Living as a non-Mormon in Salt Lake City

[Mimi]

ask.metafilter.com/56263/Could-non-Mormons-enjoy-living-in-SLC

I found this web site via a music associated list I’m on & thought I’d pass it along.

 

[Annie_B]

I think that if you are a non-Mormon and you move to SLC you obviously should expect to see a huge LDS influence…If you are not willing to put up with that, then you should not live there. Some people get so upset at the “pervasiveness” of the Mormon church in SLC that they seem to forget it was the Mormons who settled the area and bult SLC…If the Catholics had settled and built SLC then it would probably be heavily influenced by the Catholic Church…

Annie

 

[Lehl]

I would say that if you are non-Mormon and have school-age children, you should NOT seek to live in any predominantly Mormon areas for the sake of your children. Otherwise, it is just plain cruel.

My aunt and uncle both Catholics relocated to Utah. They lived in several areas in Utah and their children had so many school issues that it was very disturbing.

Children want so much to be accepted by their peers. Mormon children in groups exclude…and sometimes at the direction of their parents. Who wants their kids to be the outcast?

Otherwise, the pressure will be on your child directly to go to this or that church function with young Brigham and Ammon. They want to fit in and be included and the next thing you know, you have a kid that wants to convert for the acceptance!

Then you get to be the bad guy and tell them, “No, we’re Catholic.”

Suddenly, all those “friends” dry up and your kid is ostracized and alone again. Mormon “friendship” is conditional.

Yep, all in a day living as a non-Mormon in Utah.

 

[RebeccaJ]

I live in Utah. Yes, there is a large Mormon influence. And depending where you are moving from, it could be quite the culture shock.

Not everything is about Mormonism or being Mormon. We have a good Catholic community here and excellent Catholic schools.

Catholics were here before Mormons. Though a mission was not established until the 1850’s.

Like any place that anyone considers moving to, just come here and check it out.

 

[RebeccaJ]

I would say that if you are non-Mormon and have school-age children, you should NOT seek to live in any predominantly Mormon areas for the sake of your children. Otherwise, it is just plain cruel.

My aunt and uncle both Catholics relocated to Utah. They lived in several areas in Utah and their children had so many school issues that it was very disturbing.

Children want so much to be accepted by their peers. Mormon children in groups exclude…and sometimes at the direction of their parents. Who wants their kids to be the outcast?

Otherwise, the pressure will be on your child directly to go to this or that church function with young Brigham and Ammon. They want to fit in and be included and the next thing you know, you have a kid that wants to convert for the acceptance!

Then you get to be the bad guy and tell them, “No, we’re Catholic.”

Suddenly, all those “friends” dry up and your kid is ostracized and alone again. Mormon “friendship” is conditional.

Yep, all in a day living as a non-Mormon in Utah.

Growing up Mormon, I had a Catholic friend who lived across the street. She dumped me as a friend because I was too goody too shoes. I never associated that to her being Catholic. We later became friends again, but not like we were.

The cruelty of children extends beyond religion. I think they use it as an excuse, if it weren’t religion, it would be the clothes you wear or the people you hang out with.

In high school she got this huge crush on a Mormon boy who wouldn’t date her because she wasn’t Mormon. So she took the 6 Mormon lessongs and got baptized so he would date her. Well, then that wasn’t the problem, not really, he just wasn’t interested. She never was a Mormon. lol.

It is a choice you have to make, get a long with your Mormon neighbors, or not. Mainly though, the Mormons around me don’t socialize with non-Mormons. So if you do move here, I recommend making Catholic or non-Mormon friends. That’s how it is in the land of zion. If you can’t deal with that sort of thing then no I wouldn’t move here.

 

[Annie_B]

I live in Utah. Yes, there is a large Mormon influence. And depending where you are moving from, it could be quite the culture shock.

Not everything is about Mormonism or being Mormon. We have a good Catholic community here and excellent Catholic schools.

Catholics were here before Mormons. Though a mission was not established until the 1850’s.

Like any place that anyone considers moving to, just come here and check it out.

Wow! The Catholics were there first? Did they attempt to settle the area or were they just passing through? This is very interesting!

Annie

 

[rpp]

I live in Utah. Yes, there is a large Mormon influence. And depending where you are moving from, it could be quite the culture shock.

Not everything is about Mormonism or being Mormon. We have a good Catholic community here and excellent Catholic schools.

** Catholics were here before Mormons.** Though a mission was not established until the 1850’s.

Like any place that anyone considers moving to, just come here and check it out.

Referring to the sentence I put in boldface.

Umm… I do not think that is accurate. Bringham young himself is quoted as saying “If any miserable scoundrels come here, cut their throats.”

Mormons established the cities of Salt Lake City and Provo. and settled nearly all of Utah. Mormon “soldiers” kept non-Mormons out of the area, often violently.

A few years later, in the late 1850s, came the famous Mountain Meadows Massacre by Mormons, who had allied with up with local Indians. Disguised at Indians, they attacked a wagon train bound for California. After the pioneers surrendered and were disarmed, the Mormon “soldiers” killed all the adults and children over a certain age then forcibly “adopted” all the children too young to remember their parents. About 120 people were killed, if I recall correctly.

 

[Annie_B]

Referring to the sentence I put in boldface.

Umm… I do not think that is accurate. Bringham young himself is quoted as saying “If any miserable scoundrels come here, cut their throats.”

Mormons established the cities of Salt Lake City and Provo. and settled nearly all of Utah. Mormon “soldiers” kept non-Mormons out of the area, often violently.

A few years later, in the late 1850s, came the famous Mountain Meadows Massacre by Mormons, who had allied with up with local Indians. Disguised at Indians, they attacked a wagon train bound for California. After the pioneers surrendered and were disarmed, the Mormon “soldiers” killed all the adults and children over a certain age then forcibly “adopted” all the children too young to remember their parents. About 120 people were killed, if I recall correctly.

Why bring up the violent history? To provoke? Both Catholics and Mormons have plenty to be ashamed of in their history.

Annie

 

[rpp]

Why bring up the violent history? To provoke? Both Catholics and Mormons have plenty to be ashamed of in their history.

Annie

It was not meant to provide anyone. It was to illustrate that I do not believe that Catholics were in Utah Salt Lake City before Mormons. I referred to the violent history of the establishment of Mormon Utah to demonstrate that non-Mormons were more than merely unwelcome in Mormon Utah, they were in mortal danger.

 

[Alma147]

Wow! The Catholics were there first? Did they attempt to settle the area or were they just passing through? This is very interesting!

Annie

Passing through. Father Silvestre Velez de Escalante came through in 1776 as an early explorer for the Spanish government. A mountain range, national monument and city are all named after him.

Alma

 

[rpp]

Passing through. Father Silvestre Velez de Escalante came through in 1776 as an early explorer for the Spanish government. A mountain range, national monument and city are all named after him.

Alma

Ah. Of course, a missionary priest. Thank you!

 

[Lehl]

It was not meant to provide anyone. It was to illustrate that I do not believe that Catholics were in Utah Salt Lake City before Mormons. I referred to the violent history of the establishment of Mormon Utah to demonstrate that non-Mormons were more than merely unwelcome in Mormon Utah, they were in mortal danger.

Sorry to burst your bubble thinking that Brigham Young “discovered” Utah or was “divinely led” or whatever. But it is well-documented that Catholic priests were in the area well before any Mormons…there is also documentation that a missionary Catholic priest TOLD Brigham Young about the area. So yes-- I suppose you could say that Brigham Young was “divinely led” to Utah, by the Catholics!

On 29 July, 1776, two Franciscan priests, Spaniards, Silvestre Velez de Escalante and Atanazio Dominguez, left Santa Fe, N. Mex., explored portions of Colorado, entered Utah, and were the first white men to look out upon the pleasant waters of Utah Lake. They remained with the Laguna tribe for some days, preaching to them and instructing them in Christian doctrine. Leaving here, 25 Sept. 1776, they continued on through southern Utah; crossed from the east, for the first time by white men, the Grand Canyon of the Colorado, and returned to Santa Fe, 2 January, 1977. They charted the explored lands, described the tribes they had visited the botany of the country, named the rivers and mountains, and bequeathed to us a valuable history of their expedition.

It was Father Pierre Jean de Smet that is credited with advising Brigham Young about Salt Lake City. It’s on your own Utah history page!

history.utah.gov/apps/markers/detailed_results.php?markerid=1696

PIERRE- JEAN DE SMET Priest of the Society of Jesus 1801 - 1873 Courageous Missionary to the American Indians 1838 - 1868 Father De Smet became well acquainted with the region of this Great Salt Lake and gave much valuable information to Brigham Young and the Mormon Pioneers while they were at Winter Quarters, Nebraska, in November 1846.

Here is more information:

UTAH—THE DIOCESE OF SALT LAKE

Although Father DeSmet was not the first Catholic priest to enter Utah, although he left no record of saying Mass in the area, and although neither he nor his fellow Jesuits established an Indian mission in Utah, he did have an impact on the history of the state. Even before he was born, two Franciscan priests, Silvestre Escalante and Atanasio Dominguez, traversed Utah in 1776, searching for a direct route between Santa Fe and Monterey. Their efforts were unsuccessful, but they recorded their travels when they returned to Santa Fe in 1777.

On his way to establish St. Mary’s Mission in 1841, Father DeSmet entered Utah to become the first Catholic priest in the region since Fathers Escalante and Dominguez. But his most important link with the region took place in 1846 when he met Brigham Young and his Mormon followers at their winter camp on the Missouri frontier. In a letter to his nephew in March 1851, Father DeSmet recalled this meeting:

“They had resolved to winter on the threshold of the great desert, and then to move onward into it, to put distance between themselves and their persecutors, without even knowing at the time the goal of their long wanderings, nor the spot where they should once more build for themselves permanent dwellings. They asked me a thousand questions about the regions I had explored and the spot which I have just described pleased them greatly. . . . Was that what determined them? I would not dare assert it. They are there.”

 

[rpp]

Sorry to burst your bubble thinking that Brigham Young “discovered” Utah or was “divinely led” or whatever. But it is well-documented that Catholic priests were in the area well before any Mormons…there is also documentation that a missionary Catholic priest TOLD Brigham Young about the area. So yes-- I suppose you could say that Brigham Young was “divinely led” to Utah, by the Catholics!

It was Father Pierre Jean de Smet that is credited with advising Brigham Young about Salt Lake City. It’s on your own Utah history page!

history.utah.gov/apps/markers/detailed_results.php?markerid=1696

Here is more information:

Cool!

Thank you, Lehl. I appreciate this. Great links and good information.

 

[swariffin]

I live in Utah. Yes, there is a large Mormon influence. And depending where you are moving from, it could be quite the culture shock.

Not everything is about Mormonism or being Mormon. We have a good Catholic community here and excellent Catholic schools.

Catholics were here before Mormons. Though a mission was not established until the 1850’s.

Like any place that anyone considers moving to, just come here and check it out.

Dear Rebecca,

When I visited SLC, the Mormon temple and Brigham Young University long time ago, the city was very very clean. It was very impressive. The people from the Mormon temple who gave us a tour was very polite and friendly, though they only talk about the history of mormonism. Actually, we were there in an unannouce basis, and yet they gave the tour very seriously. For us from SE Asia, Salt Lake City is very impressive and nice. It shows that the community there, are very care about the environment.

 

[xixxvmcm85]

ask.metafilter.com/56263/Could-non-Mormons-enjoy-living-in-SLC

I found this web site via a music associated list I’m on & thought I’d pass it along.

It’s far worse being Black and a resident of Utah.

Even I as a Black MORMON resident often times felt like an outcast.

 

[LilyM]

I think that if you are a non-Mormon and you move to SLC you obviously should expect to see a huge LDS influence…If you are not willing to put up with that, then you should not live there. Some people get so upset at the “pervasiveness” of the Mormon church in SLC that they seem to forget it was the Mormons who settled the area and bult SLC…If the Catholics had settled and built SLC then it would probably be heavily influenced by the Catholic Church…

Annie

Exactly - imagine the reverse, being a Mormon in Rome. It’d be quite difficult, I’d imagine, either way.

 

[RebeccaJ]

Hello swariffin,

Yes, the tours of BYU and the SLC temple would be about nothing but Mormonism.

Here is a recent news story about the Sisters of the Holy Cross.