If he “*just holds them in front of him,” *it sounds as if the chalice and host are in fact “elevated” - they’re elevated off the altar - just not held as high as you think they should be. Is that’s what happenning? Does the GIRM prescribe a specific height for the elevation?
- The Gloria is omitted
- The priest doesn’t elevate either the chalice or host during the consecration; he just holds them in front of him
I think you have it. As I recall it requires that they be lifted for the people to see. * I think chest high is a common standard; it is comfortable and the people can see that they are raised.If he “*just holds them in front of him,” *it sounds as if the chalice and host are in fact “elevated” - they’re elevated off the altar - just not held as high as you think they should be. Is that’s what happenning? Does the GIRM prescribe a specific height for the elevation?
That’s the question the OP asked. Not me. Read the whole Thread. So, no I have no idea why the Mass she attended was like that.Digger"its in the GIRM"domer, can you elaborate on understanding why the Gloria is omitted and why the priest doesn’t elevate at this particular parish?
Why would a priest not want to do this along with the fact that it is required and he has taken the vow of obedience?Help understand what?
As I said in my last post, often it’s not a question of the priest not wanting to lift Him high, it’s a question of their being physically incapable of it.Why would a priest not want to show Him and raise Him high for all to see and proclaim in one accord what He has done for us? God Bless
I was not being evasive. I sincerely thought that was the best thing to do, as others have already pointed out relevant references (like the GIRM that you always bring up).I have read the whole thread and wondered why you chose to be so evasive in your advice. Perhaps you would benefit by reading Redemptionis Sacramentum. I also recommend Pope Benedict’s “Spirit of the Liturgy”
Although, during the last Masses that Pope John Paul II publicly celebrated, he still managed to do the elevation of the sacred species; granted, it was not very high, but, he still made the effort. Pope Benedict, at 82, still does a high elevation.As I said in my last post, often it’s not a question of the priest not wanting to lift Him high, it’s a question of their being physically incapable of it.
Lots of people, especially older folks, have arthritis or other physical ills, and simply can’t lift even their empty hands to shoulder height, let alone use them to lift other objects.
Chalices, I’m told, are often very heavily weighted at the base so that they can’t be easily knocked over or spilled, which adds a great deal to the difficulty factor.
All of which is why you need to charitably ask questions, rather than simply assume that priests don’t do the elevation because they don’t want to.
It seems you cite the GIRM when it suits your argument and ignore it when it doesn’t. The Gloria is part of the Sunday liturgy; omitting it is not allowed. What part of that isn’t clear and easily understood? Taking liberties with the liturgy is not allowed; it is not one’s personal toy. The Church has given us clear direction on what to do in cases of liturgical abuse.I was not being evasive. I sincerely thought that was the best thing to do, as others have already pointed out relevant references (like the GIRM that you always bring up).
I was not ignoring the GIRM. How about sticking with what the OP asked and stop asking/accusing me of things I’ve never said or done on this thread? Thanks.It seems you cite the GIRM when it suits your argument and ignore it when it doesn’t. The Gloria is part of the Sunday liturgy; omitting it is not allowed. What part of that isn’t clear and easily understood? Taking liberties with the liturgy is not allowed; it is not one’s personal toy. The Church has given us clear direction on what to do in cases of liturgical abuse.
I think you’ve put your finger on the main issue, Phemie.Our priest omits the Gloria at the anticipated Sunday Mass. I’ve given up asking him anything because it just annoys him and he always justifies his actions. Not that some are justifiable (sitting down and letting EMHCs distribute although because ‘it’s their ministry and I let them do it’) but justify he does.
The Penitential Rite does not include the Gloria, and the Gloria is not omitted when another liturgical act directly precedes Mass.the Penitential Rite is omitted, which includes the Gloria.
When the Rite of Acceptance is done it goes immediatly from the rite to the procession to the Liturgy of the Word, no Penitential Rite, Gloria or Opening Prayer is done (the prayer of the priest over the Catechumens becomes the Opening Prayer). We also have gone straight to the Liturgy of the Word when we have a baptism at Mass.The Penitential Rite does not include the Gloria, and the Gloria is not omitted when another liturgical act directly precedes Mass.
Upon conferring with The Rites, I see you are correct. I was basing my conclusion on other instructions which say that when the Liturgy of the Hours precedes the Mass, everything up to the Penitential Rite is omitted, and the Mass begins with the Gloria. (GILH 94, 95, 98) But the specific arrangement of the Introductory Rites depends on the liturgical rite preceding the Mass, as per GIRM 46: “In certain celebrations that are combined with Mass according to the norms of the liturgical books, the Introductory Rites are omitted or performed in a particular way.”When the Rite of Acceptance is done it goes immediatly from the rite to the procession to the Liturgy of the Word, no Penitential Rite, Gloria or Opening Prayer is done (the prayer of the priest over the Catechumens becomes the Opening Prayer). We also have gone straight to the Liturgy of the Word when we have a baptism at Mass.