Limbo of the Children

[v1gilbert]

With the formal announcement of the reversing of the teaching on Limbo of the Children I saw on the AP press release a comment from Rev. McBrien from Notre Dame which was a concern (see link):

news.aol.com/topnews/articles/_a/catholic-church-reverses-teaching-on/20070420203609990001?ncid=NWS00010000000001

Since I have more “zeal than brains” I may have not been as articulate as some of you would have been. What would you have said to him? His email address is rmcbrien@nd.edu if you want to send him your thoughts.

 

[JKirkLVNV]

If Father McBrien said it was a bright, sunny day, I’d pack an umbrella. Original sin still exists.

 

[1ke]

With the formal announcement of the reversing of the teaching on Limbo of the Children

First of all, there never was a formal teaching regarding Limbo, so there was nothing to “reverse”.

Secondly, the document doesn’t definitively teach against Limbo. It merely states that we don’t know, and so we HOPE that babies who die without baptism can receive the Beatific Vision.

Third, this is no different than what is already in the Catechism.

Fr. McBrien is a known dissenter and I don’t read anything he says, or take it seriously.

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

With the formal announcement of the reversing of the teaching on Limbo of the Children I saw on the AP press release a comment from Rev. McBrien from Notre Dame which was a concern (see link):

news.aol.com/topnews/articles/_a/catholic-church-reverses-teaching-on/20070420203609990001?ncid=NWS00010000000001

Since I have more “zeal than brains” I may have not been as articulate as some of you would have been. What would you have said to him? His email address is rmcbrien@nd.edu if you want to send him your thoughts.

The formal announcement didn’t reverse anything, it simply restated the same thing the Catechism says. Limbo of the Infants is still an option for belief.

 

[Julianna]

As far as limbo is concerned: No, DUH! :doh2: Of course babies who die before baptism go to heaven. Now it’s official. Geez Louise, the debate is over, finally!

 

[1ke]

As far as limbo is concerned: No, DUH! :doh2: Of course babies who die before baptism go to heaven. Now it’s official. Geez Louise, the debate is over, finally!

Clearly, you did not read the document. It does not say babies go to heaven.

 

[Genesis315]

As far as limbo is concerned: No, DUH! :doh2: Of course babies who die before baptism go to heaven. Now it’s official. Geez Louise, the debate is over, finally!

It only says we can hope so and it gives reasons for that hope, not that they automatically do.

 

[Genesis315]

As for Fr. McBrien, people like to throw the word “modernist” around for a lot of things, but given its most technical meaning, Fr. McBrien is a textbook modernist–and his book “Catholicism” is that textbook. It’s so bad, the USCCB made it a forbidden book.

 

[Fidelis]

Fr. McBrien is a textbook modernist–and his book “Catholicism” is that textbook. It’s so bad, the USCCB made it a forbidden book.

Not that I’m a fan of Fr. McBrien and his book, but I have never seen any documentation of an action by the USCCB “forbidding” his book (or any other book, for that matter). It isn’t something the US bishops have been known to do. Would you mind supplying a reference? Thanks.

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

As far as limbo is concerned: No, DUH! :doh2: Of course babies who die before baptism go to heaven. Now it’s official. Geez Louise, the debate is over, finally!

And where do you get that from? The Baptist chuch? Or one of those churches that reject the necessity of Infant Baptism?

 

[Genesis315]

Not that I’m a fan of Fr. McBrien and his book, but I have never seen any documentation of an action by the USCCB “forbidding” his book (or any other book, for that matter). It isn’t something the US bishops have been known to do. Would you mind supplying a reference? Thanks.

Here’s a good article:

catholic.com/thisrock/1997/9709fea2.asp

His work got the same treatment as the Marquette professor’s a while back. While there is no index of course, Catholics were discouraged from reading–it’s the closest thing to a forbidding. Pardon my hyperbole

 

[carol_marie]

As far as limbo is concerned: No, DUH! :doh2: Of course babies who die before baptism go to heaven. Now it’s official. Geez Louise, the debate is over, finally!

I’m with you. Of course they go to heaven. Why wouldn’t they? I can’t understand why some Catholics want so badly to dash parent’s hopes who’ve lost a child? As if losing the child wasn’t bad enough. It’s cruel.

I KNOW my six babies are in heaven. It has nothing to do with Baptist theology or Catholic theology. Jesus said let the little children come to me & just like those first disciples, some people have a problem with that. Why… I don’t know?

Are we born with original sin? Yes - but God can do whatever He choses - He isn’t bound by anything.

God bless Pope Benedict.

 

[John_Hiner]

I’m with you. Of course they go to heaven. Why wouldn’t they? I can’t understand why some Catholics want so badly to dash parent’s hopes who’ve lost a child? As if losing the child wasn’t bad enough. It’s cruel.

I KNOW my six babies are in heaven. It has nothing to do with Baptist theology or Catholic theology. Jesus said let the little children come to me & just like those first disciples, some people have a problem with that. Why… I don’t know?

Are we born with original sin? Yes - but God can do whatever He choses - He isn’t bound by anything.

God bless Pope Benedict.

Is God not bound by His words and gifts? By His promises? If not, what of His “faithfulness?”

It is respect for humans and human families that limits God’s options in salvation. Respect is integral to love and God is love; so He cannot do whatever can be chosen, only what is loving.

This is the problem.

Pax Christi tecum.

John Hiner

 

[Julianna]

And where do you get that from? The Baptist chuch? Or one of those churches that reject the necessity of Infant Baptism?

Cheap shot…it is MY belief. How’s that? "one of “THOSE” churches? and you are a Br.?

 

[carol_marie]

Is God not bound by His words and gifts? By His promises? If not, what of His “faithfulness?”

It is respect for humans and human families that limits God’s options in salvation. Respect is integral to love and God is love; so He cannot do whatever can be chosen, only what is loving.

This is the problem.

Pax Christi tecum.

John Hiner

In RCIA my Priest said that we are bound by the Sacrements but God is not. Do you disagree with that?

I bolded the part of your post that I am totally confused by. I don’t think God limits salvation at all… it is His desire that everyone be saved. But we’ve been given free will and some people choose to not accept His gift of grace.

Also, you said that God can only do what is loving. I agree. Isn’t it most loving to allow preborn babies who’ve died to go to heaven? In what way have they chosen to reject God?

 

[thistle]

Cheap shot…it is MY belief. How’s that? "one of “THOSE” churches? and you are a Br.?

I think you are missing the point. The published document does NOT say unbaptised children go to Heaven. There is NO official Church teaching that says this.
I happen to believe they will go to Heaven. However, all we can do is to trust in God’s mercy and hope they go to Heaven but for anyone to state categorically that the Church teaches unbaptised children go to Heaven is totally incorrect.

 

[Julianna]

I think you are missing the point. The published document does NOT say unbaptised children go to Heaven. There is NO official Church teaching that says this.
I happen to believe they will go to Heaven. However, all we can do is to trust in God’s mercy and hope they go to Heaven but for anyone to state categorically that the Church teaches unbaptised children go to Heaven is totally incorrect.

I really don’t need to wait until the church says so. It’s obvious to me.

 

[Randy_Carson]

And where do you get that from? The Baptist chuch? Or one of those churches that reject the necessity of Infant Baptism?

Now, now…let’s not get a bunch of Tarheels fighting amongst themselves.

This isn’t a Duke-Carolina game.

 

[thistle]

I really don’t need to wait until the church says so. It’s obvious to me.

I’m sorry. I didn’t realise you knew better than the Magisterium and had more authority than the Magisterium!!

 

[JMJ_coder]

Hello,

Here’s a good article:

catholic.com/thisrock/1997/9709fea2.asp

His work got the same treatment as the Marquette professor’s a while back. While there is no index of course, Catholics were discouraged from reading–it’s the closest thing to a forbidding. Pardon my hyperbole

I have his book on the History of the Popes. Is this book filled with his liberalisms? And if so, where can I find a decent book on the history of the popes and the papacy?