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I am trying to confirm the existence of a practice among pious Jews of offering a prayer for a girl baby, that she might become the mother of the Messiah. (More detailed post in the Apologetics forum). Anybody ever heard of this, or know of a reference?
 
I am trying to confirm the existence of a practice among pious Jews of offering a prayer for a girl baby, that she might become the mother of the Messiah. (More detailed post in the Apologetics forum). Anybody ever heard of this, or know of a reference?
Rosalind Moss, who used to be with Catholic Answers, mentions this often in her talks and writings. I wonder if there is a way you can ask her?
 
a number of similar assertions are made in the book
The Life of the Blessed Virgin Mary, by Blessed Emmerich
quoted below:

In the great longing which I had, I then received a
multitude of visions of the Blessed Virgin’s ancestors. I must have seen them back to the
fourth or fifth generation. I saw them always as wonderfully pious and simple people
inspired by a quite extraordinary secret longing for the coming of the promised Messias.

The real Essenes were specially concerned with prophetic matters, and their head on
Mount Horeb was often vouchsafed divine revelations in the cave of Elias respecting the
coming of the Messias. He had knowledge of the family from which the mother of the
Messias was to come, and at the time that he gave prophetic advice to the grandparents of
St. Anne in matters of marriage, he saw that the day of the Lord was approaching.

Anna’s steadfast faith was supported by an inmost certainty that the coming of the
Messias was near, and that she herself was among His human relations. She prayed for the
fulfilment of the Promise with loud supplications, and both she and
Joachim were always striving after more perfect purity of life.

The maidservant’s reviling of Sara
(Tob. 3.7) symbolized the reviling by the heathen and by the godless and unbelieving among
the Jews against the expectation of the Messias, for whose coming all God-fearing Jews
were, like Sara, inspired to pray with ever-increasing fervour.

Joseph was very devout and prayed fervently for the coming of the
Messias.

The Blessed Virgin lived with other virgins in the Temple under the care of pious
matrons. The maidens employed themselves with embroidery and other forms of decoration
of carpets and vestments, and also with the cleaning of these vestments and of the vessels
used in the Temple. They had little cells, from which they could see into the Temple, and
here they prayed and meditated. When these maidens were grown up, they were given in
marriage. Their parents in dedicating them to the Temple had offered them entirely to God,
and the devout and more spiritual Israelites had for a long time had a secret presentiment
that the marriage of one of these virgins would one day contribute to the coming of the
promised Messias.

Elisabeth was, however, unable to abandon her expectation, for she had learnt in a
dream that one of her family had become the mother of the promised Messias. She had at
once thought of Mary, had longed to see her, and had in spirit perceived her in the distance
on her way to her.

The Blessed Virgin must have known that she was to bear her child in
Bethlehem, but had been silent out of humility. She knew it from the writings of the
Prophets about the birth of the Messias, all of which she treasured in her little cupboard at
Nazareth. (She had been given them by her women-teachers in the Temple and had been
instructed in them by these holy women. She used to read them very often and pray for their
fulfilment. Her prayers were ever full of yearning for the coming of the Messias; she ever
extolled as blessed her who should bear the holy child, and hoped only to be allowed to
serve her as her lowest maidservant. Never in her humility had she thought that she herself
might be the chosen one.)
 
I checked my copy of The Authorized Daily Prayer Book by Joseph Hertz and although it has prayers to be recited upon smelling fragrant plants, hearing thunder, and seeing a rainbow, there is not one there specifically for the birth of a daughter.

The birth prayer is written with him (her) so that it is used for both a male and female child.
 
I am trying to confirm the existence of a practice among pious Jews of offering a prayer for a girl baby, that she might become the mother of the Messiah. (More detailed post in the Apologetics forum). Anybody ever heard of this, or know of a reference?
Why try to confirm a biased statement to begin with?
Who on earth would want to watch their child suffer that way and even pray for it?
 
The prayers for a boy child that he may be Messiah are part of the bris. The reference I think I recall but cannot confirm is that there was at one time a tradition (possibly Essene?) of a parallel prayer for a girl child. It is not, I think, a currently extant tradition.
 
The prayers for a boy child that he may be Messiah are part of the bris. The reference I think I recall but cannot confirm is that there was at one time a tradition (possibly Essene?) of a parallel prayer for a girl child. It is not, I think, a currently extant tradition.
Let me know what you find. My statement stands that I can not imagine any mother praying to be at the foot of the cross. Willing to accept it if told they were chosen, but pray for it?
 
Let me know what you find. My statement stands that I can not imagine any mother praying to be at the foot of the cross. Willing to accept it if told they were chosen, but pray for it?
It is easy for mothers to focus on the “ruling from the throne of David forever part” and forget the suffering servant part, even if it were clearly spelled out in prophecy, especially if they themselves were suffering at the time.
 
It is easy for mothers to focus on the “ruling from the throne of David forever part” and forget the suffering servant part, even if it were clearly spelled out in prophecy, especially if they themselves were suffering at the time.
The odd thing about this line of thinking is that the term suffering servant is rampant when we think of catholics defining the pope’s role. Of course, Jesus is the suffering servant per the bible. I do not wish to go into or debate the papacy. I have no issue with the catholic view on that role.

I do have issue with some that try very hard to come up with things to buttress their position by looking for evidence that helps their viewpoint rather than looking critically at all evidence in front of them.
 
I do have issue with some that try very hard to come up with things to buttress their position by looking for evidence that helps their viewpoint rather than looking critically at all evidence in front of them.
Since I have not taken a position, nor am I really interested in the topic, simply having done a bit a research in a source I have here that might not be generally available, I am sure you couldn’t be speaking of me.

Besides, since it is generally accepted by theologians and historians alike that the general attitude in Jerusalem at the time of Christ was looking for a conquering king rather than the suffering servant, one would expect the burden of proof to fall upon one claiming otherwise.

Ciao
 
Besides, since it is generally accepted by theologians and historians alike that the general attitude in Jerusalem at the time of Christ was looking for a conquering king rather than the suffering servant, one would expect the burden of proof to fall upon one claiming otherwise.

Ciao
Exactly :cool:
 
Since I have not taken a position, nor am I really interested in the topic, simply having done a bit a research in a source I have here that might not be generally available, I am sure you couldn’t be speaking of me.

Besides, since it is generally accepted by theologians and historians alike that the general attitude in Jerusalem at the time of Christ was looking for a conquering king rather than the suffering servant, one would expect the burden of proof to fall upon one claiming otherwise.

Ciao
Wait up.

The OP is looking for a source that does not exist in mainstream texts or interpretations of.
I am not a Jew, never have been a believer in God. Just to be clear.

The comments I made here are not derogatory to either faith, yet I am scared to recite any history even educated catholics are aware of now.
 
Strawberry-

I hope you’re not afraid to post anything here - surely you’ve been posting here long enough to recognize all the permutations.

Just to clarify - I was asking because I have heard this but did not want to cite it unless I could confirm it. So not really “trying to confirm a biased statement.” More trying to avoid repeating someone else’s mis-statement.

Not entirely incidentally, heard a teaching yesterday (from a Messianic Jew) saying that Jewish scholars at the close of BCE had developed a 2-Messiah theory, Messiah ben David and Messiah ben Joseph, because they couldn’t reconcile all the Messianic prophecies in one person. Another thing I’d need to see documented before I’d cite it - but an interesting assertion.
 
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