list of infallible Papal statements

[Irish_Polock]

I want to know exactly are the below statements infallible or
"Various people have gone backwards from 1870 and sometimes* inaccurately labeled various statements as infallible***."

Pope Innocent III, Fourth Lateran Council, Constitution 1, 1215, ex cathedra: “There is indeed one universal Church of the faithful, outside of which nobody at all is saved, in which Jesus Christ is both priest and sacrifice.”*

Pope Boniface VIII, Unam Sanctam, Nov. 18, 1302, ex cathedra:

“With Faith urging us we are forced to believe and to hold the one, holy, Catholic Church and that, apostolic, and we firmly believe and simply confess this Church outside of which there is no salvation nor remission of sin… Furthermore, we declare, say, define, and proclaim to every human creature that they by absolute necessity for salvation are entirely subject to the Roman Pontiff.”[ii]

Pope Clement V, Council of Vienne, Decree # 30, 1311-1312, ex cathedra:

“Since however there is for both regulars and seculars, for superiors and subjects, for exempt and non-exempt, one universal Church, outside of which there is no salvation, for all of whom there is one Lord, one faith, and one baptism…”[iii]

Pope Eugene IV, Council of Florence, Sess. 8, Nov. 22, 1439, ex cathedra:

“Whoever wishes to be saved, needs above all to hold the Catholic faith; unless each one preserves this whole and inviolate, he will without a doubt perish in eternity.”[iv]

Pope Eugene IV, Council of Florence, “Cantate Domino,” 1441, ex cathedra:

“The Holy Roman Church firmly believes, professes and preaches that all those who are outside the Catholic Church, not only pagans but also Jews or heretics and schismatics, cannot share in eternal life and will go into the everlasting fire which was prepared for the devil and his angels, unless they are joined to the Church before the end of their lives; that the unity of this ecclesiastical body is of such importance that only for those who abide in it do the Church’s sacraments contribute to salvation and do fasts, almsgiving and other works of piety and practices of the Christian militia produce eternal rewards; and that nobody can be saved, no matter how much he has given away in alms and even if he has shed blood in the name of Christ, unless he has persevered in the bosom and unity of the Catholic Church*.”[v]

Pope Leo X, Fifth Lateran Council, Session 11, Dec. 19, 1516, ex cathedra:

“For, regulars and seculars, prelates and subjects, exempt and non-exempt, belong to the one universal Church, outside of which no one at all is saved, and they all have one Lord and one faith.”[vi]

Pope Pius IV, Council of Trent, “Iniunctum nobis,” Nov. 13, 1565, ex cathedra: “This true Catholic faith, outside of which no one can be saved… I now profess and truly hold…”[vii]

Pope Benedict XIV, Nuper ad nos, March 16, 1743, Profession of Faith: “This faith of the Catholic Church, without which no one can be saved, and which of my own accord I now profess and truly hold…”[viii]

Pope Pius IX, Vatican Council I, Session 2, Profession of Faith, 1870, ex cathedra: “This true Catholic faith, outside of which none can be saved, which I now freely profess and truly hold…”[ix]

I have addressed this in a previous post.

 

[tester]

Why would you accept such a belief “system”?

why would you accept that the Magisterium authoritively declares that inerrant Scriptures proclaims Magisterium infallibility?

*Now the Bereans were of more noble character than the Thessalonians, for they received the message with great eagerness and examined the Scriptures every day to see if what Paul said was true. *

Or in this case

I received the message with great eagerness and would like to examine the infallible Papal statements every day to see if what the Catholic Church said was true.

Please show me a few more infallible Papal statements so I can *“test everything that is said. Hold on to what is good.” *Thanks -Tester

 

[tester]

I have addressed this in a previous post.

do you mean this?

This is a doctrine of the Church now, as it has always been. There is no salvation for heretics or schismatics until they have repented and returned to the Catholic faith.

Of course, there are those whom are invincibly ignorant, and those who have been baptized in blood or desire.

you must be misunderstanding my question : allow me to rephrase:

Relating to this statement:

**Most **papal and conciliar teachings pertain to the Church’s ordinary teaching authority (magisterium) and are understood as authentic teachings—but not infallible in the sense of Vatican I’s teaching about infallibility.

Were the listed statements part of the “Church’s ordinary teaching authority (magisterium) and are understood as authentic teachings—but not infallible in the sense of Vatican I’s teaching about infallibility” or actully infallible?

in other words; ordinary authoritative or infallible?

 

[mark_a]

Please show me a few more infallible Papal statements so I can *“test everything that is said. Hold on to what is good.” *Thanks -Tester

The infallible teachings about contraception and abortion come to mind, although I don’t know if they actually are from a Pope, councils, or the deposit of faith. They are infallible none the less.

Would you agree that we should “hold on to” them?

 

[tester]

The infallible teachings about contraception and abortion come to mind, although I don’t know if they actually are from a Pope, councils, or the deposit of faith. They are infallible none the less.

Would you agree that we should “hold on to” them?

Vatican I taught that the pope is infallible when, as the Church’s supreme pastor and successor of Peter, he solemnly teaches some revealed truth about faith or morals ex cathedra (“from the chair”). He must intend to teach infallibly and make this known at the time of that teaching.

did the Pope “intend to teach infallibly and make this known at the time of that teaching” ?

 

[mark_a]

did the Pope “intend to teach infallibly and make this known at the time of that teaching” ?

I don’t understand the question.

Your mention of the magisterium a few posts ago seemed to sidetrack from the thread title about Papal infallibility.

Again, I don’t know if these teachings are from the pope, councils, etc. But keep in mind that papal infallibility comes from the Church, not vice versa.

 

[tester]

I don’t understand the question.

Your mention of the magisterium a few posts ago seemed to sidetrack from the thread title about Papal infallibility.

Again, I don’t know if these teachings are from the pope, councils, etc. But keep in mind that papal infallibility comes from the Church, not vice versa.

From post # 3 that is making the distinction of what actually is an infallible statement and what is just authoritative teaching

 

[Bob_Crowley]

ligonier.org/blog/sola-scriptura-bible/
-from R.C. Sproul, Jr.

*I would be quite content to add as a second infallible and inerrant authority the ancient creeds of the church under the following conditions. First, those who gathered to formulate these creeds would need to have their message authenticated by miraculous works. Let them raise men from the dead. Second, we must add those creeds to our Bibles. If both sources are equally authoritative, why do we separate them? In like manner, I’d be content to add as a second infallible and inerrant authority the statements of the Pope when He speaks ex cathedra. First, however, let him raise men from the dead. Second, let us add his words, assuming he would even tell us what they were, to our canon.

**But wait, there’s more. I want an authoritative list, in both instances of what these messages are. Ask someone Orthodox to show you exactly where you can read their infallible tradition and you will receive slippery ooze. Ask someone Roman Catholic for a list of infallible papal or consiliar statements, and you will receive the same. ***

forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=110888

So if the Catholic Church gave us the “table of contents” for our Bible, determined what writings were the inerrant Word of God, and gave us the list of books for Canon of Scripture; can it provide a list of infallible Papal statements?

Has the infallible Magisterium provided a list of infallible Papal statements?
If yes: then please provide the list:
If no: then why not?

As a former Protestant, I’m not keen on the “infallibility” of the Pope doctrine, since all it does is put up another barrier to eventual church reunification.

However if you are a Protestant, then why do you trust the Bible, since, as you say, “the Catholic Church gave us the “table of contents” for our Bible, determined what writings were the inerrant Word of God, and gave us the list of books for Canon of Scripture”?

If you don’t trust the Catholic Church’s judgement in that issue, then why do you trust the Bible, since it came to you via the Catholic Church?

 

[tester]

As a former Protestant, I’m not keen on the “infallibility” of the Pope doctrine, since all it does is put up another barrier to eventual church reunification.

However if you are a Protestant, then why do you trust the Bible, since, as you say, “the Catholic Church gave us the “table of contents” for our Bible, determined what writings were the inerrant Word of God, and gave us the list of books for Canon of Scripture”?

If you don’t trust the Catholic Church’s judgement in that issue, then why do you trust the Bible, since it came to you via the Catholic Church?

off topic:

Just looking for the list: So far I have two on it (see post 3 nd 4)

 

[mark_a]

From post # 3 that is making the distinction of what actually is an infallible statement and what is just authoritative teaching

Do you mean this post:

forums.catholic-questions.org/showpost.php?p=7262411&postcount=3

If so, you lost me.

Was the original intent of the thread to point out previous supposedly infallible papal statements where the Church has supposedly backtracked or weasled? Or was it a question of Papal vs council vs deposit of faith vs . . . . . .infalllibility.

I’m just trying to clarify.

ps-
Your profile lists you as protestant. Why the vagueness? You know I’m Catholic, why can’t I know your religion?

 

[Irish_Polock]

do you mean this?

you must be misunderstanding my question : allow me to rephrase:

Relating to this statement:

Were the listed statements part of the “Church’s ordinary teaching authority (magisterium) and are understood as authentic teachings—but not infallible in the sense of Vatican I’s teaching about infallibility” or actully infallible?

in other words; ordinary authoritative or infallible?

For your understanding of the Holy Mother Churches Magisterium. I hope this helps, I can revisit this subject if there is any further ambiguity:

columbia.edu/cu/augustine/arch/jyoung.html

 

[Bob_Crowley]

off topic:

Just looking for the list: So far I have two on it (see post 3 nd 4)

It’s quite on topic actually. By quoting RC Sproul’s criticism of the Catholic interpretation of Infaillibility, you leave yourself open to the parallel question - why do you regard the Scriptures as “infallible” if they were compiled by the Catholic Church?

Either you accept the authority of the Catholic Church or you don’t. If you don’t, then the Scriptures themselves have no authority, since it was the Catholic Church which declared them inspired.

 

[joe370]

Hey Tester…

So if the Catholic Church gave us the “table of contents” for our Bible, determined what writings were the inerrant Word of God, and gave us the list of books for Canon of Scripture; can it provide a list of infallible Papal statements?

Has the infallible Magisterium provided a list of infallible Papal statements?
If yes: then please provide the list:
If no: then why not?
Reply With Quote

I, so far, have discovered 4 instances of the Pope speaking ex cathedra, but I know you are looking for every instance of the Magisterium speaking infallibly, and I will start doing what everyone else has been doing, which is, attempting to find said list by googling it and then getting back with you.

The teachings which a catholic is bound to accept are not limited to just those that carry the charism of infallibility. For example, the doctrine that Jesus rose bodily from the dead has not yet been defined infallibly, but it does not follow that catholics are free to reject this infallible doctrine! If you really want to to know, maybe you could get a book called: the gift of infallibility; I am gonna get it; it is touted as being the best book regarding the infallibility of the CC and it provides said list. a quote about the book:

• “Bishop Gasser’s relatio at the First Vatican Council is utterly indispensible for understanding the gift of infallibility that Christ bestowed on his Church. Recent controversies as well as statements from the magisterium show the enduring importance of Gasser’s relation. The Gift of Infallibility belongs on the bookshelf of every serious student of ecclesiology.” *

ignatius.com/Products/GOI-P/the-gift-of-infallibility.aspx

By the way, do you think that the CC determined what writings were the inerrant Word of God, and that they gave us the list of books for Canon of Scripture? In other words, the table of contents?

Do you think that the Church founded by Jesus was and is, forever protected by God, from error? If so, then how, and which church?

One thing is for certain: The Pope has always consulted with the ordinary and universal Magisterium of the Bishops throughout the Church before making any pronouncements ex cathedra. The pope can also make infallible statements that recognize doctrines as having been taught infallibly by the ordinary and universal Magisterium of the Bishops dispersed throughout the world and that book would probably be your best bet for knowing, with certainty, how many times the Pope/Magisterium has spoken infallibly, be it extraordinary or ordinary. If however, you do not believe what you read in said book (12 dollars for the book) - then I don’t see the point of buying the book. If you do not believe the following then again, I don’t see the point in wasting your 12 dollars:

“The Roman Pontiff, head of the college of bishops, enjoys this infallibility in virtue of his office, when, as supreme pastor and teacher of all the faithful – who confirms his brethren in the faith – he proclaims by a definitive act a doctrine pertaining to faith or morals.” Catechism of the Catholic Church

I can only say, with certainty, the various ways in which something can be known infallibly, which includes the following, and I will attempt to provide said list by doing exactly what you would do; googling it:

1. an ex cathedra proclamation by the Pope.
2. A definition of an ecumenical council.
3. A doctrine that has been taught infallibly by the ordinary and
   universal Magisterium of the Bishops dispersed throughout the world
   who are in communion with the Successor of Peter.

 

[joe370]

Tester, why would you accept that the bible is infallible considering the fact that the CC decided what should be in it and what should not be in it? You do not believe that the Magisterium of the CC can infallibly discern truth so why believe that they infallibly discerned truth regarding the correct inclusion of books in the bible as well as the correct exclusion of books from the bible?

why would you accept that the Magisterium authoritively declares that inerrant Scriptures proclaims Magisterium infallibility?

*Now the Bereans were of more noble character than the Thessalonians, for they received the message with great eagerness and examined the Scriptures every day to see if what Paul said was true. *

Or in this case

I received the message with great eagerness and would like to examine the infallible Papal statements every day to see if what the Catholic Church said was true.

Please show me a few more infallible Papal statements so I can *“test everything that is said. Hold on to what is good.” *Thanks -Tester

 

[joe370]

Tester, if they are from the chair, and they appear to be (I will look into it) - then yes, they are infallible declarations. Of course these proclamations apply only to those who have been lucky enough to be exposed to the teachings of the CC, and decided to reject said proclamations. Jesus is not going to send someone to hell who was never raised to be a Christian belonging to the CC, or someone who never even heard of Christianity. If that were the case then I would never be a Christian because a loving God would never punish someone who was totally ignorant of truth. That would be like saying: all those people that lived in America for hundreds of years, before Columbus discovered America, are in hell. Silly…

I want to know exactly are the below statements infallible or
"Various people have gone backwards from 1870 and sometimes* inaccurately labeled various statements as infallible***."

Pope Innocent III, Fourth Lateran Council, Constitution 1, 1215, ex cathedra: “There is indeed one universal Church of the faithful, outside of which nobody at all is saved, in which Jesus Christ is both priest and sacrifice.”*

Pope Boniface VIII, Unam Sanctam, Nov. 18, 1302, ex cathedra:

“With Faith urging us we are forced to believe and to hold the one, holy, Catholic Church and that, apostolic, and we firmly believe and simply confess this Church outside of which there is no salvation nor remission of sin… Furthermore, we declare, say, define, and proclaim to every human creature that they by absolute necessity for salvation are entirely subject to the Roman Pontiff.”[ii]

Pope Clement V, Council of Vienne, Decree # 30, 1311-1312, ex cathedra:

“Since however there is for both regulars and seculars, for superiors and subjects, for exempt and non-exempt, one universal Church, outside of which there is no salvation, for all of whom there is one Lord, one faith, and one baptism…”[iii]

Pope Eugene IV, Council of Florence, Sess. 8, Nov. 22, 1439, ex cathedra:

“Whoever wishes to be saved, needs above all to hold the Catholic faith; unless each one preserves this whole and inviolate, he will without a doubt perish in eternity.”[iv]

Pope Eugene IV, Council of Florence, “Cantate Domino,” 1441, ex cathedra:

“The Holy Roman Church firmly believes, professes and preaches that all those who are outside the Catholic Church, not only pagans but also Jews or heretics and schismatics, cannot share in eternal life and will go into the everlasting fire which was prepared for the devil and his angels, unless they are joined to the Church before the end of their lives; that the unity of this ecclesiastical body is of such importance that only for those who abide in it do the Church’s sacraments contribute to salvation and do fasts, almsgiving and other works of piety and practices of the Christian militia produce eternal rewards; and that nobody can be saved, no matter how much he has given away in alms and even if he has shed blood in the name of Christ, unless he has persevered in the bosom and unity of the Catholic Church*.”[v]

Pope Leo X, Fifth Lateran Council, Session 11, Dec. 19, 1516, ex cathedra:

“For, regulars and seculars, prelates and subjects, exempt and non-exempt, belong to the one universal Church, outside of which no one at all is saved, and they all have one Lord and one faith.”[vi]

Pope Pius IV, Council of Trent, “Iniunctum nobis,” Nov. 13, 1565, ex cathedra: “This true Catholic faith, outside of which no one can be saved… I now profess and truly hold…”[vii]

Pope Benedict XIV, Nuper ad nos, March 16, 1743, Profession of Faith: “This faith of the Catholic Church, without which no one can be saved, and which of my own accord I now profess and truly hold…”[viii]

Pope Pius IX, Vatican Council I, Session 2, Profession of Faith, 1870, ex cathedra: “This true Catholic faith, outside of which none can be saved, which I now freely profess and truly hold…”[ix]

 

[agbasinger]

Tester, I read your link by R.C. Sproul. I think it’s a cop out. At least he admits, “The Bible does not have specific text that suggests that the Bible alone is our final authority in all matters of faith and practice”. But if Sola Scriptura is to believed wouldn’t it, by definition, be in Scripture?

I’m suprised people missed this gem.

 

[oneGODoneCHURCH]

I want to know exactly are the below statements infallible or
"Various people have gone backwards from 1870 and sometimes* inaccurately labeled various statements as infallible***."

Pope Innocent III, Fourth Lateran Council, Constitution 1, 1215, ex cathedra: “There is indeed one universal Church of the faithful, outside of which nobody at all is saved, in which Jesus Christ is both priest and sacrifice.”*

Pope Boniface VIII, Unam Sanctam, Nov. 18, 1302, ex cathedra:

“With Faith urging us we are forced to believe and to hold the one, holy, Catholic Church and that, apostolic, and we firmly believe and simply confess this Church outside of which there is no salvation nor remission of sin… Furthermore, we declare, say, define, and proclaim to every human creature that they by absolute necessity for salvation are entirely subject to the Roman Pontiff.”[ii]

Pope Clement V, Council of Vienne, Decree # 30, 1311-1312, ex cathedra:

“Since however there is for both regulars and seculars, for superiors and subjects, for exempt and non-exempt, one universal Church, outside of which there is no salvation, for all of whom there is one Lord, one faith, and one baptism…”[iii]

Pope Eugene IV, Council of Florence, Sess. 8, Nov. 22, 1439, ex cathedra:

“Whoever wishes to be saved, needs above all to hold the Catholic faith; unless each one preserves this whole and inviolate, he will without a doubt perish in eternity.”[iv]

Pope Eugene IV, Council of Florence, “Cantate Domino,” 1441, ex cathedra:

“The Holy Roman Church firmly believes, professes and preaches that all those who are outside the Catholic Church, not only pagans but also Jews or heretics and schismatics, cannot share in eternal life and will go into the everlasting fire which was prepared for the devil and his angels, unless they are joined to the Church before the end of their lives; that the unity of this ecclesiastical body is of such importance that only for those who abide in it do the Church’s sacraments contribute to salvation and do fasts, almsgiving and other works of piety and practices of the Christian militia produce eternal rewards; and that nobody can be saved, no matter how much he has given away in alms and even if he has shed blood in the name of Christ, unless he has persevered in the bosom and unity of the Catholic Church*.”[v]

Pope Leo X, Fifth Lateran Council, Session 11, Dec. 19, 1516, ex cathedra:

“For, regulars and seculars, prelates and subjects, exempt and non-exempt, belong to the one universal Church, outside of which no one at all is saved, and they all have one Lord and one faith.”[vi]

Pope Pius IV, Council of Trent, “Iniunctum nobis,” Nov. 13, 1565, ex cathedra: “This true Catholic faith, outside of which no one can be saved… I now profess and truly hold…”[vii]

Pope Benedict XIV, Nuper ad nos, March 16, 1743, Profession of Faith: “This faith of the Catholic Church, without which no one can be saved, and which of my own accord I now profess and truly hold…”[viii]

Pope Pius IX, Vatican Council I, Session 2, Profession of Faith, 1870, ex cathedra: “This true Catholic faith, outside of which none can be saved, which I now freely profess and truly hold…”[ix]

I don’t know if these statement are are are not made ex cathedra. I do not knwo if when made the Pope of the council make them had the intent to make an infallible statment. I find them personnally to be so and as a christain /cathoic find them to be also in complete agreement with scripture. It is through the Church we come to Christ and it is only through Christ that we come to the Father so if a person has purpoosly placed themself outside the church, Well I will let you think that one out to it conclusion.

Again just as a single verse from scripture dose not live in a vacume and must be taken in that context of the whole of scpriture you also have to take these statments in the whole of Chruch Dogma and Docturine. Those a person may have seperated themself from the Chruch and started another group those that follow him/her are not nessicarilly outside the Church though they not be in perfect union either.

Tester you are way over think this. My dad, who is a southern baptize deacon, will have question from time to time about different teaching of the Church I answer Them to the best of my ability, and he will 98% of the time say I can see that. You will never find a teaching that is contrary to Scipture in the Church. you may find those who practise said teaching to be in conflict with not only scripture , but with the Church and what the teaching reaaly is.

 

[tester]

All quotes from post #3

Not all decisions by each ecumenical council are automatically infallible

A disciplinary decree approved by an ecumenical council can be binding without being declared infallible.

Most papal and conciliar teachings pertain to the Church’s ordinary teaching authority (magisterium) and are understood as authentic teachings—but not infallible in the sense of Vatican I’s teaching about infallibility.

I completely understand that papal statement are authoritative and binding… but that is DIFFERENT from infallible.

But…

Various people have gone backwards from 1870 and sometimes inaccurately labeled various statements as infallible.

Vatican I taught that the pope is infallible when, as the Church’s supreme pastor and successor of Peter, he solemnly teaches some revealed truth about faith or morals ex cathedra (“from the chair”). He must intend to teach infallibly and make this known at the time of that teaching.

Now Joe370 when you say :

Do you think that the Church founded by Jesus was and is, forever protected by God, from error?

Does your use of “protected from error” mean infallible or not?

Joe370>

but I know you are looking for every instance of the Magisterium speaking infallibly,

No I am not looking for EVERY one , 12 to 15 would do.

 

[campeador]

I’m surprised people missed this gem.

Thanks for the bump, singer. shaw: People tend to ignore me.

O Jesus, grant me the grace to desire it.

Litany of Humility

 

[Jim_Dandy]

Any discussion of infallibility should be based on a correct understanding of the doctrine.

ewtn.com/library/DOCTRINE/TRIGINFL.HTM