Long distances marriage ceremony?

[Gordon_Sims]

A friend was telling me about a show he watched about the research stations in Antarctica. This led to a discussion about the various difficulties of living there for a full year. One thing that came up was marriage and how that would be handled for two Catholics. Let’s say they’re there for a full year (or possibly longer). There’s no priest yet they decide to get married. Would a priest be able to perform the wedding remotely?

 

[Phemie]

A friend was telling me about a show he watched about the research stations in Antarctica. This led to a discussion about the various difficulties of living there for a full year. One thing that came up was marriage and how that would be handled for two Catholics. Let’s say they’re there for a full year (or possibly longer). There’s no priest yet they decide to get married. Would a priest be able to perform the wedding remotely?

If there is no priest for a year they can get married by publicly exchanging consent.
Can. 1116 §1. If a person competent to assist according to the norm of law cannot be present or approached without grave inconvenience, those who intend to enter into a true marriage can contract it validly and licitly before witnesses only:
1/ in danger of death;
2/ outside the danger of death provided that it is prudently foreseen that the situation will continue for a month.

 

[Lily_Bernans]

A friend was telling me about a show he watched about the research stations in Antarctica. This led to a discussion about the various difficulties of living there for a full year. One thing that came up was marriage and how that would be handled for two Catholics. Let’s say they’re there for a full year (or possibly longer). There’s no priest yet they decide to get married. Would a priest be able to perform the wedding remotely?

This may be legal in the Catholic Church as the poster above me has shown, but I don’t think any US state would accept it as legal. They would have no valid marriage certificate. Its validity would be determined by how the individual judge interprets the law.

Surely, if two people genuinely love each other and intend to remain together for the rest of their lives, they could wait until they left Antarctica to get married, especially if it were only for a year. If they were there ten or twenty years, I could see it, but not a year. Personally, I don’t know any priest who would perform a marriage ceremony “remotely.” My pastor, and all the other pastors I know, insist that both parties be a member of his parish for one year - no exceptions for any reason.

Good thing it’s a hypothetical!

 

[Antegin]

This may be legal in the Catholic Church as the poster above me has shown, but I don’t think any US state would accept it as legal. They would have no valid marriage certificate. Its validity would be determined by how the individual judge interprets the law.

Surely, if two people genuinely love each other and intend to remain together for the rest of their lives, they could wait until they left Antarctica to get married, especially if it were only for a year. If they were there ten or twenty years, I could see it, but not a year. Personally, I don’t know any priest who would perform a marriage ceremony “remotely.” My pastor, and all the other pastors I know, insist that both parties be a member of his parish for one year - no exceptions for any reason.

Good thing it’s a hypothetical!

My great, great, grandmother was a settler in northern Idaho. Grandma said she told us that missionary priests, Irish missionaries, came from Nevada, braving hostile Mormon territory, every 3-5 yrs to rebaptize the children, bless the graves and say mass. In between these visits, the oldest man, would baptize new borns and the dying, bury the dead and officiate at weddings. We’re talking about the 1870’s.

A lot of this is hard to swallow. A dangerous Mormon? Isn’t that an oxymormon?

And layman officiating at weddings? Would you believe that Can. 1112 §1. says ‘‘Where there is a lack of priests and deacons, the diocesan bishop can delegate lay persons to assist at marriages, with the previous favorable vote of the conference of bishops and after he has obtained the permission of the Holy See.’’

 

[Joe_5859]

If there is no priest for a year they can get married by publicly exchanging consent.
Can. 1116 §1. If a person competent to assist according to the norm of law cannot be present or approached without grave inconvenience, those who intend to enter into a true marriage can contract it validly and licitly before witnesses only:
1/ in danger of death;
2/ outside the danger of death provided that it is prudently foreseen that the situation will continue for a month.

The Church thinks of everything.

 

[dans0622]

No, the Church’s law does *not *consider it possible for a priest to “remotely” assist at a wedding. If a priest is not available, then the couple can marry in the presence of two witnesses, as shown by Phemie. If “remote assistance” was possible, there would be no need for the “extraordinary form” (c. 1116)–the couple could just get on the phone with the priest.

Such a couple could also marry by proxy (cc. 1104-1105).

Dan

 

[Lily_Bernans]

I can understand that happening in the 1870s when people didn’t see a priest or other clergyman for years on end. Common law marriage was instituted for that reason. And because almost no one lives so remotely now, most states have abolished common law marriage.

I can understand the section of Canon Law you quoted since in the sacrament of marriage the ministers of the sacrament are the couple themselves; the priest acts as a witness. Maybe a more compassionate priest than my pastor would agree to remotely witness. I know mine would not. He’s pretty inflexible.

I just think now most states would say, “Wait till you return.” But the states aren’t concerned with what the Church thinks. Sad. I agree with the poster above me: the Church thinks of everything. And that’s good for us!

 

[Mintaka]

And if you absolutely positively have to get married, but you and your beloved aren’t in the same place but a priest is in the same place as one of you, there’s proxy marriage. (You get somebody to give the bride or groom’s vows for them, by the bride or groom’s previous consent. Lots of paperwork and/or witnesses involved.)

No proxy consummation, obviously…

 

[dans0622]

… Surely, if two people genuinely love each other and intend to remain together for the rest of their lives, they could wait until they left Antarctica to get married, especially if it were only for a year. If they were there ten or twenty years, I could see it, but not a year. Personally, I don’t know any priest who would perform a marriage ceremony “remotely.” My pastor, and all the other pastors I know, insist that both parties be a member of his parish for one year - no exceptions for any reason. …

Hello,

Yes, a couple “could” wait but people have a right to marry and it’s obvious that the Church does not want to force couples to wait that long, if they are properly prepared. In light of that, I find the policy you mention to be a heavy-handed (to say the least). I consider myself fortunate that I did not have to navigate such strictures.

Dan

 

[phil19034]

I think there is at least one Protestant church/mission there. If there is, a bishop might grant a dispensation for two Catholics to marry by a Protestant minister.

There is a Russian Orthodox Chapel there and apparently a Catholic Priest from the Air Force visits multi-denominational The Chapel of the Snows on McMurdo base.

Also the Diocese of Christchurch (in New Zealand) has a ministry to Antarctica: chch.catholic.org.nz/?sid=1051

Looks like there are also a few chapels on other bases in Antarctica which are staffed by priests from Chile.

 

[Allegra]

Looks like there are also a few chapels on other bases in Antarctica which are staffed by priests from Chile.

Wow, there literally is nowhere on the planet where you can escape your Sunday obligation these days!

 

[Phemie]

Wow, there literally is nowhere on the planet where you can escape your Sunday obligation these days!

Oh yes, there is. One parish in my diocese sees a priest about 4 times a year: Christmas and Easter, if there is no storm preventing a flight from going in, and once or twice more for a few days at a time.

In fact, it’s one of the parishes where the bishop did appoint a lay person to officiate at a wedding.

 

[Hoosier_Daddy]

My great, great, grandmother was a settler in northern Idaho. Grandma said she told us that missionary priests, Irish missionaries, came from Nevada, braving hostile Mormon territory, every 3-5 yrs to rebaptize the children, bless the graves and say mass. In between these visits, the oldest man, would baptize new borns and the dying, bury the dead and officiate at weddings. We’re talking about the 1870’s.

A lot of this is hard to swallow. A dangerous Mormon? Isn’t that an oxymormon?

And layman officiating at weddings? Would you believe that Can. 1112 §1. says ‘‘Where there is a lack of priests and deacons, the diocesan bishop can delegate lay persons to assist at marriages, with the previous favorable vote of the conference of bishops and after he has obtained the permission of the Holy See.’’

I’ll bet the bulk of your GGG’s story is true but maybe some details were changed…
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roman_Catholic_Diocese_of_Boise

Here is some history on the Diocese of Boise. in 1870s it was a vicariate. It had an appointed person in charge of it. And in northern Idaho it included parts of Wyoming and Montana. You can bet Washington was also involved. As of now the diocese is under the archdiocese of Portland. So there are obvious Oregon ties as well. It also appears San Fran was also involved. Nevada would be hard to imagine being involved with northern Idaho at all. There were certainly closer priests in the north. And the southern part would have indeed been very hostile and Mormon. (no hostile and Mormon are not oxymoronic if you know the history,)

Not to mention the high french influence in the north, most likely from Canada. just look a the names. Coeur d’Alene, Heck even in the southern part of the sate you have Les Bois. (Boise) and Dubois.

Here endeth the history lesson…

 

[Gordon_Sims]

Great answers. I guess that also answers my follow up question about marriages on a hypothetical Mars mission.

 

[Lily_Bernans]

Hello,

Yes, a couple “could” wait but people have a right to marry and it’s obvious that the Church does not want to force couples to wait that long, if they are properly prepared. In light of that, I find the policy you mention to be a heavy-handed (to say the least). I consider myself fortunate that I did not have to navigate such strictures.

Dan

I think the priest’s policy is kind of heavy-handed, too. He even has “no exceptions” after it in bold, italics, and underlined. He seems a kind of heavy-handed priest, but it’s his call to make. I’m just glad I don’t want to get married. Most priests will bend the rules a little. He will not.

 

[phil19034]

Great answers. I guess that also answers my follow up question about marriages on a hypothetical Mars mission.

If/when we humans colonize Mars, there will no longer be just the “Monuments of Mars”… There will be the “Cathedrals of Mars” too!

 

[Digitonomy]

Just for the sake of completeness, from the Code of Canons for Eastern Churches

Canon 832
§1. If one cannot have present or have access to a priest who is competent according to the norm of law without grave inconvenience, those intending to celebrate a true marriage can validly and licitly celebrate it before witnesses alone:
1° in danger of death;
2° outside the danger of death, as long as it is prudently foreseen that such circumstances will continue for a month.
§2. In either case, if another priest, even a non-Catholic one, is able to be present, inasmuch as it is possible he is to be called so that he can bless the marriage, without prejudice for the validity of a marriage in the presence only of the witnesses.
§3. If a marriage was celebrated in the presence only of witnesses, the spouses shall not neglect to receive the blessing of the marriage from a priest as soon as possible.