Luminous Mysteries & Other

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Our Church, dedicated in 1953 has the 15 decades of the Rosary on our stained glass windows as well as some selected saints, St. Joseph, Pius X, John Vianney, St. Patrick, St Maria Goretti, St. Francis Xavier Cabrini. During our last renovation the five Luminous Mysteries and a window of Pope John Paul II was installed in the back, separating the vestibule from the Nave. So now we have all 20 decades of the Rosary in our stained glass windows.
 
I do not say the Luminous Mysteries for similar reasons as stated by Shin. But I’m just not into arguing about it. Its a private devotion anyway. I have been averaging 12 Rosaries a day for this past year. The Luminous are just not part of it for me.

Many more important things to discuss.
 
corsair said:
I do not say the Luminous Mysteries for similar reasons as stated by Shin. But I’m just not into arguing about it. Its a private devotion anyway. I have been averaging 12 Rosaries a day for this past year. The Luminous are just not part of it for me.

Many more important things to discuss.
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It is part for the prayer as the Church defined it. Those wh believe that the Church is Christ’s Mystical Body accept her decisions. Naturally God gave freedom for everyone, and he honors this freedom until the death of the individual.

vatican.va/archive/compendium_ccc/documents/archive_2005_compendium-ccc_en.html

The Rosary

The Joyful Mysteries
(recited Monday and Saturday)

The Annunciation
The Visitation
The Nativity
The Presentation
The Finding in the Temple

The Mysteries of Light
(recited Thursday)

The Baptism of Jesus
The Wedding Feast of Cana
The Proclamation of the Kingdom, with the call to Conversion
The Transfiguration
The Institution of the Eucharist

The Sorrowful Mysteries
(recited Tuesday and Friday)

The Agony in the Garden
The Scourging at the Pillar
The Crowning with Thorns
The Carrying of the Cross
The Crucifixion

The Glorious Mysteries
(recited Wednesday and Sunday)

The Resurrection
The Ascension
The Descent of the Holy Spirit
The Assumption
The Coronation of Mary Queen of Heaven and Earth
 
Ah no, the Church has not ‘defined’ the the Rosary consists of the Luminous mysteries. If that’s what you’re trying to say, you’re overreaching.
 
Shin said:
Ah no, the Church has not ‘defined’ the the Rosary consists of the Luminous mysteries. If that’s what you’re trying to say, you’re overreaching.
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You are right. The Rosary is encouraged by the Church, but in no way did Pope John Paul II intend for the Luminous Mysteries as a requirement.

The Rosary is a gift freely given to be accepted by those who find comfort in praying the Rosary. It is not in any way mandated.
 
Shin said:
Here’s an article on the new mysteries.

And here’s another.

I think they explain to a degree why people stay with the traditional mysteries, especially in these formless ever changing times. Change itself is the enemy of tradition, and the more that happens at once, for whatever good cause, the more harm can be done.

Some things should be let be. 😃

‘If you persevere in reciting the Rosary, this will be a most probable sign of your eternal salvation.’

Bl. Alan de la Roche

**‘When you say your Rosary, the angels rejoice, the Blessed Trinity delights in it, my Son finds joy in it too, and I myself am happier than you can possibly guess. After the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass, there is nothing in the Church that I love as much as the Rosary.’
**
The Blessed Virgin to Bl. Alan de la Roche

‘Give me an army saying the Rosary and I will conquer the world.’

Pope Bl. Pius IX
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If the Luminous mysteries lead us to a deeper contemplation on the Life of Christ, how can that be a bad thing?
By His Baptism, Jesus demonstrates His humility and is anointed by the Holy Spirit to begin His ministry.
At Cana, it is Mary who was approached when the wine ran low. It is Mary who pointed to Jesus saying, “Do whatever He tells you.” It is her Son who provided for the feast and elevated marriage to a Sacramental level.
It is Jesus Christ who proclaims the Kingdom of God, who heals the sick and calls for us to repent of our sinfulness. He is the Messiah.
Christ is transfigured (4th mystery).
And finally it is our Lord who gives the Church her greatest gift, the Eucharist --the source and summit of our faith.

With the four sets of mysteries, we reflect on the whole Christ making the rosary the most liturgical prayer outside the Mass.
 
While the Church encourages the recitation of the rosary, it is not mandated. It is a private devotion.
In 1858, Mary invited Bernadette to “Pray the rosary in reparation for the sins of the world.”
In 1917, Mary called for the recitation of the rosary everyday when she appeared before the children of Fatima. It was at this time that the Fatima prayer was added after the Glory Be.
Fr. Peyton said, “The family that prays together stays together” as he encouraged the daily recitation of the rosary. Pope John Paul II said, “The rosary is my favorite prayer, a marvelous prayer.” Indeed, I never saw the pontiff without his rosary in hand.
Though Marian in character, the rosary is a Christocentric Prayer. Through the mysteries we contemplate the Gospel message in its entirety.
With the addition of the Luminous mysteries in October 2002, Pope John Paul II called us to pray the rosary daily for our families and for world peace.

It is a 15th century Carthusian monk who divided the rosary into 15 brackets and a Dominican who assigned the original mysteries to the rosary. personalizedrosaries.com/history.html
 
While I have no objection to the Luminous mysteries, and pray them frequently, I would note that the original 15 follow are akin to the Nicene Creed: He was born, He suffered and died, He rose again. This encompasses the minimum foundations of our Faith.
 
Jim_Dandy said:
One can be a good Catholic and never say the Rosary at all. It’s a devotion, not a doctrine.
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Not sure how this comment fit into the discussion at hand, but it seems that if so many saints and popes recommend it so strongly, it should be part of one’s prayer life to some degree. Catholics are not “required” to say the Rosary; in fact, they are not “required” to do much. But why settle for the lowest common denominator? I will submit that saying the Rosary makes being a good Catholic a heckuva lot easier.

I think JP2 added the luminous in part to add something new to the Rosary and give us something else to meditate on. I’m not big on it, but we do say them as part of our family prayers on Thursday.
 
Dear Friends,

As someone who has loved the Rosary throughout my 55 years, I just wanted to add some comments to this debate.

First of all, different religious Orders had/have different mysteries and sets of decades - practiced also by their Third Order laity.

Thus, the Franciscans have 7 decades, the Servites 7 decades of seven Hail Mary’s, the Brigittines - 18 decades and so on.

The 15 decade rosary predates St Dominic and his vision (the earliest Dominican annals make no mentioni of Dominic’s rosary vision at all). The early Fathers of the Thebaid beginning in the 8th century mention the Rule of the Virgin Mary of 150 Hail Mary’s. Other monastics simply many Hail Mary’s, even thousands, a day (there was the medieval devotion in imitation of King Solomon of saying 1,000 Hail Mary’s before a special feast of our Lady).

The 150 Hail Mary rosarium was therefore one among many forms of the rosary prayer. Blessed Alan des Roches used the 150 Hail Mary rosary as a way to get people to also pray 150 psalms in one week, in accordance with the Church’s daily office. This was the original rule of the Rosary Confraternity.

Also, the various “Rosary Saints” such as St Louis de Montfort, while emphasizing the 15 decade meditated Rosary, asked their followers NOT to stop there as we read in his True Devotion to Mary. St Louis always insisted on an extra six or seven decade Rosary after the 15 decades. Others taught the recitation of a decade of the Rosary at the turn of every hour. St Pio of Pietrelcina, as his devotees, know, would say 20, 30 or even 40 15 decade rosaries daily.

To increase the decades of the Rosary is no break with tradition - in fact, the case can be made that to pat oneself on the back after doing 15 decades is what is the break with tradition . . .

With respect to change, yes it can do damage to tradition. But only when this change is to do less, not more. The 20 decade rosary is a change for the better.

In addition, the Rosary Confraternities of medieval times (and one may read of this in the Recusant literature of Britain) simply used the decade as a format of prayer for MANY sets of different mysteries. So there was the Stations of the Cross rosary of 14 decades, five decades for the Five Holy Wounds of Christ (the Dominicans have declared the five main Our Father beads to represent the main Holy Wounds of Christ), seven decades for the seven Blood-sheddings of Christ, 12 decades in honour of the 12 Apostles, 9 decades in honour of the 9 choirs of Angels etc.

One problem I have with traditionalists is that they wish to speak on behalf of ALL traditionalists. In the case of some of their comments on the 20 decade Rosary, I wish they would do just a bit of historical research before making their own ex cathedra pronouncements against something suggested by Blessed John Paul II.

And the 153 Hail Mary’s were also said to reflect the 153 fishes caught after the Resurrection of Christ as noted in the Gospel of St John.

In fact, what this represented was a union of the Brigittine and Dominican rosaries.

The Brigittine rosary was made up of 63 Hail Mary’s in honour of the years that our Lady lived on earth (the Franciscans have a 72 Hail Mary rosary for her 72 years and the Ethiopians a 64 Hail Mary rosary etc.).

The extra beads simply included those three Hail Mary’s but, in the Dominican case, didn’t include the sixth decade.

Many medieval rosaries didn’t have the introductory beads which were a later addition (the rosary of Mary Queen of Scots did not and there are many other examples).

There was so much variety in the structure of the Rosary that to say anything definite about the unchanging and “ancient” tradition of the 153 Hail Mary rosary is simply - historically uninformed.

Alex
 
Alexander_Roman said:
Dear Friends,
…

First of all, different religious Orders had/have different mysteries and sets of decades - practiced also by their Third Order laity.

Thus, the Franciscans have 7 decades, the Servites 7 decades of seven Hail Mary’s, the Brigittines - 18 decades and so on.
…

Others taught the recitation of a decade of the Rosary at the turn of every hour. St Pio of Pietrelcina, as his devotees, know, would say 20, 30 or even 40 15 decade rosaries daily.

To increase the decades of the Rosary is no break with tradition - in fact, the case can be made that to pat oneself on the back after doing 15 decades is what is the break with tradition . . .

With respect to change, yes it can do damage to tradition. But only when this change is to do less, not more. The 20 decade rosary is a change for the better.
…
So there was the Stations of the Cross rosary of 14 decades, five decades for the Five Holy Wounds of Christ (the Dominicans have declared the five main Our Father beads to represent the main Holy Wounds of Christ), seven decades for the seven Blood-sheddings of Christ, 12 decades in honour of the 12 Apostles, 9 decades in honour of the 9 choirs of Angels etc.
…

Many medieval rosaries didn’t have the introductory beads which were a later addition (the rosary of Mary Queen of Scots did not and there are many other examples).

There was so much variety in the structure of the Rosary that to say anything definite about the unchanging and “ancient” tradition of the 153 Hail Mary rosary is simply - historically uninformed.

Alex
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Do you have a copy of rosary of the 5 Holy Wounds? My parish prayed this during Lent last year, but all I find on the internet is the chaplet, which is not the same. I really would like to pray this rosary on Fridays.
Since Saturday is dedicated to Mary, as the day she mourned the loss of her son, I like to pray the full 20 decade rosary on that day.
I printed a copy of a pamphlet for a 24 hour rosary (1 decade per hour with reflections).
I like St. Louis de Montfort’s introduction to the rosary.
…We offer Thee, O Most Holy Trinity, this Creed in honor of all the mysteries of our faith; this Our Father and these three Hail Marys in honor of the unity of Thy Essence and the Trinity of Thy Persons. We ask of thee a lively faith, a firm hope, and an ardent charity. Amen
I definitely like praying the scriptural reflections before each decade. In the past, I have prayed the scriptural rosary, reflecting on a passage for each Hail Mary. When I visited Conyers, I purchased an excellent book that includes passages for either the decade or individual Hail Marys. I did not bring it with me when I came to the Persian Gulf.
 
DebChris said:
Do you have a copy of rosary of the 5 Holy Wounds? My parish prayed this during Lent last year, but all I find on the internet is the chaplet, which is not the same. I really would like to pray this rosary on Fridays.
Since Saturday is dedicated to Mary, as the day she mourned the loss of her son, I like to pray the full 20 decade rosary on that day.
I printed a copy of a pamphlet for a 24 hour rosary (1 decade per hour with reflections).
I like St. Louis de Montfort’s introduction to the rosary.
…We offer Thee, O Most Holy Trinity, this Creed in honor of all the mysteries of our faith; this Our Father and these three Hail Marys in honor of the unity of Thy Essence and the Trinity of Thy Persons. We ask of thee a lively faith, a firm hope, and an ardent charity. Amen
I definitely like praying the scriptural reflections before each decade. In the past, I have prayed the scriptural rosary, reflecting on a passage for each Hail Mary. When I visited Conyers, I purchased an excellent book that includes passages for either the decade or individual Hail Marys. I did not bring it with me when I came to the Persian Gulf.
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Here is a way to pray the Rosary of the Five Wounds of Jesus with five decades:

www.stmaxmedia.com/authors/dm/chaplet.html

I once had a “decima” or “tenner” little set of beads with me. The day before we boarded our cruise ship to go around the Caribbean, my wife went shopping in Ft. Lauderdale. It was an all day affair . . . Praying the decades with different mysteries from the Bible, I found that I actually got through over 50 decades that day.

The next day we boarded the ship. After our vacation, we found out that FIVE guards who would have gone on the ship were discovered by the authorities not to have been guards at all . . . but you know what.

Our Lady protects us with her Rosary!

Alex
 
I think the traditionalists that don’t like the Luminous Mysteries reject them on the basis that they haven’t been around for 500 years or more.

I love them because they compliment the existing Mysteries, they add more about the life of Christ (His baptism, His first miracle (at the prompting of the Blessed Virgin), the proclamation of the Kingdom of God, the Transfiguration and the institution of the Eucharist).

This is a gift to these times by the Holy Spirit. I really rejoice when it is a Thursday when it is a time to pray it.
 
yosephdaviyd said:
It is a sad commentary indeed when we limit the ways in which God can speak to us. Always open yourself up and be vulnerable to the possibility of God being God. If he spoke to the prophet through a donkey, surely He can speak to us through the Luminous Mysteries. 👍
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But it is not a sad situation in that we have been given such a wealth of spirituality within the Church. Even if the reason for preferring a devotion is that the antiquity of the devotion brings a greater sense of awe and reverence, that is not better or worse that finding a devotion to be more significant because the devotion is new and represents the moving of the Holy Spirit today.

We are not all the same. We do not all have the same role within Christ. The answer to the OP’s question? It is simply irrelevant for the same reason that St. Paul said:

*The eye cannot say to the hand, “I do not need you,” nor again the head to the feet, “I do not need you.” *
 
Jim_Dandy said:
One can be a good Catholic and never say the Rosary at all. It’s a devotion, not a doctrine.
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That may be so, Jim Dandy, but I find it wiser to do as my Mother, the Blessed Virgin has requested we do for the peace and salvation of the world. I do not consider the Rosary just another optional devotion. Just recently I have been thinking alot about the idea that she has specifically requested that this be done and it makes it easier for me to settle down and devote the time it takes instead of procrastinating. I want to please the Immaculate Heart of Mary. As far as the Luminous Mysteries, I was never sure if they were or were not a good idea, but I have found that I love them. Those five extra meditations bring me peace and joy. They don’t take anything away in my opinion, but do add to the blessings of the Rosary for me. The others get addressed twice each week as it is and I could never remember which of the originals went for Thursday, anyway, so when Thursday comes the Luminous mysteries it is!
 
In the book titled “Christ’s Mother and Ours” by Father Oscar Lukefahr, C.M. on page 163 he says that when Jesus who never sinned allowed himself to be baptized he blessed water for the sacrament of baptism. All water on earth is one. So that when Jesus stood in the Jordon River he really did bless all water for all time. When Father Lukefahr speaks of this it is in reference also to praying the first Luminous Mystery, the baptism of Christ. I thought this was all quite lovely to think of. Please forgive that I don’t footnote and quote quite by the book for the documentation. I wasn’t quite sure how to do that and wanted to post this now.
 
THe church encourages the use of not only the Catechism of the Catholic Church, but also local Catechisms like the Baltimore Catechism.

I personally love the ROman Catechism, you know, the one binding up until 1992: Meat and potatoes. PLus, if the faith doesn’t change, it doesn’t really matter if you hold to the New Catechism or the Roman Catechism, as long as you hold both to be valid and reflect the mind of the CHurch.

I interpret the one in light of the other.
 
rben20 said:
That’s what I meant sorry. The official Catechism of the Catholic Church. I understand that there is more tradition behind the other mysteries in that they have been prayed for a long time but the use of the rosary and the mysteries was established under Pope Pius V no? Using the same logic people could possibly at the time not want to pray it since it was not traditional so to speak and had not much of a history. I just think we should pray the luminous mysteries as the Church’s tradition is a living one, not frozen in time.
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Actually the rosary was a gift from the Virgin Mary to us given to St Simon Stock in the year 1208, some three hundred years before Pope Pius V. It has always been a private devotion, in other words its not mandated by the Church, you can particpate or not, its not like skipping mass.

On the luminous Mysteries they are beautiful aspects of the life and ministry of Jesus. I wonder as the Blessed Virgin Mary is beyond time as Jesus is did she not include them? Another person wondered why they were ever “excluded” in the first place, they were not, they were added after the fact, not by the Mother of God but by Pope JPII. This does not make them any less important part of the life of Jesus, any less beautiful, they are just not what the Blessed Virgin intended for inclusion in her gift.

ed

ed
 
roveau said:
I think the traditionalists that don’t like the Luminous Mysteries reject them on the basis that they haven’t been around for 500 years or more.

I love them because they compliment the existing Mysteries, they add more about the life of Christ (His baptism, His first miracle (at the prompting of the Blessed Virgin), the proclamation of the Kingdom of God, the Transfiguration and the institution of the Eucharist).

This is a gift to these times by the Holy Spirit. I really rejoice when it is a Thursday when it is a time to pray it.
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I too think they are a beautiful gift. I would stop short of attributing them to the Holy Spirit as the Pope did not announce them ex cathedra which is when he is infallible guided by the Holy Spirit, that does not make them any less beautiful or worthy of private devotion if one chooses. I say them on thursdays, I have no problem with them as meditative mysteries but as I said they can not be attributed to the Holy Spirit with any certainty, they can be attributed to a great and literate Pope though.

ed
 
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