LSD: Is individuality an illusion?

  • Thread starter Thread starter Ben_Sinner
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
B

Ben_Sinner

Guest
I’ve been concerned after reading about the effects of LSD that people experience. They say a common symptom is feeling “at one”, literally, with the universe and their sense of “self” dissolves away. They believe they are themselves as well as the trees and couch they see at the same time.

Scientists say their sensory cortices, which process sensations like sight and touch, became far more connected than usual to the frontal parietal network, which is involved with our sense of self. “The stronger that communication, the stronger the experience of the dissolution [of self],”

npr.org/sections/health-shots/2016/04/13/474071268/how-lsd-makes-your-brain-one-with-the-universe

Another thing I found was that apparently our mind on LSD is similar to our mind as an infant

reuters.com/article/us-science-psychedelic-idUSKCN0X82B2

So is individuality an illusion? Since all it seems to be, according to neuroscience, is the suppression of a connection of different senses within the brain that our mind creates over time when we mature out of infancy?
 
Is individuality an illusion?

No.

Rather the experiences of LSD is.

As would be any other asserted “experience” of “no -self”. After all “who” is it then that has that experience… if there is no self…?
 
Bookcat said:
Is individuality an illusion?

No.

Rather the experiences of LSD is.

As would be any other asserted “experience” of “no -self”. After all “who” is it then that has that experience… if there is no self…?
Click to expand...
Self-knowledge is created in specific part of brain. Please read this for further illustration.

Moreover you don’t essentially need an experiencer in order to experience. Experience just happens as an event.
 
STT said:
Self-knowledge is created in specific part of brain.
Moreover you don’t essentially need an experiencer in order to experience. Experience just happens as an event.
Click to expand...
So? Yes of course the brain is involved as I breath this fine air. One can debate how etc. But yes of course we are embodied souls. We are body and soul.

The second line there above is self- contradictory.

What I noted stands.
 
The way psychodelics work in the brain is fascinating, and there’s still so much we don’t know about the nature of consciousness, perception, and how these drugs alter it. My handful of LSD experiences are the closest I’ve ever come to being able to be open to the possibility of a higher power. That really caught me off guard.
 
I guess when it comes down to it, my question would be:

Which one is reality?

The brain of normal, everyday life that’s activity is very restrictive and creates a sense of self and external reality?

…or…

The brain on LSD or other psychadelic techniques that makes almost the entire brain active and causes a sense of “one-ness” and pantheism?
 
No, reality is (at least our perception of it).

Our perception really has very little to do with reality. It is really a very small subset of the (name removed by moderator)uts available to us, and is displayed to our mind in a practical way to solve problems that occur in our lives.

Science attempts to generalize from/systematize the various apparent contradictory results presented to our mind from these limited (name removed by moderator)uts.

But science cannot say why green is, well, green.
Ben_Sinner said:
I’ve been concerned after reading about the effects of LSD that people experience. They say a common symptom is feeling “at one”, literally, with the universe and their sense of “self” dissolves away. They believe they are themselves as well as the trees and couch they see at the same time.

Scientists say their sensory cortices, which process sensations like sight and touch, became far more connected than usual to the frontal parietal network, which is involved with our sense of self. “The stronger that communication, the stronger the experience of the dissolution [of self],”

npr.org/sections/health-shots/2016/04/13/474071268/how-lsd-makes-your-brain-one-with-the-universe

Another thing I found was that apparently our mind on LSD is similar to our mind as an infant

reuters.com/article/us-science-psychedelic-idUSKCN0X82B2

So is individuality an illusion? Since all it seems to be, according to neuroscience, is the suppression of a connection of different senses within the brain that our mind creates over time when we mature out of infancy?
Click to expand...
Perception, it’s all an illusion. But there is a reality behind it.

Two realities. One is an illusion.

peace
steve
 
Ben_Sinner said:
I guess when it comes down to it, my question would be:

Which one is reality?

The brain of normal, everyday life that’s activity is very restrictive and creates a sense of self and external reality?

…or…

The brain on LSD or other psychadelic techniques that makes almost the entire brain active and causes a sense of “one-ness” and pantheism?
Click to expand...
Why not both/and? Individuality is not an illusion. It is one aspect.
 
BlueEyedLady said:
The way psychodelics work in the brain is fascinating, and there’s still so much we don’t know about the nature of consciousness, perception, and how these drugs alter it. My handful of LSD experiences are the closest I’ve ever come to being able to be open to the possibility of a higher power. That really caught me off guard.
Click to expand...
I did a lot of LSD in the early 90s and agree with you. There is a good reason why it is illegal and has nothing to do with it being dangerous to the user!
 
Bookcat said:
Is individuality an illusion?

No.

Rather the experiences of LSD is.

As would be any other asserted “experience” of “no -self”. After all “who” is it then that has that experience… if there is no self…?
Click to expand...
Please define what you mean by “self.” For me, the self is nothing more than the perceiver of experiences, such as thought and emotions, and the manager of behavior. Things like self-esteem and self-identity, are parts of the “old self” as described in the New Testament.
 
Bookcat said:
Is individuality an illusion?

No.

Rather the experiences of LSD is.

As would be any other asserted “experience” of “no -self”. After all “who” is it then that has that experience… if there is no self…?
Click to expand...
We can also look at it as two selves. One is the individual ego self which is useful but not the complete self. The individual ego self can diminish or gain strength.

Another self, a deeper wider self is cosmic and universal. We are all part of the same universe, the same cosmos.

What is the self Christ tells us we must die to? And lose?
 
Robert_Sock said:
Things like …self-identity, are parts of the “old self” as described in the New Testament.
Click to expand...
That is not what is meant by Jesus and the New Testament.

Seek out some good Catholic Commentaries to read more on this.
 
Michael_Mayo said:
We can also look at it as two selves. One is the individual ego self which is useful but not the complete self. The individual ego self can diminish or gain strength.

Another self, a deeper wider self is cosmic and universal. We are all part of the same universe, the same cosmos.
Click to expand...
A no.
 
mikekle said:
I did a lot of LSD in the early 90s and agree with you. There is a good reason why it is illegal and has nothing to do with it being dangerous to the user!
Click to expand...
It sounds a little nutty, but LSD is kind of my “hope” for a higher power or an afterlife. If further research shows that the way you experience and perceive the world on LSD is just different, but no less “real” than the way a standard human brain, for lack of a better description, perceives the world, I would be moved into the agnostic or even spiritualist category.
 
BlueEyedLady said:
It sounds a little nutty, but LSD is kind of my “hope” for a higher power or an afterlife. If further research shows that the way you experience and perceive the world on LSD is just different, but no less “real” than the way a standard human brain, for lack of a better description, perceives the world, I would be moved into the agnostic or even spiritualist category.
Click to expand...
Meditation alters the brain naturally.

forbes.com/sites/alicegwalton/2015/02/09/7-ways-meditation-can-actually-change-the-brain/#11d38fa11465
 
Michael_Mayo said:
Meditation alters the brain naturally.

forbes.com/sites/alicegwalton/2015/02/09/7-ways-meditation-can-actually-change-the-brain/#11d38fa11465
Click to expand...
I’ve never been able to really do meditation right. My brother, also an atheist, swears by it though. But, like LSD, if I could really make it “work” for me, and there was compelling research showing that the different perception was just different and not giving me unreal illusions and distortions, depending on what I experienced, it may change my mind too.
 
BlueEyedLady said:
I’ve never been able to really do meditation right. My brother, also an atheist, swears by it though. But, like LSD, if I could really make it “work” for me, and there was compelling research showing that the different perception was just different and not giving me unreal illusions and distortions, depending on what I experienced, it may change my mind too.
Click to expand...
Yes but all of us who used LSD and had some mind-blowing experiences aren’t using it now, right? It’s not something anyone would want to make a habit of, unless you were Timothy Leary, who actually turned out pretty nutty in the end.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top