Making out

[thewanderer]

At least such as I noted above by nature “tends” toward such…

I do not claim per se that such kissing is “always” having the normal effect. There could for example I suppose be some couples who are on rather super un- sensitive and not find any “effect” in such. And in such a case they may very well take such as “simply gross” and not seek to engage in such anyhow.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bookcat
At least such as I noted above by nature “tends” toward such…

I do not claim per se that such kissing is “always” having the normal effect. There could for example I suppose be some couples who are on rather super un- sensitive and not find any “effect” in such. And in such a case they may very well take such as “simply gross” and not seek to engage in such anyhow.

Well if the couple is as described --are in among the super -un-sensitive crowd – and like to do gross things for a pass time…

You could also perhaps play a spitting game with some non-toxic tobacco like substance (spitting into a spit-patoone)–might be more entertaining…

Bookcat, as soon as you admit of the possibility of this not being immoral for even one unmarried couple then your previous argument makes no sense. What about couples in between, what about a couple who is as aroused by this as most couples are openmouthed kissing, or a close intimate hug, etc etc. You can’t go around making universal claims about the morality of something and then allow an exception. It is either always wrong, or its not. If its always wrong that is because of the nature of the act. If its not always wrong then it is because of the circumstances. Me, and Deb and Jimmy have argued that this can be moral depending on the circumstances, you seemed like you were arguing it can never be moral because of the nature of the act. Once you allow an exception like this then you have just agreed with me, deb, and jimmy, at least in principle. So we are all agreed then?

 

[einna]

Come on man. Are you being serious?

Really, Evania this thread has been pretty tame to the some of the ones I have read. You can’t let things people say :shrug:bother you when you are sure how you feel about an issue.

 

[Evania]

Seriously, I feel like I should run to confession first thing in the morning and every night before I go to bed. Then I go to work and many of the priest tell me how ludicrous some of the things that are said here are. They cannot believe some Catholics are so misguided.

So what? There are priests that openly state that contraception is okay among other things. Opinions vary even in the priesthood. Yes, this thread is about kissing, but the point is that each side that holds ANY view, the other side usually says the other is misguided. :slapfight:

 

[jimmy]

I take it that you do feel it is okay to inflame the other side by personal insults? That’s usually a sign that you have nothing more substantial to add to the debate.

First of all, you keep calling this a debate now. You already rejected that idea when you supported bookcat’s ‘providing sources’. I tried to make it an actual dialogue, but you didn’t want that.

I told you my approach already.

Third you have the sense of humor of a stone, and consequently your ability to understand modes of speech and genres is inhibited.

 

[Evania]

Really, Evania this thread has been pretty ta
me to the some of the ones I have read. You can’t let things people say :shrug:bother you when you are sure how you feel about an issue.

But what purpose is there to inflame? Just for entertainment or boredom?

 

[Evania]

First of all, you keep calling this a debate now. You already rejected that idea when you supported bookcat’s ‘providing sources’. I tried to make it an actual dialogue, but you didn’t want that.

I told you my approach already.

Third you have the sense of humor of a stone, and consequently your ability to understand modes of speech and genres is inhibited.

Or…It could be that I believe in treating others with respect.

 

[thewanderer]

So what? There are priests that openly state that contraception is okay among other things. Opinions vary even in the priesthood. Yes, this thread is about kissing, but the point is that each side that holds ANY view, the other side usually says the other is misguided. :slapfight:

haha, too true!!

Which is why its so important to keep in mind that anything not taught by official Church doctrine is opinion which you are allowed to either agree or disagree with, so long as you keep in mind and accept actual church teachings, honestly seek out the truth, and are willing to submit to the church if she ever decides that you are wrong.

 

[einna]

Wait, so you are saying that there are situations where making out is not sinful? So I was wrong and you weren’t arguing based on the nature of the act? Now I am more confused than ever.

I don’t think this has been brought up and I fear my asking will set of even more unbelievable answers, but is closed mouth kissing OK? Can people that are attracted to each other not be aroused by closed mouth kissing? Again, I think arousal is a normal human feeling, it is what you do with it that might be the sin.

 

[Evania]

I truly see your point Jimmy. In Bookcat’s defense though, I have seen him present his thoughts on the subject in addition to the links. Like he said, when dealing with Truth, you can’t really reinvent the wheel.

This is what I said. It’s kind of different than what you presented, but hey what’s facts when you’re dealing with someone who only wants to inflame?

 

[Evania]

haha, too true!!

Which is why its so important to keep in mind that anything not taught by official Church doctrine is opinion which you are allowed to either agree or disagree with, so long as you keep in mind and accept actual church teachings, honestly seek out the truth, and are willing to submit to the church if she ever decides that you are wrong.

Couldn’t agree more!

 

[einna]

So what? There are priests that openly state that contraception is okay among other things. Opinions vary even in the priesthood. Yes, this thread is about kissing, but the point is that each side that holds ANY view, the other side usually says the other is misguided. :slapfight:

I have never used the word misguided on this site before because I don’t like when others use it, but some of the things people have said on other post were simply wrong even though they believed it came straight from the Pope.

I didn’t say anyone was misguided in this post, I have only stated my opinion and never claimed to be right on this issue.

 

[Evania]

I have never used the word misguided on this site before because I don’t like when others use it, but some of the things people have said on other post were simply wrong even though they believed it came straight from the Pope.

I didn’t say anyone was misguided in this post, I have only stated my opinion and never claimed to be right on this issue.

Sorry for the confusion. I was not referring to you. I was referring to the priests that you said that they couldn’t believe how misguided some posters are on here.

 

[Bookcat]

The Catholic Answers Apologist put it well regarding French Kissing:

“…this type of kissing, which prepares the body for sexual relations, is inappropriate to the chastity expected of single people and could possibly constitute grave matter.”

 

[thewanderer]

The Catholic Answers Apologist put it well regarding French Kissing:

“…this type of kissing, which prepares the body for sexual relations, is inappropriate to the chastity expected of single people and could possibly constitute grave matter.”

Bookcat, I’m not trying to win, I just really don’t understand what you believe, I would appreciate it if you would answer my last question, but if you wont, seeing as you have admitted that there are occasions where such kissing is not a sin between unmarried people then I will be forced to conclude that you agree with me that it is not always sinful, and whether or not it is sinful depends on the particular circumstances. Now, we may disagree on what circumstances make it moral/immoral, but at least we agree on the main point, that it is the circumstances that make it sinful since it is not sinful in itself between unmarried people. I am more than willing to discuss how the different circumstances affect the morality of the act if you are interested. And again, I am truly not disccussing this with you to try and ‘prove a point’ or anything like that, I just really enjoy discussing things like this, it is interesting to hear what other people have to say and why they believe what they do and the process of explaining ones own point of view makes it easier to help figure out exactly what you actually think, as well as forcing you to look at the scenario from perspectives you might not have thought of previously. Of course, not everyone is like me, so I guess I will have to let my curiousity slide if you don’t reply, but thats ok, it is lent afterall.

 

[Debora123]

I don’t think this has been brought up and I fear my asking will set of even more unbelievable answers, but is closed mouth kissing OK? Can people that are attracted to each other not be aroused by closed mouth kissing? Again, I think arousal is a normal human feeling, it is what you do with it that might be the sin.

Precisely.