Liturgical Abuses vs Anger - Which is the greater sin?

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We Catholics have the right to a Mass said properly, by ‘the rules’, without anyone claiming it as their own ceremony and instituting personal changes to it.

The Mass belongs to no single priest, no single Bishop, no single diocese. The Mass belongs to the Church. This is something that Archbishop Sheen preached, and is a very orthodox position. His case has been sent to Rome for canonization, so the priest who preaches against being overly concerned with rules, well… I’ll take the Archbishop’s opinion over his.

That said, I think while it is easy to get angry, it is easy to get too angry where you venture into sin. Leaving the Mass is leaving Christ, and unless it was an invalid (TRULY INVALID) Mass, I would counsel against doing it. Consider that staying and bearing that cross for the hour is suffering for Christ. Offer it up! Now, there’s no need to return, or no need to feel like you cannot speak up, but do so in love.

Like all advice, it is easier said than done. I have started seeing the ‘wrong doers’ as victims of the evil one, suffering perhaps from pride… It makes it easier for me not to get all pissy about it, and to pray for them. I hope that doesn’t sound arrogant, but I’ve found that nothing else really works for me!
 
James0235 said:
Liturgical Abuse is a grave sin. If there is full knowledge and full intent as well then it is a mortal sin.

The problem is that even though it is a grave sin (possibly a mortal sin) on the part of the priest it does not only affect the priest but everyone at the Mass.

For abuses “contribute to the obscuring of the Catholic faith and doctrine concerning this wonderful sacrament”.
Redemptionis Sacramentum 6

For the Sacred Liturgy is quite intimately connected with principles of doctrine, so that the use of unapproved texts and rites necessarily leads either to the attenuation or to the disappearance of that necessary link between the lex orandi and the lex credendi.
Redemptionis Sacramentum 10

This occurred above all because in many places celebrations were not faithful to the prescriptions of the new Missal, but the latter actually was understood as authorizing or even requiring creativity, which frequently led to deformations of the liturgy which were hard to bear. I am speaking from experience, since I too lived through that period with all its hopes and its confusion. And I have seen how arbitrary deformations of the liturgy caused deep pain to individuals totally rooted in the faith of the Church.
Pope Benedict’s Explanatory Letter to Bishops on Summorum Pontificum

So, in my opinion, any anger felt because of Liturgical Abuses in most likely righteous anger. You are not the one doing any wrong or committing any sin when you get angry at these things.

James
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James I largely agree that it is possible to experience anger and be justified about it…

The only thing that I think I would qualify is giving oneself over to it and allowing it to hold sway.

I was entertaining a priest friend of mine who was in town yesterday and I wanted him to see the Josephinum. He is a formator for his order, so seminaries are right up his alley. There was a Mass open to the public that we we attended and afterwards he and I - cut of the same cloth on our liturgical and archetechtural opinions - were taking in the chapel which was, to be polite, rather innovatively stripped down somewhat a few years ago. Talking quietly Father was trying to find the good to praise it and he noted just loud enough for another young man to hear “Well I am glad the old tabernacle was kept and is centrally located - it really is beautiful!”

The young man (also a visitor) turns to us with this real subdued look of rage and says “Disgusting isn’t it? Absolutely ruined! Might as well be a barn”

Well Father and I weren’t thrilled about the state of things… but we also couldn’t overlook that the fact that the seminary population is hovering around 195-ish and has doubled in the last decade to be the largest it has been in decades…

Having just been to Mass, being surrounded by some healthy all-American young men studying to give their life to the Church as priests, and having just sat in a Mass that was SRO… This guy was just angry and disgusted.

We can’t be tempted to letting the anger turn into that. Not in this time of good news coming our way left and right. I still see a lot of it left over from years of abuse and decay leaving some people so jaded that I think some can’t even see the growth and the good where it is happening anymore. They are so predisposed to the anger, it eats them.

To be clear, I am no fan of the abuses - they are unjustifiable. When we see them, we have to train ourselves to pray more fervantly for those that commit them.
 
Quaere_Verum said:
When I see liturgical abuses it makes me angry and steals my peace during Mass. I decided a while back that if the abuses are not severe affecting the integrity of the Mass that I would try to pray for change, speak up if necessary, remember that the majority of people commiting the abuses are not intending to undermine the Church, and try to remain at peace during Mass. After all which would Satan find more victory in - a minor abuse (maybe not the best word; maybe innovation is a better word) or my extreme anger pulling me away from focusing on Our Lord’s great sacrifice?

Any thoughts?
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I think some people are obsessed with their definition of “Liturgical Abuse” to the point of distraction from the Mass.

One of the negative side effects of my participation on CAF, is that now whenever I go to Mass I catch myself concentrating on non-issues like whether or not I face the right way when genuflecting during Stations of the Cross, or every little detail that goes on at the altar during Mass.

I am quite irritated by this. I used to enjoy Mass, wherever I was. It really bothers me that there are people in the pews around me who are constantly looking for a reason to be offended by something they witnessed at that particular Mass.

I am NOT responsible for any Liturgical Abuse that may be committed during a Mass…however, I AM responsible for my anger and distraction, regardless of what latin term or derivative used.

I’m quite convinced that those people who go to Mass and go home shrieking as to what abuses they think they’ve witnessed, really need to reflect on their reason for attending Mass in the first place.
 
mlchance said:
Precisely, and in the same context as noting that one commits murder will be subject to judgment. “You have heard that it was said to your ancestors, ‘You shall not kill; and whoever kills will be liable to judgment.’ But I say to you, whoever is angry with his brother will be liable to judgment…”

– Mark L. Chance.
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  1. Jesus, in anger, cleansed the temple. With a whip.
  2. St. Paul said, “Be angry, but do not sin.”
  3. St. Paul’s while letter to the Galatians is an angry letter against the Judaizers, such that he doesn’t even give a greeting at the beginning.
  4. St. Paul’s second half of 2 Corinthians is a vicious attack on his detractors.
Are they both guilty of a sin equivalent to murder?
 
Quaere_Verum said:
When I see liturgical abuses it makes me angry and steals my peace during Mass. I decided a while back that if the abuses are not severe affecting the integrity of the Mass that I would try to pray for change, speak up if necessary, remember that the majority of people commiting the abuses are not intending to undermine the Church, and try to remain at peace during Mass. After all which would Satan find more victory in - a minor abuse (maybe not the best word; maybe innovation is a better word) or my extreme anger pulling me away from focusing on Our Lord’s great sacrifice?

Any thoughts?
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I think you take a wise approach. I try to do the same myself for my own peace of mind. The serenity prayer is a helpful one for me.
 
Brother_John said:
One of the negative side effects of my participation on CAF, is that now whenever I go to Mass I catch myself concentrating on non-issues like whether or not I face the right way when genuflecting during Stations of the Cross, or every little detail that goes on at the altar during Mass.
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I’ve experienced this, too. It’s the main reason why I don’t hold hands during the Our Father anymore. (Unless someone is obviously offering their hand to me…)

Ironically, I’ve defended the hand-holding practice here as not being uniformly distracting. Now I find it way too distracting, but only because of all the arguments I’ve participated in.

You just have to figure out how to seperate the nitpicking here from your spirituality at mass. If you can’t, you have no choice but to avoid certain sub-forums entirely.
 
The quite different posts show that there are different kinds of anger, some guiltless and some not. Personally, though, if it was disruptive to my spiritual life, I would go to another parish.
 
What emotion was Jesus showing in the cleansing of the temple. There were abuses going on there, and He made known what God thought about abuses in His house. I would wager Christ would act similarly to abuses in His house now.
 
pjn6444 said:
What emotion was Jesus showing in the cleansing of the temple. There were abuses going on there, and He made known what God thought about abuses in His house. I would wager Christ would act similarly to abuses in His house now.
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Jesus in the temple is getting to be a tired one. There’s plenty of examples of his kindness and compassion as well…

How about, “Let the first among you without sin…”

:rolleyes:
 
Brother_John said:
Jesus in the temple is getting to be a tired one. There’s plenty of examples of his kindness and compassion as well…
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But the fact remains: He became violently angry. And you have not addressed it. It’s just tired because you haven’t said anything about it.
 
Brother_John said:
got your stones ready? 👍
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Since the Church Herself states we are bound to do all in our power to clean up the abuses — seems you are in conflict with the Church.

vatican.va/roman_curia/congregations/ccdds/documents/rc_con_ccdds_doc_20040423_redemptionis-sacramentum_en.html

[183.] In an altogether particular manner, let everyone do all that is in their power to ensure that the Most Holy Sacrament of the Eucharist will be protected from any and every irreverence or distortion and that all abuses be thoroughly corrected. This is a most serious duty incumbent upon each and every one, and all are bound to carry it out without any favouritism.

[184.] Any Catholic, whether Priest or Deacon or lay member of Christ’s faithful, has the right to lodge a complaint regarding a liturgical abuse to the diocesan Bishop or the competent Ordinary equivalent to him in law, or to the Apostolic See on account of the primacy of the Roman Pontiff.[290] It is fitting, however, insofar as possible, that the report or complaint be submitted first to the diocesan Bishop. This is naturally to be done in truth and charity.
 
porthos11 said:
Yes I do. But the only stones I have are those granted to me by Redemptionis Sacramentum.

Gosh, I hate pacifism.
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Anyone who knows me personally, knows that I’m anything BUT a “Pacifist” :rolleyes: :rotfl: :knight2:
 
But back to the OP…😉

I don’t think it’s a matter of which is the greater sin, it’s a matter of them both being a sin, that is if the OPs anger takes away from the appreciation of the mass.

If one is angry (righteous or not) enough about it (them) then:
  1. Leave and go somewhere else
  2. Report it and be at peace.
  3. Ignore it and be at peace.
  4. Do 1) and 2)
Sometimes one cannot help one’s anger, but if you let it work on you, satan has won yet another battle.
 
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