Light of the World -- Read it yet?

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I just finished reading Light of the World. It is absolutely incredible. I’m about to begin reading it again, this time more slowly. The Holy Father addresses several points that often come up on TC Forum: Bishop Williamson, the liturgy, Fatima, the role of the pope and papacy, culture of moral relativism, Islam and a few other interesting subjects that don’t come up here.

He’s also very candid about his daily life, his feelings about being pope, his vision for the Church and his vision of the world. His vision of the world is incredible. He looks at it through a completely different set of lenses than most of us do.

As a Franciscan, I have to admit that I have a bias. He is a hybrid between Franciscan and Augustinian. His approach to his answers uses the method of that school, not the classic Thomistic school. The good thing is that the Augustinian/Franciscan method is user friendly. It’s easy to read. The difficult part is that it is very nuanced just as were Augustine and Bonaventure. Every word has three or four meanings, so you can’t just read a sentence and say, “I understand.” No, you probably don’t. As is typical of these two schools, you have to read the thesis from beginning to end. Fortunately, he does not deal a lot in doctrine. He deal a lot in morals and ecclesiology.

He clarifies what he meant when he spoke at Fatima. Most people on CAF read that one wrong too. It’s hard to explain it in brief. But he specifically says that he is not expecting any extraordinary occurrence to happen between now and the 100th anniversary of Fatima. He is hoping for the conversion of hearts. In that way, the Immaculate Heart will triumph and he goes on to say some beautiful things about Our Lady. Just awesome!

He is very candid too. He admits the mistakes that were made, but is unapologetic. He simply says that mistakes were made and explains what went wrong, but life goes on. I found this very helpful, because it communicates a trust in God’s providence. God is driving the bus, not us. It also communicates that if we do the best we can, with what we have at the time, God will take care of the rest. We don’t have to be perfect. We just have to be faithful.

A few points made me chuckle. He said that if people don’t like the pope, they should blame it on the cardinals who did the electing. On another point he was asked if he could speak a little more simply, for the common man . He says that he’s not about to “dumb down theology”. He minces no words in expressing his reservations about Bishop Williamson. He even says that had he known more about him, he would have separated him when lifting the excommunications. He would not have been included.

He has an interesting take on the way that the world uses the term “conscience”. I loved that one too. It made me chuckle, not because he’s being comical, but because he’s so dead on that it’s a wonder why so many people cannot see it.

He speaks about the countries that he has visited and what he has found there. He is very simple in his approach to everything. Despite his genius, his faith is that of a child, which is refreshing. Basically he goes with a very simple prayer, “You fix it.” Then he goes out and does what he has to do, trusting that God will use whatever he does to fix the problem.

Just in case anyone doubts the content. The Introduction confirms that the Pope read the final script before it went to press and edited a few things. It says what he wanted to say.

Has anyone else finished it?

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF 🙂
 
I’m afraid I don’t have the money for it, but I would like to say that he is most definitely a great and holy man. Anyone who wants to read something deeply moving, spiritually-uplifting, and profoundly innocent in faith should read this! Not even having opened one page myself, I can tell from reading the jacket (at the Catholic book store where I am employed) that it is quite the roller coaster of relativity-smacking fun. So many people have purchased this book from my very hands in the last week alone, and all of them had a look of mystical expectation in their eyes.

There is only one reservation I have: our pope isn’t a Thomist?! :eek: What heresy; in fact, I dare say that’s even a form of apostasy! How can anyone possibly be an Augustinian (or one of those silly Franciscans? ;)) after St. Thomas? Ironically, St. Bonaventure is my ‘favourite’ saint after Thomas, and he’ll probably be my Confirmation saint. 🙂

Br. Jay, how deeply does our Holy Father seem to reflect Seraphic Philosophy in these interviews? It might convince me to buy the book so I can actually respond properly here!
 
No I’m not the mindset of reading too many books anymore.
 
Br. Jay, how deeply does our Holy Father seem to reflect Seraphic Philosophy in these interviews? It might convince me to buy the book so I can actually respond properly here!
How Seraphic is he? That’s an interesting question. I would have to say that his philosophy is very Franciscan and his theology is very Augustinian, which are very compatible, because Augustinian thought influenced the Franciscan School.

That being said, I can best explain Pope Benedict’s presentation in this work with a few examples. When he discusses the sexual abuse scandal, he is very calm. The term “crisis” is not in his vocabulary or his tone. He may use it colloquially, to use the same language that everyone else is using. But his approach is not that of a man who is facing a crisis. His approach is that of a man who is facing sin inside the Church. Like Bonaventure, he takes the wide-angle view. The sins in the Church are really the sins of the world and the Church in not immune.

Like a good Franciscan, he does not seem to be rattled by it. He is concerned. Concern is very different from panic-stricken. He is ashamed for those who have no shame. He shows a fraternal identification with those who have been hurt. This is the way that Bonaventure described Francis’ approach to the sins of the day inside and outside the Church. There was an awareness of sin, but there was also an awareness of innocence. The sin has to be avoided and its effect has to be addressed, but the sinner and the victim have to be loved, because these are our brothers and sisters. He does not take the high road that many people take suggesting that all of these sinners should be executed at dawn.

At the same time, you can see the sensitivity and logic of Augustine. He raises a rhetorical question. “Why did these men ever become priests or religious?” He is truly interested in figuring that out.

He is also very practical. He poses that these men should not be accorded the honor of a dispensation from the clerical state or the religious life, but they should be consequenced with a dismissal. The end effect is the same. The priest remains a priest forever, but he can no longer exercise his ministry. He returns to live among the ranks of the laity. The means is very different. A man who requests and receives a dispensation is getting what one may call an honorable discharge. Whereas the man who is dismissed is also being discharged, but as a punishment for his crime. So, there is a strong sense of justice, which is very present in Augustinian thinking. Augustine wrote a great deal on justice.

Another example that would be of interest to people on this forum is the excommunication of the four SSPX bishops. There, he is very seraphic. It comes through very strongly in the choice of words. He speaks about the Williamson affair. He says several things that are interesting. The first is that if he had known about Williamson’s position on the Holocaust, he would not have lifted his excommunication. He explicitly says that he would have separated him from the others. His justification for doing so is very Franciscan. Williamson is not in communion with the Primacy. He uses that world, primacy.

This is something that St. Francis wrote into his rule and St. Bonaventure incorporates into his theology of the Church. Regardless of whether you agree or disagree with the pope or your superior, there is an issue of primacy. You must be submissive. Submission is the sign of communion. Whether you’re right or not is irrelevant, if you’re not on the same page then the communion is broken. The only time that you may dissent is when you are explicitly asked to sin. Sin must be defined by the Church, not by your conscience. Your conscience has to be one with the Church. The Church’s conscience is exemplified and guided by the pope. This is very seraphic language here.

He also states that the excommunications were in fact lifted. They were never declared invalid. He explains that they existed because the four bishops had separated themselves from the Primacy. Here again, we see the Franciscan language. If you separate yourself from the pope, for whatever reason, you’re outside. However, the excommunication was lifted, because the bishops declared their desire to be in communion with the primacy and they expressed their recognition of the primacy. This is both Augustinian and Franciscan. Augustine is very strong on the authority of the See of Peter. Francis hands it down to his friars as a mandate, under penalty of excommunication and Bonaventure, who is a faithful son of St. Francis, has to include it in his theological work. He can’t leave this out or he is out of communion with his spiritual father. The pope points to the fact that the bishops wrote to him asking to be admitted into full communion; therefore, the excommunication was no longer necessary. The other issues could be worked out through dialogue. Again, we see him swing back to this fraternal mode. He is both primate and brother. These are all points that he makes in his interview. I’m consolidating here.

Continued . . .
 
One final point that caught my attention was his statement about the powerlessness of the pope. I thought that was very Franciscan. He said that the pope has no power, contrary to what people think. What he is talking about is that the pope can no more change what other people do or fail to do than he can walk on water. He can speak the truth. He can proclaim the Gospel. He can lead by example, but he cannot control. What we see is not an abdication of authority. What we see is a very humble man who sees his role as that of a protector and servant. Even though, in his one point on the relationship with the Orthodox, he does mention that the Bishop of Rome is not one among equals. That’s a whole other issue. He remains the primate, the successor of Peter. You see Augustine all over again on the primacy and Bonaventure on the image of protector and servant. It’s very interesting, because this is Franciscan language. We don’t have superiors. We never did. We have one Father, Francis of Assisi. His successors are Guardians and Ministers. They have authority, but they must wield it to protect and to serve, not to crush.

He is definitely a very deep man and has a very different understanding of the papacy from the rest of us. Like Augustine and Bonaventure, his language is very nuanced, unlike Aquinas who is succinct, even when he’s speaking about great abstracts.

I don’t know if I answered the question well enough. I came away feeling that the hoopla about the condom excerpt was due to the Vatican’s press release about the book where they gave some isolated citations to evoke the interest of people. The greatness of the work is really the holiness and scholarship of the man.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF 🙂
 
No I’m not the mindset of reading too many books anymore.
Not knowing why you’re not in the reading mindset, I don’t know if this will help or not. I just want to add that this book is easy reading, because it keeps your interest. The subject changes constantly. The writer did a good job at not dragging anything on too long. He asks the question, quotes the answer and moves right on to the next question. The good part about this writer is that he does not comment. The only comments that the author makes are when he’s leading into the question. He’ll begin the question by commenting on something that has happened or has been said and that he throws the ball at the pope to respond.

Some parts are simply anecdotes. They are trivia about Pope Benedict, without being trivial. For example, when he is asked about his first few minutes as pope. The writer points to the fact that the popes are led into this chamber of tears. The pope makes you chuckle with his very common sense response. He said that he did not have time for that. He had to figure otu what robe he was to wear and what he was to say to the people when he appeared on the balcony and he’s under the gun. The clock is ticking. Once he accepts the election, things move very quickly. I liked his lack of drama. He did also say that he raised his thought to God and said something like, “You got me here, now you’ll just have to walk with me.” or something to that effect. He reminded me of Mother Teresa.

The point is that this is an enjoyable and informative book. It answers many questions and tells you, point blank, which ones are not going to be answered by this pope.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF 🙂
 
Thank you, Brother JR for the wonderful synopsis. Is the book easier to read than “Jesus of Nazareth”?
I have had that book for over a year and just can’t get past the first three chapters. I even joined the book club here at the forum, in hopes that I could “get it”. But while everyone else was peeling the onion, so to speak, I could not get past the first “layer”. I am not going to give up on it though!
Thanks again. The more I learn about Pope Benedict, the more I love him.
If you have any insights into “Jesus of Nazareth” would you mind posting them?
 
Is it easier to read than Jesus of Nazareth?

I’m going to have to respond to that with my own nuance. They’re very different. Jesus of Nazareth was written by the pope. Light of the World is written by Seewald. Ratzinger is a theologian and Seewald is a journalist. Therefore, Light of the World/] reads like a transcript from Larry King Live or one of those news interview programs. Seewald does help you, because he frames the questions by giving you a little background. For example, he asked about the Pope’s comments at Fatima. He starts the question by reminding the pope what he said at Fatima and what people read into it and then he throws the ball at the Holy Father. Then the Holy Father responded by saying that these are his words, but not what he said. What he did was express a hope, not state a fact. He goes on to explain that he does not expect the world to suddenly turn around, because of Fatima. He explains that it does not work that way. The victory of the Immaculate Heart is ongoing and quiet, as good replaces evil and it is his hope that this will continue and that man will cooperate by embracing, faith, hope, love and penance. He then moves on. He doesn’t give the journalist a chance to ask more. Not that you get the impression that he wants to ask more.

This is not a book that you read to get answers to your greatest faith questions. This is a book that you read to get a vision of the Church and to be inspired by a man who, despite the times in which we live, has great faith in God and what God does through his Church.

In Jesus of Nazareth you don’t have someone guiding the conversation or giving you a heads-up of what’s coming. On the other hand, in Jesus of Nazareth he tells you from the very beginning that this is not a book of doctrine, facts or even exegesis. These are theses statements that are running through his mind and he’s going to share them with us and show us why he believes them. However, you do not have to believe anything he says about Jesus. He tells you this in his introduction. This is Dr. Joseph Ratzinger speaking, not Pope Benedict.

The interesting thing is that in Light of the World he speaks as Pope Benedict and has every intent of having you take him at his word. The little bits that he shares are not up for dispute. It is the pope speaking and he will not tolerate dispute. In Jesus of Nazareth, it’s the doctor speaking and he invites you to respond and even correct him. The funny thing is that the only way that you can correct him is if you can come up with a better thesis statement than his own or he’ll sweep the floor with you. Benedict does not tolerate pat answers such as, “The Church has always said”. Since his background is Bonaventure’s historical theology, he hits you with “Why did the Church say this? Who said it? Did he mean what you’re hearing? Do these words mean what they imply? Doctrine is fixed, but faith is not; therefore, are we stuck with the same understanding or should our understanding of eternal truths not grow? What were the events, concepts, principles and scriptural sources that led the Church to make that statement? Can that statement be made again in better language?” You’re left sitting there going, “Duhhhh”

There are two ways to read Jesus of Nazareth. You can read it to understand his thesis about who Jesus is compared to everyone else’s thesis or you can read it to engage in debate with him, in which case you have to be ready to research his sources. I engaged in the debate. It took me two-years to read through it to my satisfaction. After I read it, I sat in the library for three hours every Saturday morning and read his sources and tried to reorganize them differently to see if I could arrive at a different conclusion. It was a lot of fun and a good use of my spare time. It took about two-years. I’m studying his book on the Fathers.

I would suggest that one begins reading Jesus of Nazareth in this order: Chs. 10, 3, 9, 2, and 1. These all deal with the identity of Jesus. They answer the fundamental question of Christology.

The you move on to the Christological sources, the Apostles. You have to understand what they saw and understood. If you don’t understand what they saw and understood, then you’re left with the question, “How do we know that this is really Jesus’ identity?” This is answered in Chs. 6, 7, 9, and 8. Notice, you go back to 9.

Now that you have established the identity of Jesus and you know how the Apostles knew, then you move to what they learned. This comes out in Chs. 4, 5 and 7. We go back to 7 with a new question.

Finally, you’re ready to read the Holy Father’s thesis on the Mystery of Jesus, which he offers in his introduction.

The Holy Father presents it in a different order, because he’s giving you his thesis and his support for his thesis. I rearrange the order, because I’m interested in three questions: 1) Who is Jesus? 2) Who said so and why? 3) What did they learn about him and from him? When I read his introduction and he invites the reader to engage with him, I took him up on his invitation. 😃 It’s a lot of fun when a writer invites you to dialogue with him.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF 🙂
 
Thank you, Br. JR, for your suggestions. I have just bookmarked my book in the order you have suggested. (old envelopes that the glue has dried up do come in handy).🙂

I have also bookmarked your post, so I can refer to it as needed.

I will not be reading, in light of debate, but to strengthen my faith. I feel like I am about to go on an adventure with a great and holy man. I am exited.
 
Thank you, Br. JR, for your suggestions. I have just bookmarked my book in the order you have suggested. (old envelopes that the glue has dried up do come in handy).🙂

I have also bookmarked your post, so I can refer to it as needed.

I will not be reading, in light of debate, but to strengthen my faith. I feel like I am about to go on an adventure with a great and holy man. I am exited.
Do you folks remember Shakespeare’s Sonnet 116 from your middle school days?

"Love is not love
Which alters when it alteration finds,
Or bends with the remover to remove:
O no! it is an ever-fixed mark
That looks on tempests and is never shaken."


I’m often reminded of it when I read the writings of Pope Benedict.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF 🙂
 
I’ve been checking and checking in my neck of the woods for this book, and it barely got to the store this week! (alas, I’ve been ill and can’t get there right now). And Amazon’s been saying it would take several weeks or that it was out of stock!

To avoid spoilers, I didn’t read Br. JR’s comments just yet, but to the reader that feared reading the Seewald interview b/c of the experience with “Jesus of Nazareth”, I echo: They are very different.

Over the years, I’ve purchased others of the Seewald interview books for the library b/c I wanted more people to get to know our Holy Father better. My favorite one so far is “God and the World” – I always find something there to make me think!

I remember when I “met” Cardinal Ratzinger in another interview (hmm, I was about 18, a long time ago!); I skimmed the article and then read it more closely; I was so amazed by this person who spoke so clearly, with such firmness and charity on various issues – I’d never heard anyone like him in my life!

The Holy Father has been dear to my heart ever since, and I look forward to reading this latest interview.

take care,
amsjj 🙂

+++
Jesus, God and man,
imprisoned by love in Thy most holy Sacrament,
have mercy upon us.
– Blessed John Henry Newman, December 22, 1851
 
I’ve been checking and checking in my neck of the woods for this book, and it barely got to the store this week! (alas, I’ve been ill and can’t get there right now). And Amazon’s been saying it would take several weeks or that it was out of stock!

To avoid spoilers, I didn’t read Br. JR’s comments just yet, but to the reader that feared reading the Seewald interview b/c of the experience with “Jesus of Nazareth”, I echo: They are very different.

Over the years, I’ve purchased others of the Seewald interview books for the library b/c I wanted more people to get to know our Holy Father better. My favorite one so far is “God and the World” – I always find something there to make me think!

I remember when I “met” Cardinal Ratzinger in another interview (hmm, I was about 18, a long time ago!); I skimmed the article and then read it more closely; I was so amazed by this person who spoke so clearly, with such firmness and charity on various issues – I’d never heard anyone like him in my life!

The Holy Father has been dear to my heart ever since, and I look forward to reading this latest interview.

take care,
amsjj 🙂

+++
Jesus, God and man,
imprisoned by love in Thy most holy Sacrament,
have mercy upon us.
– Blessed John Henry Newman, December 22, 1851
amsjj is correct, Jesus of Nazaretch and Light of the World are very different. Seewald is not a theologian. He’s not trying to write theology. He’s a journalist. He asks questions and the Pope answers.

Since there is not much time for elaboration, the answers are succinct

In Jesus of Nazareth the pope is doing the writing and he has all the time in the world to elaborate on an idea. He can take a single word and write five pages on it. It’s really a stream of consciousness.

Different writers, different goals, different styles.

It is unfortunate that Seewald never did an interview of John Paul II. I actually met him twice and had two 15-min conversations with him. He was absolutely delightful and brilliant too. His writings also scare some people and shock others, because people don’t understand what he’s talking about. But when you met him, he was as simple and clear as a fresh rain drop. His one work that often confuse the heck out of people is Crossing the Threshold of Hope and it’s not a frightening work at all. It’s just very Thomistic. John Paul was a philosopher and his role model was Aquinas.

Benedict is a theologian whose role models are Augustine and Bonaventure.

If you like left-brain thinking, go with John Paul II. If you’re into right-brain thinking, go with Benedict XVI. They’re both going in the same direction.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF 🙂
 
Thanks so much for your very comprehensive comments, Brother JR 🙂 Now I want to go out and read the books! Hopefully I will get a chance to soon.
 
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