Making a parish more traditional

[Mrs_Sally]

I feel there is no reason that a church has done away with devotions like the novenas and the holy hours. Those have been and should be part and parcel of the church.

As for saying the Rosary before the mass, I am always wary of this. No, I have nothing against the Rosary at all, in fact on the contrary it is a favorite prayer. But to say them before the mass, in my view, has never been very considerate especially to those who want quietness before the mass. Sometimes the precious time before the mass is often distracted by people making announcement or asking the congregations to practice the hymns. There should be enforced quietness before the mass for people to prepare themselves sufficiently for the mass proper.

I agree. The way we do this in my parish is that the rosary starts half an hour before Sunday Mass, so that there is usually 10 minutes or a bit more of silence before Mass. We do not practice music or make announcements before Mass.

The rosary is said after the later morning daily Masses (no one is around to say the rosary before or after the 6:15AM Mass. )

 

[Mrs_Sally]

So surprise! I’m a Traditional Catholic!

:thumbsup:

Glad to hear it! I also attend mostly only the OF since Mass is so very reverant and beautiful at my home parish. I do think it is entirely possible for a parish to support many traditional devotions, have good religious education, be reverant and orthodox, and only offer the OF form of the Mass.

We do attend the EF, and it is offered thoughout our diocese, but it is a “special occasion” Mass for us. Kinda like you don’t serve Beef Bourguignon for dinner every night.

 

[ijf90]

There is a small rural church that we regularly attend due to its close proximity to our house. This parish over a period of about 7 years went from being guitar-strumming, bingo-focused, and essentially confession-less to now offering a Traditional Latin Mass every Saturday morning (and goals for a Sunday TLM), is moving the tabernacle back to center, and obtaining a St. Joesph statue for the Epistle side.

The best way to make a parish more traditional is, undoubtedly, prayer. Regardless of the parishoners’ “traditionalism” or lack thereof, if the whole parish is strongly united in prayer for the strength and improvement of your church, amazing things can happen, particularly if it is through parish Eucharistic Adoration.

Here are some things that come to my mind…

1. Pray fervently for your intention.
2. Encourage your pastor (let him know you appreciate his ministry and highlight things such as any chanting, Latin, etc. he uses in the Mass because of its beauty and reverence).
3. Exposition of the Blessed Sacrament and Benediction
4. Increse respect and reverence for the Holy Eucharist (By any and all means…Ciborium and Tabernacle veils, Communion patens, receiving Communion on tounge and while kneeling, eliminating lay distributors etc.)
5. Confessions before and after Masses (mostly before, but also after for any late-comers)
6. Obtaining Traditional Chuch Items (Statuary, Altar Bells, Communion Patens, Ciborium Veils, Tabernacle Veils, Altar Crucifix and Candlesticks, Altar Card sets, Missal Stand, Censer, traditional vestments, etc., it’s great to present them as gifts. It’s not polite to refuse a gift, but if your priest doesn’t want it, tell him it is just a gift for the parish and it can be kept in the Sacristy. This way your parish will have the items needed for implementing the TLM)
7. Tabernacle in the center focal point of Sanctuary. (If your parish’s Tabernacle is not in a high altar, or is not in the center, or is moved in a side room, etc., kindly express to your pastor how much you miss having the Jesus under the form of the Sacred Species present in the center of the Sanctuary.)
8. Recitation of Leonine Prayers after Mass. (If your preist doesn’t want to lead the recitation of the prayers, ask if the faithful could recite it themselves aloud after mass).
9. Define the Sanctuary from the Nave (altar rails are the best way to do this).
10. Focusing the choir on Gregorian Chant
11. General church beautification (paintings, statuary, brass candlesticks, etc., again these are great to present as gifts).

As someone else previously mentioned, remember Summorum Pontificum! Express to your pastor that there are parishoners devoted to the Extraordinary Form of the Mass.

 

[Cranch]

In parishes, where there is a stable group of faithful who adhere to the earlier liturgical tradition, the pastor should willingly accept their requests to celebrate the Mass according to the rite of the Roman Missal published in 1962, and ensure that the welfare of these faithful harmonises with the ordinary pastoral care of the parish, under the guidance of the bishop in accordance with canon 392, avoiding discord and favouring the unity of the whole Church. —Sum. Pont. 5 §1

If a group of lay faithful, as mentioned in art. 5 §1, has not obtained satisfaction to their requests from the pastor, they should inform the diocesan bishop. The bishop is strongly requested to satisfy their wishes. If he cannot arrange for such celebration to take place, the matter should be referred to the Pontifical Commission “Ecclesia Dei”.—Sum. Pont. 7

This is not a lay-lead activity.

The process of bringing a Latin Mass to a parish most certainly can be led by the laity as highlighted above.

There must be a priest trained and willing to say the EF and the Mass schedule of the parish must allow for an additional Mass or there must be as many willing to attend the EF as would be displaced if an OF were removed from the schedule.

None of this is in Summorum Pontificum. I read your phrase “There must be a priest trained and willing” to imply a currently qualified celebrant, whereas all that is needed in this regard is a priest willing to train. The following requirement is present in the Motu Proprio:
Priests who use the Missal of Bl. John XXIII must be qualified to do so and not juridically impeded. —Sum. Pont. 5 §4
This has been spelled out in the 2011 instruction Universae Ecclesiae on implementing Summorum Pontificum:
20. With respect to the question of the necessary requirements for a priest to be held idoneus (“qualified”) to celebrate in the forma extraordinaria, the following is hereby stated:

a.) Every Catholic priest who is not impeded by Canon Law is to be considered idoneus (“qualified”) for the celebration of the Holy Mass in the forma extraordinaria.

b.) Regarding the use of the Latin language, a basic knowledge is necessary, allowing the priest to pronounce the words correctly and understand their meaning.

c.) Regarding knowledge of the execution of the Rite, priests are presumed to be qualified who present themselves spontaneously to celebrate the forma extraordinaria, and have celebrated it previously.

1. Ordinaries are asked to offer their clergy the possibility of acquiring adequate preparation for celebrations in the forma extraordinaria.

Given that “stable group of faithful,” the rest is up to the pastor or failing that, the bishop to do his best to “to satisfy their wishes” for as stated in Universae Ecclesiae:

1. The Motu Proprio Summorum Pontificum constitutes an important expression of the Magisterium of the Roman Pontiff and of his munus of regulating and ordering the Church’s Sacred Liturgy. The Motu Proprio manifests his solicitude as Vicar of Christ and Supreme Pastor of the Universal Church, and has the aim of:

a.) offering to all the faithful the Roman Liturgy in the Usus Antiquior, considered as a precious treasure to be preserved;

b.) effectively guaranteeing and ensuring the use of the forma extraordinaria for all who ask for it, given that the use of the 1962 Roman Liturgy is a faculty generously granted for the good of the faithful and therefore is to be interpreted in a sense favourable to the faithful who are its principal addressees;

c.) promoting reconciliation at the heart of the Church.

 

[airforcemom]

At my little church (average of 85-95 attendance) we try hard to get participation in various activities but it just appears no one is interested in doing more than a Sunday Mass. For daily Mass we average 12. Unfortunately for the Immaculate Conception we had 10 - very disappointing since it was on Saturday so many people were off of work. Our priest handles two parishes so whatever is done outside of Mass has to be handled by a parishioner. If it is something he has to do he is there to do his part - we have an All Hallows’ Eve Mass in our cemetery he does the Mass - same for All Saints’ Day. I lead the Rosary every Sunday before Mass - at our little church it is done before Mass unfortunately to keep some of the talkers quiet - would probably have the same number participating if it were held following Mass but no one would have any quiet time to pray if it weren’t done before Mass - sometimes I start with only one person in the church. We have been consolidated with another church and it amazes how much they talk before, during and after Mass. I know our population is much smaller following Katrina but at the same time considering what we went through Katrina 7+ years ago you would think more people would at least be at Sunday Mass thanking the Lord for what we have managed to salvage and be able to start over. In looking at the inside of our little church it looks very traditional and most of us would love the altar rails back to be even more traditional. Until 2003 we had a priest who always had at least one prayer in Latin - now none although our organist said it is coming so I’m waiting along a few others for that great day.

 

[Mrs_Sally]

I’d really like to keep this to a discussion of specific devotional practices and parish activites that lay people can introduce to their parish irrespective of the form of the Mass.

I think it would be very helpful to share lessons learned and ideas for things like what are Ember Days and what do you do during them.

I realize that the parish priest will have to be involved in many things, but as ijf90 points out, that involvement can be encouraged by positive steps on the part of the laity.

 

[SuscipeMeDomine]

Mrs. Sally, I just want to say that I really like your approach.

We all have things that we would like in our parishes that aren’t currently there.

Some people whine about what they don’t have. Some people demand what they want.

I think it’s much better if we can look to activities that we can do to make things just a little more the way we’d like them to be.

Changes won’t happen overnight, but bit by bit things will improve.

Kudos.

 

[Mrs_Sally]

Thank you SuscipeMeDomine! I am very encouraged by that.

I love my parish and I am always disheartened to hear what others are going through in parishes were faith is lax and devotional practices are non-existent. I agree that the little by little approach is often the only one we can take, but things can gradually improve!

Let’s all pray that these baby steps will improve parishes all across CAF.

 

[Reuben_J]

I agree. The way we do this in my parish is that the rosary starts half an hour before Sunday Mass, so that there is usually 10 minutes or a bit more of silence before Mass. We do not practice music or make announcements before Mass.

The rosary is said after the later morning daily Masses (no one is around to say the rosary before or after the 6:15AM Mass. )

I don’t mind the rosary but time should be given for the quiet before the mass. Our church had taken a cue on this and the rosary would be finished at least a good ten minutes before the mass starts.

 

[Holly3278]

We had a newly ordained priest become our Associate Pastor a few years ago. He’s no longer at our parish but he did help our parish to become more traditional. The sanctuary was carpeted before he came but he had the carpet removed and now there is a wood floor to the sanctuary. I heard that it is the same wood floor that was there when the parish was built. He also had some nice chandeliers installed in place of the other lights. So now the parish has a more traditional look to it.

 

[Rich_C]

Seriously, I think I’m very spoiled. I take for granted all these wonderful activities and practices, and I’ll try not to be so cavalier anymore. I find it sad that there are parishes where none or very few of these things are regularly done.

I love my parish and I am always disheartened to hear what others are going through in parishes were faith is lax and devotional practices are non-existent.

These comments really touched me. For so many Catholics, the “norm” is a truly irreverent Mass (I don’t mean preferences they don’t like) and a dying diocese, and too often I’ve seen them turn to CAF for support and be told they have a bad attitude by people who don’t seem to realize how bad it can be. Thank you.

 

[missadeangelis]

I’d really like to keep this to a discussion of specific devotional practices and parish activites that lay people can introduce to their parish irrespective of the form of the Mass.

I think it would be very helpful to share lessons learned and ideas for things like what are Ember Days and what do you do during them.

I realize that the parish priest will have to be involved in many things, but as ijf90 points out, that involvement can be encouraged by positive steps on the part of the laity.

IMHO, little substantial progress will be made until people (all parishioners) are better catechized. Holy Hour adoration is a wonderful and beautiful practice and at the OF parish I attend we have it once a month. It should be a packed house, but instead it’s usually just a handful. The Priest places the monstrance with the Blessed Sacrament on the altar near the end of the Mass and everybody is asked to leave quietly from Mass. That doesn’t happen. People burst out talking and joking in the Church and many if not most people bother to acknowledge the presence of our Lord and genuflect with one knee, never mind both knees as is proper when the Blessed Sacrament is exposed. My point is that I think it’s an issue of belief in the real presence and that can be helped along by solid catechesis. People don’t know or understand the basics of their faith in many cases, so why would they care about devotions or any extra effort during the week? Folks have to crawl before they walk. Just my two cents…

mda

 

[DSbarra]

Hello,
I became a Catholic in the 1980’s because the ritual of the mass really moved me and made me feel the presence of God. I enjoyed the traditional aspects of mass but I have seen them fall to the wayside and it has really affected my enjoyment. No more beautiful canting, no more bells, no more beautiful music. Now I feel like I’m watching Godspell. The music is too secular and it just feels too casual. I used to know mass by heart but now it seems to change so much that I feel like a stranger and I have quit going. I think this is very sad. Please, can we bring back the old traditions?

 

[Cat]

Hello,
I became a Catholic in the 1980’s because the ritual of the mass really moved me and made me feel the presence of God. I enjoyed the traditional aspects of mass but I have seen them fall to the wayside and it has really affected my enjoyment. No more beautiful canting, no more bells, no more beautiful music. Now I feel like I’m watching Godspell. The music is too secular and it just feels too casual. I used to know mass by heart but now it seems to change so much that I feel like a stranger and I have quit going. I think this is very sad. Please, can we bring back the old traditions?

Please, can we bring back the people who used to attend Mass?

We can’t say, “I’ll come back when the Mass pleases me.” That isn’t an option for Catholics.

Holy Mother Church teaches that attendance at weekly Mass is an obligation, and that those who deliberately choose to stay away from Mass, especially for reasons like yours (don’t like the music, etc.), are in danger of committing mortal sin.

Come back to the Mass, become a serious Catholic who is involved in your parish, and then you will be in a good position to lobby your parish to bring back some of the traditional practices that you miss.

I would suggest that you and others like you do a little searching for a more traditional Mass. If you live in a small town with only one parish, you may not find one. But if you live in a bigger town or small city with multiple parishes, I’ll bet there is at least one parish that has a Mass that you can live with week after week. And even if you can’t find the Perfect Parish, avoiding Mass isn’t an option for Catholics.

 

[paperwight66]

. many if not most people bother to acknowledge the presence of our Lord and genuflect with one knee, never mind both knees as is proper when the Blessed Sacrament is exposed. …

mda

Actually, the requirement to genuflect on both knees was removed in the 1970’s.

If you think about it, it didn’t make much sense to distinguish between the Blessed Sacrament in the monstrance, and the Blessed Sacrament in the Tabernacle. It is still the same Blessed Sacrament. So either both knees for both situations or one knee for both situations would be more logical. Evidently the Church went with one knee for both, as being more practical.

 

[Justin_Swanton]

I can put forward two suggestions:

1. Evening/weekend talks by someone, ideally the priest, on fundamental, Faith-related subjects. Don Bosco did it with his boys by recounting his dreams. I’m suggesting something similar - something between a sermon and a catechism lesson, that brings home the reality of a truth of the Faith and its consequences for us. Once a week.
2. If possible, a local pilgrimage. This involves a journey out to the country where a friendly parishioner has set up an outdoor stations and Marian shrine on his smallholding (unless something like this already exists as a Church property). A change is as good as a spiritual rest, and spending a Sunday afternoon doing a Stations, lunch, Holy Hour, Talk (as described above) and commented rosary is a spiritual tonic like none other. A Jesuit priest did this with us in Zimbabwe when I was a teen and I never forgot them. Once a month or so.

 

[Mrs_Sally]

Please, can we bring back the people who used to attend Mass?

We can’t say, “I’ll come back when the Mass pleases me.” That isn’t an option for Catholics.

Holy Mother Church teaches that attendance at weekly Mass is an obligation, and that those who deliberately choose to stay away from Mass, especially for reasons like yours (don’t like the music, etc.), are in danger of committing mortal sin.

Come back to the Mass, become a serious Catholic who is involved in your parish, and then you will be in a good position to lobby your parish to bring back some of the traditional practices that you miss.

I would suggest that you and others like you do a little searching for a more traditional Mass. If you live in a small town with only one parish, you may not find one. But if you live in a bigger town or small city with multiple parishes, I’ll bet there is at least one parish that has a Mass that you can live with week after week. And even if you can’t find the Perfect Parish, avoiding Mass isn’t an option for Catholics.

I think this is a very insightful view. Which came first? I think based on the data I’ve seen, people began to skip Mass before the changes to parishes and Masses began.

I also agree strongly that those who are actually on the ground trying to improve things don’t need to hear that once things are the way someone else imagines they used to be when the world was perfect that that other person will come back to Mass.

We are all obligated to go to Mass every Sunday. Whatever the local Mass is like, that is where we should be. Once we are there every week and see how things truly are (good, bad, indifferent) and are praying and working to improve what we can (which isn’t everything because as laity we don’t have that responsibility).

We also need to carefully discern our reasons. Music choices, poor homilies, noisy congregations and the like are absolutely not a reason to miss Mass. If there are serious problems at a parish though, rather than throwing up our hands and walking off, it behooves us to stay and do what we can to help rectify the situation.

 

[Mrs_Sally]

I can put forward two suggestions:

1. Evening/weekend talks by someone, ideally the priest, on fundamental, Faith-related subjects. Don Bosco did it with his boys by recounting his dreams. I’m suggesting something similar - something between a sermon and a catechism lesson, that brings home the reality of a truth of the Faith and its consequences for us. Once a week.
2. If possible, a local pilgrimage. This involves a journey out to the country where a friendly parishioner has set up an outdoor stations and Marian shrine on his smallholding (unless something like this already exists as a Church property). A change is as good as a spiritual rest, and spending a Sunday afternoon doing a Stations, lunch, Holy Hour, Talk (as described above) and commented rosary is a spiritual tonic like none other. A Jesuit priest did this with us in Zimbabwe when I was a teen and I never forgot them. Once a month or so.

These are great suggestions. Especially the idea of a one-day retreat to a local pilgramage site - or to one created as you described. A program like that can be organized and run by parishioners with Father’s approval, but doesn’t require the priests to do all the heavy lifting!

 

[mpn_123]

Promoting the sacramentals, both to encourage the use of these items in spiritual growth and warfare and to educate about the traditions of the church.

At a TLM parish I go to, they emphasize the sacramentals a lot. They bless wine on St. John’s feast day; water, chalk, gold, and incense on Epiphany; candles on Candlemas, throats on the feast day of St. Blaise, herbs on the feast of the Assumption, and more…

These sort of things continue old traditions and get people in the door.

 

[paperwight66]

I have never heard of those particular customs. Can you explain them?

(I have also never come across the chalk etc. for the Epiphany in real life, but have heard about it through these boards).

Blessing of candles at Candlemas, and throats on St. Blaise’s day, our exclusively OF parish does practise, however.