Losing Grace/ Mortal Sin and Missing Mass

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Sorry if this has been covered elsewhere, but I have a question regarding missing Mass and mortal sin.

Recently we left Mass early because our toddler was playing up. We were told later that we had not fulfilled our Sunday obligation.

My questions are:
  1. Why is missing Mass on a Sunday (even in part), grave matter along side murder and adultery?
  2. What is meant by “not being in a state of grace”? So if I miss Mass on a Sunday, haven’t thought about confessing it and die in a car wreck on Tuesday, do I go to hell?
  3. If I miss Mass (say being too lazy) and mean to confess it, but the next time confessions are being heard is next Saturday, must I forgo the Eucharist that week?
 
davidarlette said:
Sorry if this has been covered elsewhere, but I have a question regarding missing Mass and mortal sin.

Recently we left Mass early because our toddler was playing up. We were told later that we had not fulfilled our Sunday obligation.

My questions are:
  1. Why is missing Mass on a Sunday (even in part), grave matter along side murder and adultery?
  2. What is meant by “not being in a state of grace”? So if I miss Mass on a Sunday, haven’t thought about confessing it and die in a car wreck on Tuesday, do I go to hell?
  3. If I miss Mass (say being too lazy) and mean to confess it, but the next time confessions are being heard is next Saturday, must I forgo the Eucharist that week?
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In short:
  1. Because failing to attend Mass is breaking the commandment to honour the Sabbath. It’s the most important thing we do on the Sabbath day. It’s one of the ten commandments - a biggie!
I wonder if you’ve been given wrong information though. Firstly you’d have to have missed a pretty substantial chunk of Mass for it to count as ‘missing’ rather than just arriving late or leaving early. How long were you there for, and what portion of the Mass were you present for? Was there another Mass on the Sunday that you could have gone to when your little one calmed down?
  1. and 3. are both yes. Knowingly missing mass is indeed a grave sin, with all that entails. Normally you can make a special appointment with the priest for confession outside of the scheduled times if you’d prefer not to wait.
 
We arrived early at Mass and left after the Homily. I was told (wrongly) that if you heard the Gospel reading you were considered there for Mass.

I must say I find it disturbing that one may have grown in grace a great deal, live a good Christian life but miss one Mass and suffer eternally in hell for it. Doesn’t sound like a loving God to me.:confused:
 
davidarlette said:
We arrived early at Mass and left after the Homily. I was told (wrongly) that if you heard the Gospel reading you were considered there for Mass.

I must say I find it disturbing that one may have grown in grace a great deal, live a good Christian life but miss one Mass and suffer eternally in hell for it. Doesn’t sound like a loving God to me.:confused:
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If you were told this, even though it’s wrong (you shoud be there at least for Communion), then you haven’t done anything wrong, you didn’t know.

And it doesn’t sound like a very loving or committed Christian to me who can’t spare one hour or less on a Sunday to spend time in the house of the Lord who has given us all everything we have.

Always allowing, of course for illness, absolutely necessary work, childcare needs and other good reasons for missing Mass.
 
davidarlette said:
We arrived early at Mass and left after the Homily. I was told (wrongly) that if you heard the Gospel reading you were considered there for Mass.
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No - rather, the absolutely bare minimum of Mass attendance is from the beginning of the Gospel reading until the final Sign of the Cross. You can leave during the recessional, if you’re in a hurry to get somewhere.
I must say I find it disturbing that one may have grown in grace a great deal, live a good Christian life but miss one Mass and suffer eternally in hell for it. Doesn’t sound like a loving God to me.:confused:
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Caring for a small child or a sick person (or being the small child or sick person) is a valid reason for missing Mass. Discuss it with your Confessor before receiving the Eucharist again, but at the same time, don’t fret too much over this.
 
And it doesn’t sound like a very loving or committed Christian to me who can’t spare one hour or less on a Sunday to spend time in the house of the Lord who has given us all everything we have
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Lily M, did you miss the bit about how our toddler was playing up? We didn’t know it was acceptible to sit outside and miss half the Mass anyway and it is still considered that you are there.

It is absolutely rediculous for you to question my commitment to God when you haven’t even read my post properly.

As for being loving: we left Mass because it seemed to be upsetting the people in front of us who kept turning around. We actually were thinking of others, not ourselves. Keep your fingers in check before you start to try pulling specks out of eyes.

jmcrae, thanks. Our Parish is very much "rules are rules"though.
 
davidarlette said:
Lily M, did you miss the bit about how our toddler was playing up? We didn’t know it was acceptible to sit outside and miss half the Mass anyway and it is still considered that you are there.

It is absolutely rediculous for you to question my commitment to God when you haven’t even read my post properly.

As for being loving: we left Mass because it seemed to be upsetting the people in front of us who kept turning around. We actually were thinking of others, not ourselves. Keep your fingers in check before you start to try pulling specks out of eyes.

jmcrae, thanks. Our Parish is very much "rules are rules"though.
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David, did you miss the bits (plural) where I said caring for a child was a legitimate reason to miss mass? 🙂 You were looking to the needs of your child. Caring for him or her. Ergo I wasn’t referring to you, not a bit.
 
The mistake people make I think is they forget to trust in God’s mercy when it comes to sins and image God as a terrible judge whose aim is to send us to the fire as soon as possible.

It is stated somewhere in the catechism perfect contritition without confession for a grave sin is sufficient for salvation, provided one intended before death to confess the sin and seek God’s mercy out of love of God. Fear of hell also produces contritition but imperfect contrition. God does not send someone to hell immediately who is genuinely sorry for their sins (whatever they were) but through no fault of their own, were not able to confess and be absolved before death because confession was unavailable.

This is clearly something for the confessional, but it might have been wise to seek dispensation from communion with your priest beforehand if you felt you could not attend.
 
I should clear a few things up here.

We are new Catholics. We are struggling with keeping our toddler well-behaved during Mass. We went last night and there were other toddlers there. It is the best we have done so far, and yet we spent probably 1/3 of Mass outside between us with our son. We took a toy, books, etc. My wife missed receiving the Eucharist (she had to feed the newborn AND the toddler was playing up). We are trying as many different things as we can.

Lily M, you can see why this early in the thread and considering that I was the OP that it seemed the comment was directed at me.

Greg, we confessed mid-week and I was able to receive Communion last night which was great.🙂
 
davidarlette said:
Sorry if this has been covered elsewhere, but I have a question regarding missing Mass and mortal sin.

Recently we left Mass early because our toddler was playing up. We were told later that we had not fulfilled our Sunday obligation.

?
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if you miss Mass to care for a child you have no obligation. No, you did not meet your Sunday obligation because that day in that circumstance you did not have one. I can readily believe the toddler was too wild even for you to go to the cry room (if available) or stand at the back. If you had no one else to watch him you did not even have an obligation to return to a later Mass. On another occasion you could arrange to go in shifts or get a babysitter until he is a bit older.

I am concerned about “we were told later”. By whom. If not the priest, disregard it. If it is a choice between missing Mass until your toddler is a bit more mature, or going in shifts, choose the option that lets you both meet your Sunday obligation. You don’t need to take advice from everybody who wants to put their oar in (including here) you have a priest for that.

we discuss this topic at least once a week. There is no law that says parents have to bring babies and toddlers to Mass, and many parents would enjoy the peace and quiet of a Mass without kids, and be willing to go in shifts to enjoy a break. They will have plenty of time to learn to behave at Mass when they are older so do what works best for your family and tell everyone else to butt out.
 
You didn’t intend to miss Mass. You’re okay.
Please try to not leave the church during Mass. The solution that worked best for us was to go to the back of the church and walk the child back and forth. Usually the problem is that the child is protesting being made to hold still. Walking up and down is easy and lets the child feel less constrained.
Fussy babies can be put over the shoulder and walked back and forth as well. The illusion of changing scenery allows the baby to concentrate on the movement and settle down.
I’ve never agreed with the concept of cry rooms. It allows the child to believe that disruptive behavior is permissable. Our pediatrician told us with our first child that “if it isn’t cute at five, it isn’t cute at two.” Pretty wise advice.

Matthew
 
davidarlette said:
I must say I find it disturbing that one may have grown in grace a great deal, live a good Christian life but miss one Mass and suffer eternally in hell for it. Doesn’t sound like a loving God to me.:confused:
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It’s as much a violation of a Commandment of God as murder or adultery.
 
Hang on a sec, are you saying if we have a toddler an 5 month old and no support, if my wife leaves Mass she has no obligation? That is if you’ve got young kids the Sunday Mass obligation doesn’t apply?

It seems strange to us from Prot. churches with creches, kids’ church, where the whole family goes together to join the RCC, the “big family” church, and be told we should split up and go to Mass separately. The reason initially that my wife converted (I was the one with strong Catholic leanings) was because she wanted us to go to church together.:confused:

drafdog, thanks, will try your ideas. Yes it is the staying still thing that Will doesn’t like. He climbs over the pews, waves to other parishoners, walks off, comes back.👍

We don’t have crying rooms or anything like that.
 
davidarlette said:
Hang on a sec, are you saying if we have a toddler an 5 month old and no support, if my wife leaves Mass she has no obligation? That is if you’ve got young kids the Sunday Mass obligation doesn’t apply?

It seems strange to us from Prot. churches with creches, kids’ church, where the whole family goes together to join the RCC, the “big family” church, and be told we should split up and go to Mass separately. The reason initially that my wife converted (I was the one with strong Catholic leanings) was because she wanted us to go to church together.:confused:

drafdog, thanks, will try your ideas. Yes it is the staying still thing that Will doesn’t like. He climbs over the pews, waves to other parishoners, walks off, comes back.👍

We don’t have crying rooms or anything like that.
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Only while the kid is still a toddler - a lot of RC Churches do have childrens’ liturgies and such for them when they’re a little bit older. Otherwise do what works best for you.

Many parents of two (even single parents of two) can and do successfully attend Mass together with the children. Some, with the best will in the world, simply find they can’t. So sometimes it’s easier for parents to share childminding duties and NOT attend the same Mass. Not as a universal rule, though.
 
davidarlette said:
Yes it is the staying still thing that Will doesn’t like. He climbs over the pews, waves to other parishoners, walks off, comes back.👍
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What happens if you just let him wander around a bit?

I used to know a little boy who wandered up on the altar in the middle of Mass all the time - he gave the ushers fits, but his Dad (who is a good friend of mine) said it was a choice between watching him wander around, and listening to him scream, so he let him wander around. (His wife was not yet Catholic at the time.) Later the little boy became an altar server, and he’s now a much bigger boy, and he’s in Junior Seminary.

Another thing you can do is bring him into the Church when it’s quiet and walk around with him, showing him all the stuff - give him the names of each thing, show him where Jesus is, and let him light a prayer candle. That way, he’ll feel that he knows where everything is, and it might curb his urge to wander around in the middle of Mass. (No guarantees, though. Some kids just have “itchy” legs.)
 
Well, it happened again.😦

Last night we went to Mass and it was a Confirmation one. We went “beauty! Lots of kids.” We got as far as the Homily (by the Bishop) when Will started yacking loudly and would not stop. He also kept yelling out what sounded like “the F word”, but it’s not language that we use. Eventually after lots of stares I took him out and he was saying “Don’t smack me Daddy.” I was too embarrassed to go back in. So it looks like we are a state of mortal sin again. One woman if front of us kept turning around and staring (say about 20 times).:mad:

I did try taking Will (now 3y.o.) for a walk up and down the back of the church and that got me a lot of stares too. I thought it would be OK since the Bishop was preaching on the importance of family in our life, suffer the little children, etc.

I am having real trouble coming to terms with being in a state of mortal sin in these circumsatnces. The priest told us it is indeed mortal sin. Considering I had to do RCIA despite having already gone through Catechesis before, and having to wait years to receive the Eucharist, to lose the privelige so easily made me extremely angry at my son, and I am sure that is not God’s will. In fact, I think God would understand our circumstances and not count it against us, but know that I am supposed to confess again that I missed Sunday obligation.

My wife told me not to be too hard on my son, because it was the starers I was angry at. I am at witt’s end. We live in a Parish with no crying room, and I am sure above all else that God does not want to separate us as we Worship.
 
jmcrae, when we let him wander around a little bit, he went to the side of the church, found some old kneeler type desks and proceeded to open and shut the timber drawers as loud as he could.
 
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