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Shameless
Guest
How do I know if I’m lusting while I’m having foreplay or relations with my wife? I know that there is a fine line but how do you know if you’ve crossed it?
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cynic
Guest
Because it is your wife, someone you know very well. You’re hardly going to want to think this way about your wife are you?
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BLB_Oregon
Guest
One litmus test:
If you had to stop because something was wrong with her, would your inner response be
If you had to stop because something was wrong with her, would your inner response be
- “Oh, no! What’s wrong? Is she okay?”
- “Dang! Foiled! I’d better look concerned, though… this could be serious.”
- “Oh, MAN!! Just my luck. Ooops! Did she see that look? I’d better not wind up sleeping on the couch again.”
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deb1
Guest
Aren’t you supposed to lust while having relations with your wife-at least about her. Maybe I am missing something here.
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cargopilot
Guest
I’m pretty sure that if you’re with your wife and thinking about your wife, and you complete the marital act in the normal way, it’s not lust.
I sure hope I’m right about this one, 'cause I’m in a heap 'a trouble if I’m not.http://forums.catholic-questions.org/images/icons/icon12.gif
I sure hope I’m right about this one, 'cause I’m in a heap 'a trouble if I’m not.http://forums.catholic-questions.org/images/icons/icon12.gif
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BLB_Oregon
Guest
Hmmm. I don’t know. I still think that if you’d expect her reaction, upon reading your mind, to be “YOU PIG!” followed by rolling over and refusing to have anything to do with you, that’s still lust.
The antidote, though, isn’t a cat-o-nine-tails. It is to put a more appropriate regard for your wife in place of regarding her as an object of self-indulgence. I think this is within the ability of most husbands.
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surfinpure
Guest
I agree. A healthy desire for intimacy with your own wife during the time before proper intercourse is natural. If there is a desire for anyone else, or if the desire moves into fantasies that take you away from the experience at hand, that is a different issue.
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misericordie
Guest
PASSIONATE about the wife would seem better.
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Katie1723
Guest
'scuse me, sir…but this is your wife…aren’t you supposed to “lust” after her??
~ Kathy ~
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trailblazer
Guest
I’d be more concerned if you lacked desires for your spouse
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chevalier
Guest
Yeah, but desire =/= lust. I agree with BLB on this one. Basically, it comes down to what matters more in the act: the wife or sex. But what BLB said is going to work better in practice.
After my canon law classes, I would tie lust to the so called onanisticus usus matrimonii. Masturbatory use of marriage, in free translation. We would probably all agree that when a man sleeps with his wife but sees his favourite actress’ face instead of the wife’s, it’s adultery in heart. Onanisticus usus would be if there were no face in his heart, using this metaphor. That kind of sex doesn’t even count as consummation of marriage.
After my canon law classes, I would tie lust to the so called onanisticus usus matrimonii. Masturbatory use of marriage, in free translation. We would probably all agree that when a man sleeps with his wife but sees his favourite actress’ face instead of the wife’s, it’s adultery in heart. Onanisticus usus would be if there were no face in his heart, using this metaphor. That kind of sex doesn’t even count as consummation of marriage.
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Katie1723
Guest
Sorry fellas, but I would bet my last dollar that most men have had “thoughts” at one time or another about their wives. Goodness, y’all are human are’t you? Or just ashamed to admit it?
~ Kathy ~
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chevalier
Guest
Nothing wrong about having thoughts about the wife! But it had better be “she and I making love” and “I having sex with her”. Notice the difference between “she and I” and “I with her”, as well as between “making love” and “having sex”, not like “having sex” always has to be a bad expression but just to point things out a bit more clearly.
Nothing wrong with liking sex, looking forward to it and all. Even if you aren’t married but hope to, it’s still nothing bad to anticipate it. What’s bad is making a tool of our own gratification out of other people. Not like we aren’t actually supposed to strive for the satisfaction of the spouse or to try to be as satisfied as we can.
But we don’t need to exaggerate. “Come, beautiful!” is somewhat better than “Let us now physically express our union, bearing in mind the unitive and procreative purpose of the conjugal act here to take place.”
Nothing wrong with liking sex, looking forward to it and all. Even if you aren’t married but hope to, it’s still nothing bad to anticipate it. What’s bad is making a tool of our own gratification out of other people. Not like we aren’t actually supposed to strive for the satisfaction of the spouse or to try to be as satisfied as we can.
But we don’t need to exaggerate. “Come, beautiful!” is somewhat better than “Let us now physically express our union, bearing in mind the unitive and procreative purpose of the conjugal act here to take place.”
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Mijoy2
Guest
Do we differentiate sexual desire with lust? What is the definition of lust?
Having sex without sexual desire is not only ridiculous, it is physically impossible.
Having sex without sexual desire is not only ridiculous, it is physically impossible.
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Black_Jaque
Guest
I read this with interest.
I gather from people’s testimony that lust is not a healthy aspect of marital relations. Desire on the other hand is. Therefore lust and desire are not the same.
Is it possible to distinguish the two by asking, “When you fantasize, are you stimulating your spouse? Does the fantasy include your spouse’s climax? or is the fantasy all about your own stimulation and satisfaction?”
BLB-Oregon, I like your litmus test. Perhaps I would add, 4)Huh? I didn’t even notice something was wrong. Your thoughts should be on your spouse.
I gather from people’s testimony that lust is not a healthy aspect of marital relations. Desire on the other hand is. Therefore lust and desire are not the same.
Is it possible to distinguish the two by asking, “When you fantasize, are you stimulating your spouse? Does the fantasy include your spouse’s climax? or is the fantasy all about your own stimulation and satisfaction?”
BLB-Oregon, I like your litmus test. Perhaps I would add, 4)Huh? I didn’t even notice something was wrong. Your thoughts should be on your spouse.
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surfinpure
Guest
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Shameless
Guest
But isn’t lust one of the 7 deadly sins?, If I’m lusting after my wife am I not treating her as an object? I love her and I don’t want to be doing anything wrong.
Katie1723 said:
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tcay584
Guest
You might ponder whether you are thrilled at giving yourself to her (and her response to you), or thrilled at getting something from her. I think strong sexual feelings are an awesome thing God has given us for our spouses, but if you’re focusing on the pleasure you can get instead of the pleasure you can give…that could be problematic.
Regards,
Jennifer
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cynic
Guest
you get pleasure from giving so it all works out. Conservatives need to be clearer on what defines lust as opposed to healthy desire. I would have thought lust involves degrading the other, rather than giving pleasure to, but then the dictionary defines it as “strong sexual desire” which doesn’t need to be bad.
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surfinpure
Guest
And thank God we have more than Merriam-Webster upon which to rely for accurate interpretation of sin!
But I agree that “strong sexual desire” in and of itself is not evil. It’s a design by our merciful Creator who no doubt thought it necessary for getting us to procreate.I’m not sure what you mean by “Conservatives” (Orthodox, maybe?), but I do believe there needs to be a clear distinction between healthy desire for one’s own spouse and lust. I believe that’s what we’re all trying to nail down here.
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