Lust by looking?

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westboro said:
You describe the ‘automatic’ male response very tastefully and make it perfectly clear. Some women, but a whole lot of ‘young women’ cannot even grasp the very real physical arousal response of the male body sexually. It can be very painful and is a very real ‘cross’ for most of us and because of the fact that girls don’t understand what they are doing to us by exposing their bodies, we must take defensive actions, such as avoiding extremely ‘permissive’ places…like the beach, etc. Other places, like school or work that we cannot avoid, we need to train our selves to look away as soon as that ‘auto’ urge to ‘look’ kicks in. I am describing allot of work but it is necessary in order to gain control over the potential lust you describe. There is a difference between ‘pretty’, as you describe it and ‘provocative’. In 1917, the Blessed Mother told Jacinta that immodest styles would be introduced and the prediction has come to pass. Tight jeans, well fitting pants, tank tops, tight shirts short skirts, short pants, gym shorts etc etc etc. All these styles are mostly provocative. It is as though there is ‘no where’ we can ‘look’ anymore! Because of the sad condition of our society, I highly recommend to turn to the rosary and the Blessed Mother who will strengthen you to endure the battle. To answer your question more specifically…lust occurs only when you ‘consent’ to the desire at hand by way of either ‘not avoiding’ the occasion of sin or dwelling on it. It is all about how we apply our ‘will’ in any given situation. We are not being lustful just because our bodies ‘automatically’ respond to an unavoidable situation because that is perfectly natural. St Francis of Assisi once ‘threw’ himself into a thorn bush as a way to deal with that condition, which of course is a bit extreme but it will give you some idea as to how the saints dealt with it!
Finally, bear in mind that males reach the absolute PEAK of their sexual desires between 13 and 18 years old whereas females don’t reach theirs until they are around 35 years old, which is why ‘young’ girls are very much in the dark about these things. These ‘biological’ facts will further help you to grasp what you are dealing with! God bless!
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I think the average 18yr old girl has a pretty good idea about these things. They probably have the same thoughts about men.

As for mens sexual arousal being painful??? Where does that come from???
 
🙂
dazzi said:
I have been trying to get an exact meaning on Lust for over a year now so I really need help 😦 Iam stunned at what it is actually, I have a thing in my mind that whenever a guy sees a girl who is pretty they get as you know a reaction downstairs that it is Lust? but over the last few weeks ive been thinking that that reaction might not actually be Lust? because then Iam worried if it is because there is no way a guy can go around everyday life especially a teen and never get that reaction when they see a pretty girl, so is it Lust only when you purposfully have sexual or rude thoughts but if this reaciton downstairs happends without any thoughts or anything is this not Lust, But attraction?
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You will find that you just spontaneoulsy get these erections when you are young. Nothing you can do about it. It goes away with age (unfortunately, or fortunately) depending on how you look at it. 🙂

I wouldn’t worry about it too much if I were you. It’s a completely natural reaction. Nothing to get stressed over.
 
thomfra said:
I think the average 18yr old girl has a pretty good idea about these things. They probably have the same thoughts about men.
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Speaking as one who once was a rather average 18-year-old girl, yes, they have some idea that boys/men are driven by visual stimuli. But no, they don’t generally have the same thoughts. If they see a nice looking male physique, they will likely admire him, and even possibly have impure thoughts, but more often drift toward the romantic side or consider how best to attract his attention. Women daydream from time to time, but for the most part we are planners. We want to secure a man’s affection, not just his form. When I was 18 and saw a good-looking guy, the first thought that came to mind was, “How can I get him to notice me?” Hence the immodest fashion trends, I’m afraid… 😦
 
dazzi said:
So really if i go somewhere see someone, for eg at school today i felt so bad what i asked you was happening when i saw a person, i had a reaction, but in my head i quickly turned to face my computer and in my head i was saying god please help me, st michael please help me, would that be still classed as lust or not ? i did no want it but the reaction came and i knew i was gona fall for it so i started asking god for help…
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I can ‘feel’ your extreme frustration and anxiety as I read your post. I felt much the same way in my day. First of all, do not forget that there is a devil who is going to use all his power to ‘attack’ you at your weakest point. Knowing this, ‘learn’ as much about the counter-weapons available through the church to do battle against him. St James letter in the New Testament says that "faith without works is “dead’”. I thought of that quote as I read how you called upon God and St Michael, which is great but I would encourage you to consider taking definitive ‘counter-action’ in addition to calling upon the Lord. The church encourages us to fast, do penance, pray, do charitable works, give alms(donations), etc, etc, etc. ALL these things are EXTREMELY powerful weapons against Satan. Doing these things in whatever degree you can will not only strengthen you in your battle but cause Satan to ‘run’ in the other direction. Try working at a ‘homeless’ shelter or soup kitchen as a volunteer, without pay. You will be amazed how ‘easy’ your struggle will become! ‘Study’ your catechism and know your faith! These are the things that will ‘win’ the battle for you. Many years ago I told my 16 year old son that it would be better to ‘quit’ school than to continue down the path that he was on which was down the road of alcohol and drug abuse. He did quit, and then, after some effort…quit alcohol and drug abuse. He never went to college but he is very successful today. My point is that ANYTHING that prevents us from our goal, which is God is not that important. We are all called to be saints and the process to sainthood involves hard work! Our bodies are like ‘spoiled brats’ that need strong discipline. Be ‘tough’ on yourself in so far as ‘actions’ but at the same time be ‘gentle’ with yourself always bearing in mind that you are a child of God! In other words…patience, patience, patience!!!
 
scapularkid8 said:
I know it isn’t lust to look at an attractive person, otherwise we’d be covering our eyes everywhere we went (my general compliment to God’s Creation there 😉 ), but is there a point when you start sinning by over-indulging in staring a beautiful bodies say at the pool or beach (since we’re in the summer months)? My current moral “assessment” is that it would be only an occasion of sin. Not sure though. It’s especially hard for me being only 18 when we see other people’s bodies as very important in how we perceive our peers. Just wondering.
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In part, it’s instinctual. We can’t help it. But, to do it persistently, knowingly, excessively, is a sin. One should try to curb the tendency, to force oneself to look away, and think about something else. It becomes a matter of Christian discipline. The Disciple can’t give in to his lower nature. :knight1:
 
I heard a talk by Fr. Larry Richards on Confession where he discusses the sin of lust. He gives the example of a priest asking the confessor during confession “have you entertained any lustful thoughts?”, and the confessor replies “no Fr., hehe, the lustful thoughts have entertained me”. Thats really what you want to look out for, dwelling on these lustful thoughts. He gives another example that they are like a bird, they will come fly over our heads but we don’t want them to nest in our hair. Thats when the sin occurs.

As a 20 year old male I understand the struggle men have with chastity, especially when we’re young. I would say the most beneficial thing you can do to get over it is to pray and understand God loves you. Often times with sins of impurity it can be almost a downward spiral, where you fall and then feel so bad about it you fall again and again. At some point you need to climb out, realize your loved by God and let him work with you. Take strength in realizing despite your flaws most guys your age couldn’t care less about how much they lust. Your not alone in your struggle and your should realize the courage and love for God you display in your attempts.

One last piece of advice I could give is to understand that the way to really change and defeat sins isn’t to just say to yourself I’m not gonna do that because I’m supposed to. It’s very hard to say I’m not going to lust, or I’m not going to masturbate because that’s the right thing to do. If you refrain from these things on the other hand because of a love for Jesus, then you find it’s easier. Think of it like a relationship with a girl, when you truly love some one and care about them it’s very easy to make sacrifices for them because they are your world and you wouldn’t want to do something to hurt them or damage your relationship.

Hope this helps.
 
scapularkid8 said:
I know it isn’t lust to look at an attractive person, otherwise we’d be covering our eyes everywhere we went (my general compliment to God’s Creation there 😉 ), but is there a point when you start sinning by over-indulging in staring a beautiful bodies say at the pool or beach (since we’re in the summer months)? My current moral “assessment” is that it would be only an occasion of sin. Not sure though. It’s especially hard for me being only 18 when we see other people’s bodies as very important in how we perceive our peers. Just wondering.
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You can look at a person and say, “She is beautiful.” It is something else to stare at someone’s body because at best it is an occasion of sin - at best. In our disordered culture, the greatest need we have is to purify our hearts to be sure we’re not making people into objects of gratification. You should appreciate the beauty of the person. The body is not yours to appreciate and is only for the person’s spouse. Ask yourself, “If I was her wife, would I want someone to stare at her like I am?” Keep in mind that lust takes only a second to occur in the will and why toy with it by staring? After the first glance, I think it is best to look at the face and appreciate the person. Don’t try to see how long you can stare or “appreciate the beauty.” The person is to be appreciated. The body is for a spouse in vowed marriage.

Pax Christi tecum.
 
Remember too that sin requires the consent of our will - for mortal sin full and entire consent of the will is required. There has to be a conscious decision for their to be sin. Just throwing it out there.

Pax Christi tecum.
 
Well, I just found this from an old Ask an Apologist:
forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=120384
Lust consists of deliberately causing oneself sexual pleasure mentally and /or physically.
We all know the difference between simply feeling an emotion with feeling sexual arousal. In themselves emotions are morally neutral. Recognizing the physical beauty of a member of the opposite sex can be a very good thing. But if one looks with the intention of getting aroused, then such behavior is sinful. Staring at people is really not polite, but it itself, it is not a sin. However, seeking situations that will give us emotional pleasure without consideration for the other person can be sinful.
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Fr. Vincent Serpa, O.P.
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I never lust after real women. The moment I realise there’s a beautiful girl before my eyes I become extremely cold. Such is my reaction when I detect a source of potential temptation. The nervous system is faster than the hormones, so reason starts and overrides everything as long as a tempting object is present. The reasons of my reason would be:
-to use an opportunity to prove to myself my strength of withstanding,
-to set an example of a chaste behaviour (I’m not really very chaste:( ) thus preaching the Gospel,
-to exclude perceiving a girl as an inferior being.

The sexier a girl looks, the colder I am. I am almost sure that nothing can seduce me immediately (however, not so sure about closer contacts when pheromones enter the equation). But this seldom goes without consequences. Later in the evening, I would focus attention on myself and if you know you know…

Besides, I’ve heard that the sights of lovely women cause men’s blood pressure to rise sharply for a short while, which some consider a damage to health. Or is it healthy instead? I could not google up any convincing info.

St Paul of Tarsus and St Augustine have a lot on how the body behaves disobediently. So, in situations of direct temptation, I enjoy the way I resist it, though later the hormones would take theirs.
 
So I think what I gather is that it’s alright to admire a woman’s beauty, especially if there’s only one that you’re after, but when you begin to imagine lustful actions, it becomes a sin. Is that everyone else’s understanding?
 
CTA1967 said:
So I think what I gather is that it’s alright to admire a woman’s beauty, especially if there’s only one that you’re after, but when you begin to imagine lustful actions, it becomes a sin. Is that everyone else’s understanding?
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You’re right, it’s OK to admire a woman’s beauty.
St Thomas d'Aquin:
As Isidore says (Etym. x), “a lustful man is one who is debauched with pleasures.” Now venereal pleasures above all debauch a man’s mind. Therefore lust is especially concerned with such like pleasures.
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Also, the problem of pagans: the world is so good that they worship it. While a Christian mind redirects to the Maker. The same about a woman.

And moreover, why treat women as even potentially sexual (objects). To me, even if they walked stark naked, I would treat them as equal human beings and lust would be suppressed by a universal fraternal feeling. Of course, my body would not forgive me such wasting of opportunities and there would follow a hormonal turmoil, but when I am among living real persons I see persons, or nothng but not sexual objects.

I want all of us to live up fully to the spirit of human equality. Maybe, without objectification there is no lust?
 
CTA1967 said:
So I think what I gather is that it’s alright to admire a woman’s beauty, especially if there’s only one that you’re after, but when you begin to imagine lustful actions, it becomes a sin. Is that everyone else’s understanding?
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To admire beauty is fine, but watch out – if that beauty is unclothed or barely clothed, you are “admiring” something that God never meant for men who are not this woman’s husband to “admire.” Also, to look upon a woman dressed to our cultural standards and attempt only to admire her beauty without being tempted to consider her without clothes might prove an impossible task. Our current fashions are designed to draw the eye to all the wrong places.

So stick to admiring her face, and leave the rest for her husband to admire.
 
surf(name removed by moderator)ure said:
To admire beauty is fine, but watch out – if that beauty is unclothed or barely clothed, you are “admiring” something that God never meant for men who are not this woman’s husband to “admire.” Also, to look upon a woman dressed to our cultural standards and attempt only to admire her beauty without being tempted to consider her without clothes might prove an impossible task. Our current fashions are designed to draw the eye to all the wrong places.

So stick to admiring her face, and leave the rest for her husband to admire.
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And you too are in about women only. As if only men are looking at women and not women at men.
Where’s the Church’s universality and expectation of the sexless state of the future life?
Also, lusting after women offends me as a celibate person. My own dignity makes me respect the dignity of women.

P.S. I’m not creeping in to preach anything close to ordination of women, as it may seem.
 
FRATER_PAVLVS said:
And you too are in about women only. As if only men are looking at women and not women at men.
Where’s the Church’s universality and expectation of the sexless state of the future life?
Also, lusting after women offends me as a celibate person. My own dignity makes me respect the dignity of women.

P.S. I’m not creeping in to preach anything close to ordination of women, as it may seem.
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I’m afraid there is a misunderstanding about the basic wiring of the sexes. Men are visually stimulated; women, not nearly so much. I think you’ll find that the pornography industry is predominately supported by the male population, while the romance novel racket caters mostly to females. This is no accident. Women are simply wired differently.

Also, this is a thread specifically about looking at/lusting after women. And if by the “future life” you mean Heaven, I don’t think the Church has ever taught us to attempt sex-lessness before reaching glory. That wouldn’t make much sense, if the sacrament and vocation of marriage is to continue. :confused:
 
CTA1967 said:
Shouldn’t be too much trouble since she is a Catholic who dresses modestly, and she isn’t married. But I will try to be more careful.
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Just keep in mind that when a woman is still single, she will (most likely) one day have a husband, and her body must accordingly be preserved for him alone. 👍
 
FRATER_PAVLVS said:
And moreover, why treat women as even potentially sexual (objects). To me, even if they walked stark naked, I would treat them as equal human beings and lust would be suppressed by a universal fraternal feeling. Of course, my body would not forgive me such wasting of opportunities and there would follow a hormonal turmoil, but when I am among living real persons I see persons, or nothng but not sexual objects.
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😛 There was a time women and men did walk around each other stark naked, but Adam and Eve bit the apple and they became ashamed of there naked bodies 😦 . God then created clothes to mask the grand beauty that we were not supposed to see. However, there are nudist colonies in some parts of the world. I always wonder why they choose to do this, but then I realized how we were originally created.

Do you think that lust also came from that awful shame? I mean it was the the fruit of knowledge of good and evil. Maybe lust and other evil thoughts came from that fruit bringing shame.
 
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