adults as much as for youth. How many of you have gone to an adult ed class at your parish that maybe had a dozen or so participants out of thousands of parishioners? That is truly sad, and what does that say about us as Catholics? You cannot love what you do not know.

Secondly, I think there would be a great benefit to some standardization of catechesis if not world-wide, then at least nation-wide. You can go to one parish that has good RE, and another that has terrible RE, even within the same diocese. Should not the teachers have an approved syllabus for each grade level that was either written by Rome or by the USCCB? We are supposed to be the universal Church, but we don’t educate that way. No matter what country you live in or what language you speak, the truths of Catholicism are the same and should be taught. I think right now we leave too much up to the individual RE programs/teachers to decide for themselves what is worth teaching, and there is the additional danger that more “liberal” Catholics tend to skip things they don’t like. I witnessed this myself as an RCIA sponsor.

I basically agree with you, except I wouldn’t put the onus on society, but would narrow that down to Catholic society. We shouldn’t have to worry about keeping teens in the Church, but we are in that position because we let it get that far in the first place. I think education is the key, especially for our adults.

everything s/he said! I’m living proof that adults, let alone teens, do not know the faith. Never learned, how could I teach it to my own kids?