M theory and the Soul

[heisenburg]

Wild Tangent… And Just Musings from someone who has a little too much time to think…
If its wrong or Heretical… just let me know. Like i said, just musings and nothing more

Thoughts are welcome.

So, from my understanding nothing in science can contradict God…
I think that is safe to say…

There is also a flip side, God commanded certain things in the OT that they would not understand at the time, but from hindsight we can see the importance… Example. They were not allowed to eat pigs or shellfish. To the Jewish people of the time… it would have been a mystery as to why. However, we can understand now why such a command was important. Cooking methods of the time would not have properly killed off potential bacteria that infest these animals to such a high degree. IOW, God was protecting the people from something they had no concept of…

Proof of God if you ask me

Anyway… to the Main point…

The Nature of the Soul and how it could possibly exist. Using Science…

I was watching something about a subject I had always found very interesting. It is a very new theory, and one that can… well… if true… boggle the mind to the nth degree. Its called M theory (or Brane Theory).

Though I beg you to do research on what it is before commenting, basically, it comes down this. Our universe exists on an 11th dimensional ‘membrane’ we have no concept of it because it is not a in field of reference we have ANY notion of (sorta like telling a 2 dimensional stick figure about a 3 dimensional object). Anyway… there were some repercussions to this theory. Parallel Universes. Each with their own set of Physical Laws. Our universe (for example) was created when to other ‘Branes’ Collided, creating what scientists call the Big Bang.

A second aspect to this very odd theory, is that these Multiple Universes are EXTREMLY close to ours… i think it said some where on the order of 1/100000000000000000000 mm away. Again it gets back to the 2-d stick figure… if you draw a second stick figure on a separate piece of paper, and then put that paper on top of the other, the two will NOT know each other exists, despite how close.

The idea came to me then that 1) if the branes can interact (they can because according to theory they created the Big Bang) and 2) we will have no knowledge about it because it exists in a plan we have no concept of, is it not therefor possible that the soul exists in a Bran (also created by God) that exists in exactly the same space we do, the Soul is merely our counterpart, but integrally connected in the ‘Spirit’ Brane. It is also then possible to have branes where time does not exist, people can live forever a brane of intense separation from god, and one that cannot allow sin (because it violates THat branes physics) All these things are now possible.

ANyway… Brane theory is just a theory that happens to fit the facts (as they understand them) it may change. But if true… makes me go… Hmmmm

Anyway… comments, questions…

 

[JimG]

I think you are trying to make M-theory do more than it can handle. The soul, like the angels and God himself, is a non-material entity, with no extension in space. It is however, possible, and correct, to say that the soul “exists in exactly the same space we do,” because when speaking of a soul’s “location,” we can say that it, like any spiritual entity, is where it acts. And it acts as the animating force of the body. Body and soul are so closely united that it cannot in fact be “dissected out” of the body except by death.

Without respect to colliding branes, M-theory started out by positing that we in fact exist in a world of not three but ten spatial dimensions. These spatial dimensions were thought to be curled up so tightly that we could not directly perceive them.

By the way, something for materialists to consider: Elementary particles were once thought to be point particles, of zero dimension. Now, it is thought that, if string theory or M-theory is correct, the basic elements of matter may be either 1-dimensional strings or two-dimensional branes.

Now it seems to me that no one can actually experience or perceive any object of less than three dimensions—i.e. solid objects. Even a stick man drawn on paper is in reality 3 dimensional graphite for us to be able to perceive it. How many one or two dimensional objects does it take to build a solid object? A line has an infinite number of points; and between each point, an infinite number can still be placed. A plane has an infinite number of lines, and is still not a sold object.

And what are branes (or strings) made of, anyway?

 

[mchale]

Well, Branes are made of energy E=MC^2 and all that .

Honestly though, I wouldn’t worry about M-theory yet. At the moment all variations on M-theory and string theory are hypothesis that are compelling mathematically, but which make absolutely no new testable predictions that are not already covered by existing theories. Until such testable predictions are made I will reserve judgement on it.

I agree though that it is probably foolish of us to try to define heaven and hell as physical realms, even if they are realms the exist completely outside our Universe.

–
Bill

 

[heisenburg]

Yea… i figured it was still too ‘new’ of an idea to really mean anything… Plus, I agree… It really doesn’t matter if there is a physically testable component to Heaven/Hell/Soul/etc…

Just a lay persons theory on a theory thats still in conjecture

In Christ

 

[mchale]

One other thought about brane theory. The whole idea of branes colliding being the cause of the Big Bang is actually an attempt by some scientists to overcome the great intellectual discomfort they have in the fact that the Big Bang appears to suggest that the Universe was created ex-nihilo. Essentially they are hoping that if they can extend science outside of our natural world, they can effectively undermine philosophical positions that suggest God exists. Obviously, if the theory was supported by evidence and it developed as a result of the theory (like the Big Band developed from General Relativity) then it would have to be taken seriously, but right now it is all speculation.

–
Bill

 

[JimG]

Well, Branes are made of energy E=MC^2 and all that .

Fair enough. But “energy” always gets delivered in some specific material form. The electric company might call themselves an energy company, but they are really selling me electrons moving back and forth in a wire. But if the electron is a zero-dimensional particle, what’s really moving in that wire? Can a material entity without spatial extension have any real world effect?

Aristotle thought that matter was infinitely divisible. That idea was superceded by atomic theory, which originally at least thought of atoms as tiny small round hard objects which could not be divided further. (But how is an object with spatial extension immune from further subdivision?)

Particle physicists proceeded to abundantly subdivide the supposed point particles. Have we gotten to the final subdivision yet? I’m beginning to think that Aristotle had a point. But physics doesn’t like matter (or energy) which can be infinitely subdivided.

 

[mchale]

Fair enough. But “energy” always gets delivered in some specific material form. The electric company might call themselves an energy company, but they are really selling me electrons moving back and forth in a wire. But if the electron is a zero-dimensional particle, what’s really moving in that wire? Can a material entity without spatial extension have any real world effect?

Well I am not sure I would exactly say that an electron is zero-dimensional. Otherwise it would be alot easier for the nuclei of atoms to collide . That being said, the basic method of energy transfer is actually the photon. It has the properties of a particle and a wave; I imagine that dual nature is what inspired the concept of strings in the first place.

 

[heisenburg]

My understanding as limited as it may be is that matter in its simples form is nothing more than a complex wave packet of energy. It is that Packet that gives ‘matter’ the smallest particles their shae, form and properties (remember back in my physics days of calculating the packet wavelength of a base ball as something like 10 ^(-70) meters.

This also may mean that at some point, matter can be cut no smaller and will decay into pure energy. back to E=mc^2

Anyway…