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jimkhong
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MJ
This is the merry dance going on prior to the Umno (the enthic-Malay Muslim ruling party) party elections this weekend. The PM is looking to ensure that his people are placed in the appropriate positions and it looks like he is winning. The proof is not what he says now to win elections but rather what he will do after he wins it. While I do believe that he is trying to liberalise the country, I don’t trust his sincerity, some of his methods, the people aroung him or his political competence. Still, he is a darn sight better than the alternatives in Umno.
At present, the press in Malaysia (except the Umno-owned newspapers) are full of comments by legal experts, including Muslims, that the ruling is flawed. This has led one of the state muftis to threaten that Muslims who oppose the ruling could be guilty of apostasy. Interesting, there has been comments in other press elsewhere, including an editorial in UAE, noting the nonsensicality of the ruling. This ruling can only lead to further splits among political Muslims who dominate the political establishment & the Islamic offices on one hand and the more educated moderate Muslims.
My expectations is that the ruling has probably helped the PM’s nominees in the coming elections. After the elections, he will probably move to repair the damage before the Sarawak state elections, where Christians are the majority. The appeal to the Federal court will be heard by judges who are a little more independent (because there is not much more they can get from the government other than maybe titles and consultancy jobs after retirement). A more acceptable compromise will be worked out at the Federal Court and things will continue to limp along as it has been.
But another step would have been taken in wakening up Christian concioussness and the Muslim moderate majority. Interestingly, the more strident responses from the Christian community was not from the Catholics, who brought the legal action, but by Protestants. Over the last 5-6 years, I have seen Protestants taking more active and visible stance in the political sphere particularly to do Christian rights. Even Baptists, who tend to be more religiously insular, have been questioning why they should leave it to the Catholics to do the fighting. I pray that this is also another step towards greater participation in Justice and Peace by Protestants.
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jimkhong
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On behalf of Malaysian Christians, I thank everyone for their support and interest on this issue on this Forum. It is gratifying for us to know that we are part of a world-wide family, on whose prayers we can always count. God bless all of you and God bless his Church in Malaysia.
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dzheremi
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Hey, I resemble that remark!
It really is no kind of victory, however; quite the opposite, in fact, as it reverses an earlier 2009 ruling that allowed Christians the use of the word.The whole thing is stupid anyway, of course. Islam does not own the word (Arab Christians definitely used “Allah” prior to the coming of Islam; see, for instance, Jeffreys 1939, Tremingham 1979, or Rassam 2005). Anyone who says otherwise is likely confusing the appearance of the Christian NT in Arabic with the usage of the word itself. They’re not the same thing.
Malay Christians or Christians of any other non-Arab background should not be punished for the initial success of Muslim proselytizers which brought the word into their language in the first place, nor for the current fear and stupidity which drives modern Muslims into such a frenzy over a loan word. What great faith they must have in their coreligionists to even think that this is a potential problem! As though a Muslim is going to hear the word “Allah” coming from Christians or read it in a Malay Bible and become confused and begin inadvertently worshiping the Holy Trinity. Right.
I wouldn’t mind banning neophyte Western Muslim converts from using that word in their native languages, though…that’s more because that behavior annoys me than to make any theological point, though.
Truth be told, while I have studied Arabic formally and use it as much as is necessary in church to give the appropriate responses, I am at a loss to see how it is supposedly necessary in worship, or some kind of fast-track to communicating with God, as I have read from many Islamic apologists and leaders (including imams of non-Arab extraction). There is an interesting insight in Fr. Mark Gruber OSB’s book on Coptic monasticism Journey Back to Eden in which he relates his surprise at having been asked by HH Pope Shenouda himself to read from the Epistles during a liturgy he attended at the Coptic cathedral. Fr. Gruber noticed that HH was happy to have a native English speaker present, and seemed pleased to have any part of the liturgy said in a language other than Arabic, as Arabic really has no essential relation to the liturgy, so why not do it in English. I wish that Malaysian Muslims weren’t brainwashed into jealously guarding fake Arabness, but what’re ya gonna do…Well, I guess I’m going to keep saying Allah whenever it’s called for, but I don’t live in Malaysia, so… (but who knows; such stupidity could definitely be coming to a court near you even if you live outside of the Muslim world, given the appeasement gymnastics that the West seems determined to win with regard to Muslims’ oh-so-sensitive feelings toward their religion and everything they feel is rightly and exclusively theirs, no matter how stupid the resulting claim is).
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jimkhong
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I once sent my car to be repaired in a workshop - just dents and outside body works. The workshop was run by an ethnic Malay Muslim, who took my rosary down from my rear view mirror while working on it. When he finished, he put it back. Note that he had no reason to work inside the car and so the dangling rosary couldn’t have been distracting his work.Malay Christians or Christians of any other non-Arab background should not be punished for the initial success of Muslim proselytizers which brought the word into their language in the first place, nor for the current fear and stupidity which drives modern Muslims into such a frenzy over a loan word. What great faith they must have in their coreligionists to even think that this is a potential problem! As though a Muslim is going to hear the word “Allah” coming from Christians or read it in a Malay Bible and become confused and begin inadvertently worshiping the Holy Trinity. Right.
I have always wondered whether he felt the rosary was an offense to him. Or that he felt that seeing the rosary could damage his Muslim faith.
By the way, the nationality is Malaysian. The ethnic group is Malay, who by the constitution must be a Muslim to be a Malay. As such, we are Malaysian Christians as Malay Christians would be technically a contradiction in terms.
Thanks anyway for taking interest in our little corner of Christendom.
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dzheremi
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Forgive me, Jimkhong, and thank you for the correction. I was unaware of the constitutional rule that only Muslims may be identified as Malays. I know there are various ethnic groups in Malaysia, but figured that there must be some (ethnic) Malay Christians, as they are the largest single group in the country. Hmm. Shades of Saudi Arabia’s citizenship law… 
I have met Indonesian Christians who identify as just “Indonesian”. Do you know if they have a similar law about who can say they’re what over there? I did not inquire as to if they were Javanese, Sundanese, Malay, etc. because I figured that would be rude. As far as I can tell,“Indonesian” is not an ethnic group, so maybe that’s their way of avoiding any problems if they come from a Muslim background?
I have met Indonesian Christians who identify as just “Indonesian”. Do you know if they have a similar law about who can say they’re what over there? I did not inquire as to if they were Javanese, Sundanese, Malay, etc. because I figured that would be rude. As far as I can tell,“Indonesian” is not an ethnic group, so maybe that’s their way of avoiding any problems if they come from a Muslim background?
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jimkhong
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You are right that Indonesian is not an ethnic group but is a nationality like Malaysian. Indonesian, like East Malaysians, normally do not have a problem with religion (not withstanding some abberation with links to Al Queda). Their ethnic groups are normally of mixed religions. I am not aware of any constitutional definition of any of the ethnic groups.Forgive me, Jimkhong, and thank you for the correction. I was unaware of the constitutional rule that only Muslims may be identified as Malays. I know there are various ethnic groups in Malaysia, but figured that there must be some (ethnic) Malay Christians, as they are the largest single group in the country. Hmm. Shades of Saudi Arabia’s citizenship law…
I have met Indonesian Christians who identify as just “Indonesian”. Do you know if they have a similar law about who can say they’re what over there? I did not inquire as to if they were Javanese, Sundanese, Malay, etc. because I figured that would be rude. As far as I can tell,“Indonesian” is not an ethnic group, so maybe that’s their way of avoiding any problems if they come from a Muslim background?
People on the island of Sumatra are generally Muslims: those from Atjeh (northern tip of Sumatra and first to be converted) are synomymous with Muslims. Those in Java are also predominantly Muslims but the World Christian Encyclopedia (definitive authority on Christian census) do not define most of them as Muslims. Many Javanese Muslims for instance eat pork, at least until recently. There are also many Muslims among the indigenious natives (descendants of those who live in the jungle - many still do) in Indonesian Borneo.
Indonesian Christians are largely found among the richer Javanese, ethnic Chinese and indigenious natives of Indonesian Borneo (particularly those in the north and the interior) and the more outlying islands.
Generally, I treat Indonesians as Muslims (90% of them profess Islam) but treat them as moderate Muslims unless I know otherwise. If they are ethnic Chinese, or rich Javanese or have frizzy hair like Australian Aborigines (possibly indigenious natives), the possibility of them being Christians are higher.
Still, I don’t think you have much to worry about offending them. Unless they are from Atjeh (who have adopted Sharia law in their province), AQ-type extremist (very few in number) or some indigenious native who have just chopped off a Christian head (in the late 90’s there was a tribal war in Indonesian Borneo between head-hunting Christian and Muslim tribes and heads of enemies were displayed on stakes), you shouldn’t worry if any errors arises. Culturally, they are very polite and would not make a fuss even if they are offended, and may indeed lie otherwise.
Muslims in Indonesia outside Atjeh are a tolerant lot. Indonesia have five religions stated in their constitution (Islam, Catholics, Protestants, Hindus and Buddists) with legal prohibitions from any of them trying to convert someone else from another of those 5 religions. Anyone outside of these five are fair game. This contrast with the situation in Malaysia where only Muslims have such legal protection against conversion.
The unifying point in Indonesia is not the race or religion but the language. Generally, the government try to ensure that all adherents of the five religions get to learn their faith. Christians, common among the ruling Javanese class, hold high positions in government.
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dzheremi
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Ah, I see. Thank you for all this information, Jimkhong. I must admit I don’t know much about Christianity in your part of the world, because there is very little presence of Orthodox Christianity there (there is one Coptic church in Melaka, served by a Chinese priest, but it is very new, and very small). I pray that all is well in your country and surrounding region, and that the peaceful relations that you have described are not adversely affected by things like the court ruling discussed in the opening post.
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MartinJordan
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Thanks JimKhong. Appreciate the explanation and your analysis. Something else to ask you regarding the non Catholic Christians’ pro-active stance. Ill follow up on that later.
MJ
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jimkhong
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Now, you are telling me something new about the church in Malaysia. I didn’t even know there is a Coptic community here. The only Eastern churches here that I know previously are Malabarese Syriac churches (Syrian Orthodox and MarThoma). Interesting that there is a Chinese priest there. Thanks for the tip - I must check this out.
Historically, there used to be an Armenian parish in Penang but I think most of them have left. There is still an Armenian parish in Singapore dating back one century. The Armenians get everywhere don’t they?
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dzheremi
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Hahaha. Yes, they do. In that same blog that I linked, you can find an entry about the Armenian Church in Singapore, because the blog-writer went there for services once. Apparently it’s the oldest church in Singapore, and sometimes a Coptic priest flies in from Australia to serve liturgy in that Armenian church for the local Coptic community.
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MartinJordan
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I am from the region and i can tell you it is going well where I live. There is a no tolerance policy for religious intolerance. The Govt keeps a close eye on any extremist views and lets each Faith mind their own teachings while respecting the others.
Good governing is the,best solution.
That said we Catholics here pray for Peace constantly and so far so good.
Meanwhile we also pray for the conversion of Muslims
MJ
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jimkhong
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Thansk dzheremi, I got in touch with the Coptic priest and hope to go down to his church sometime next month.
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