Liturgia Horarum (post Vatican II)

[kurtmasur]

I’ve been praying the Liturgy of the Hours for 2 years now and this year I’ve felt such a desire for “more” that I decided to make a transition to latin and I now pray the Liturgia Horarum.

I am curious what is the experience here amongst the readers of this forum in regards to praying in Latin? How are you liking it? How fulfilling do you find it compared to the vernacular version?

I’m particularly interested in hearing about experiences with the post-Vatican II Office. (No bias against Traditionalists, but I come upon your experiences with the Breviarium Romanum very often on my Google searches).

 

[bpbasilphx]

If you want “more”, try the Byzantine Office.

Four books needed for just ONE of the hours.

 

[kurtmasur]

If you want “more”, try the Byzantine Office.

Four books needed for just ONE of the hours.

Wow that sounds very interesting. Please elaborate a little more about the Byzantine Office.

Although I have no intentions in leaving the Roman Rite anytime soon, the subject of the Office facinates me, regardless of rite. And by the way, do you pray the Byzantine Office?

 

[tee_eff_em]

I am curious what is the experience here amongst the readers of this forum in regards to praying in Latin? How are you liking it? How fulfilling do you find it compared to the vernacular version?

I’m particularly interested in hearing about experiences with the post-Vatican II Office. (No bias against Traditionalists, but I come upon your experiences with the Breviarium Romanum very often on my Google searches).

I use the *Liturgia Horarum III *during Lent and Paschaltide, and Scepter Press’s Lauds and Vespers per annum (supplemented by *Christian Prayer *the rest of the year). I like it to exercise my Latin. I don’t really think about it in comparison with the vernacular (at least not in terms of “fulfillment”).

I cannot speak to any comparison with the Brevarium Romanum, which I have neither used nor desired to.

:twocents:
tee

 

[kurtmasur]

I use the *Liturgia Horarum III *during Lent and Paschaltide…

You mean, you use the Liturgia Horarum, Vol. II for Lent and Paschaltide, right? Volume III is for Ordinary Time Weeks 1-17.

And which parts of each Hour do you actually recite in Latin?

 

[Joannm]

I am wondering…are you fluent in Latin? Are you understanding what you are reading or just saying the psalms, prayers and readings in Latin? Does the breivery you are using have the translation in English as well as Latin?

 

[DixitDominus]

I am wondering…are you fluent in Latin? Are you understanding what you are reading or just saying the psalms, prayers and readings in Latin? Does the breivery you are using have the translation in English as well as Latin?

Why would it matter? One need not fully grasp what he is saying to pray well.

 

[kurtmasur]

I am wondering…are you fluent in Latin? Are you understanding what you are reading or just saying the psalms, prayers and readings in Latin? Does the breivery you are using have the translation in English as well as Latin?

Fluent, as in can I hold a conversation in Latin as I would in English? No.

But I am fluent enough to read Latin, like I would read in English. The only problem might be some word here or there I might not know, but these are very minimal.

Since I was already fluent in Spanish, I thought learning Latin wouldn’t be too difficult. So my approach was this: I bought the 4-volume Liturgia Horarum, a self-study Ecclesiastical Latin book (by Collins), and then an Eccl. Latin Dictionary.

From the onset when I began studying from the Collins text, I also decided to begin praying the latin LOTH on a limited basis for practice (only vespers and compline in latin but with the vernacular on hand to help me understand the meaning) and I prayed the rest of the Hours in the vernacular. But as time went on and I eventually finished the Collins book, I began to understand better, and now I pray almost everything in Latin and with very little outside help (I still use the vernacular for the passages in the Office of Readings)

So no, to answer your question if I just read the psalms, prayers, etc. in Latin without understanding… no, I don’t do that. In fact, I don’t think I could ever do that as I would find it pointless doing so. (ironically this could happen to us as well in the vernacular if we just rush along or are not really paying attention to the words before us. One beneficial side effect of Latin is that it forces me to pay attention to what I’m reading).

And as to your other question if there are English translations included, the answer is also no. The books are entirely in Latin.

 

[tee_eff_em]

You mean, you use the Liturgia Horarum, Vol. II for Lent and Paschaltide, right? Volume III is for Ordinary Time Weeks 1-17.

And which parts of each Hour do you actually recite in Latin?

Ummm, yes. (I blame that darn sticky I-key )

I do read Latin fluently, and will recite as much as I have available in Latin. During Lent and Easter that can be all of any hour. During other seasons it may be only the psalms and canticles. The *Lauds and Vespers *book has a facing (and unofficial) English translation, which is easy to ignore.

On the other hand, my habit of the hours is pretty spotty. Morning Prayer and the Office of Readings are the easiest for me to make, since I am an early riser and am undistracted by family, but I don’t even do that every day. I am sometimes pleasantly surprised at my own comprehension of the OOR. (Or at least my self-assessment of it – I don’t necessarily go look up a translation to check )

tee

 

[Joannm]

So no, to answer your question if I just read the psalms, prayers, etc. in Latin without understanding… no, I don’t do that. In fact, I don’t think I could ever do that as I would find it pointless doing so. (ironically this could happen to us as well in the vernacular if we just rush along or are not really paying attention to the words before us. One beneficial side effect of Latin is that it forces me to pay attention to what I’m reading).

And as to your other question if there are English translations included, the answer is also no. The books are entirely in Latin.

Thank you for your answer. Yes, I was wondering why someone would pray the hours without being able to understand what they are praying. The psalms are so rich theologically that I would not want to miss what they are saying. I do know what you mean by it could happen that even in English it could happen that one does not really pay attention. Sometimes I find that happening if I am in a rush.

I wish you the best in becoming proficient in latin.

 

[benedictgal]

I’ve been praying the Liturgy of the Hours for 2 years now and this year I’ve felt such a desire for “more” that I decided to make a transition to latin and I now pray the Liturgia Horarum.

I am curious what is the experience here amongst the readers of this forum in regards to praying in Latin? How are you liking it? How fulfilling do you find it compared to the vernacular version?

I’m particularly interested in hearing about experiences with the post-Vatican II Office. (No bias against Traditionalists, but I come upon your experiences with the Breviarium Romanum very often on my Google searches).

I gave my parochial vicar the Liturgy of the Hours in Latin, which he has enjoyed. As I am typing this post, I am listening to a broadcast of the Liturgy of the Hours from Vatican Radio. it is being chanted in Latin by, I believe the Sistene Chapel Choir. A young man is leading the chanting right now. Interestingly enough, the reading from Genesis was in English, but, the rest of the chants have been in Latin.

What i enjoy listening to during the day is the Office (in Latin) on Vatican Radio. Inasmuch as there is a seven-hour time difference, it is very relaxking to listen to this at work. It’s as though my productivity level goes up listening to the Office. Evening prayer is about 10AM Texas time; night prayer is at 4PM Texas tme and Morning Prayer is at 11PM Texas time. Interestingly enough, the invocations that I am listening to right now are in English, but the respnses are in Latin. Now, they are chanting the Pater Noster in Latin and the final blessing is in Latin.

If you have a chance, you might want to give this a listen. I am erally enjoying praying this, even though it’s on the radio and several time zones away.

 

[kurtmasur]

I gave my parochial vicar the Liturgy of the Hours in Latin, which he has enjoyed. As I am typing this post, I am listening to a broadcast of the Liturgy of the Hours from Vatican Radio. it is being chanted in Latin by, I believe the Sistene Chapel Choir. A young man is leading the chanting right now. Interestingly enough, the reading from Genesis was in English, but, the rest of the chants have been in Latin.

What i enjoy listening to during the day is the Office (in Latin) on Vatican Radio. Inasmuch as there is a seven-hour time difference, it is very relaxking to listen to this at work. It’s as though my productivity level goes up listening to the Office. Evening prayer is about 10AM Texas time; night prayer is at 4PM Texas tme and Morning Prayer is at 11PM Texas time. Interestingly enough, the invocations that I am listening to right now are in English, but the respnses are in Latin. Now, they are chanting the Pater Noster in Latin and the final blessing is in Latin.

If you have a chance, you might want to give this a listen. I am erally enjoying praying this, even though it’s on the radio and several time zones away.

Actually, I forgot to mention that I actually sing the Liturgy of the Hours (in latin) rather than just reciting it. And yes, I chant along with these broadcasts from Vatican Radio. I’ve been using that since March of this year and it has been a great way to get well acquainted with the proper chant music for the latin LOTH.

Even though their recordings of the LOTH are all in latin, they make a small exception by saying the short biblical reading and the intercessions in a designated vernacular language, depending on the day of the week. Languages used are typically English, Spanish, Italian, French, German and even Polish. And they actually make an “exception” to this exception and say even these 2 parts in latin on both Sunday vespers.

For those interested: radiovaticana.org/en1/on_demand.asp?gr=ltg